View Full Version : Evp?
During the the Live show of Diggnation in St. Louis Brian provided entertainment and he used EVP or Electronic Voice Phenomenon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_voice_phenomena)
So I'm posing this question to him and to other forum members. What's your take on it? Just part of the show or is there actually something to it?
I ask because there is an Author from my area by the name of Troy Taylor (http://www.prairieghosts.com/) that writes all kinds of books on EVP and Ghost that I read. I know Houdini (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Houdini) has an interesting past with EVP and I just wanted to know your take.
Thanks to all
Aden
lonelygeek
04-10-2008, 10:00 PM
Aden, that's a very interesting topic and hard to sum up in simple posts.
It's not really a scam, per se, but maybe it will be addressed by Brian and Revision3 at some point.
Until then, look at Brian's performing schedule at Shwood.com (http://www.shwood.com) and see when he's performing near you. He does a GREAT lecture on 'Scams, Sasquatch, and the Supernatural'.
shwooddotcom
04-10-2008, 11:24 PM
When I do the EVP Illusion, I really play up the intriguing possibility of EVP, without giving a direct take on it...
But my direct take on it is that (in most cases) EVP is pretty much people seeing a false signal within the noise.
Keep in mind, I'm paid to break bricks over my head, but here's how I see it:
Carl Sagan writes in his book The Demon Haunted World about the importance of babies recognizing faces: A baby that recognizes its mother's face will smile and coo, and the mother will be more likely to take better care of him/her. A baby that doesn't recognize faces (or facelike shapes) at an early age will receive inferior care and will be less likely to survive and reproduce. So there's a powerful evolutionary pressure for humans to recognize faces.
Furthermore, there's no penalty for a false positive: a baby that smiles and coos at shapes that are not actually faces will be no less likely to survive than one that can accurately discern the difference...
So we have a strong incentive to recognize faces, and no disincentive to recognize what aren't faces. And the result? We humans see faces everywhere. we see clouds that look like faces, faces in woodgrains, we see Jesus in a burrito... we even see a face in the moon. By all rights, that random mishmash of craters on our neighbor should look nothing like a face, but sure enough, we can find one in there.
Take a random woodgrain pattern and look... really look for a face in there. You'll find it. But does it mean there are ghosts in your furniture? Probably not. IMHO, same thing with finding shapes and patterns in the white noise of television... especially since we now have "enhancement" tools that essentially allow us to "re-roll" our noise pattern until we find something we like.
More propaganda, if you're interested:
http://skepdic.com/evp.html
tokenuser
04-10-2008, 11:46 PM
I went Ghost Hunting (http://www.hauntedtimes.com/) once with the lunatic fringe here (http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/404589/haunted_carolina_inn_in_chapel_hill.html).
It was a fun night out playing with recording gear (audio and video). People WANT to believe. To the point that people had photos as evidence of something in the room, when in fact it was the IR sensor on someones camera trying to get a lock on the wall (in the dark) to auto focus on.
I have had interesting experiences before that can not be explained, but I am a skeptic.
shwooddotcom
04-11-2008, 12:55 AM
That's the funniest thing, too. I'm a pretty hardcore skeptic, but I'll still get creeped out by 3am sounds.
Who is it that said "I don't believe in ghosts, but i'm afraid of them?"
By the way, I don't know if it was on purpose, but you mentioned side by side that you're a skeptic and have had experiences that you can't explain... I think that's a great statement: as Penn Jillette says in his fire eating speech (http://www.pennandteller.com/sincity/penn-n-teller/articles/fire-eating.html)...
Now I want to make this very clear to you: by "not accepting mystery," I am not talking about scientists, and I am not talking about skeptics. 'Cause I'm a skeptic, and I've always felt that skeptics love the mystery, and that's why they don't want to believe anything. They don't want to have any faith. They either want to have it scientifically proven over and over again, or they want to leave it alone. "We'll get to it. Let it go." The kind of people that cannot accept mystery are the kind of people that, when there's a mystery there, they just believe the first thing they're told for their whole life, or they pretend to have an open mind, so they'll believe anything that's popular that comes along, or they'll make up something that makes sense to them and they'll just believe it. Just anything to shut the mystery out of their heads and stop them from really thinking.
I find that rather poetic, this idea that an inability to explain is in no way incompatible with being a skeptic.
shwooddotcom
04-11-2008, 12:58 AM
by the way, I was looking for the originator of the "afraid of ghosts" quote above, and was only able to find the following on imdb:
"The New Scooby-Doo Movies: The Secret of Shark Island (#1.8)" (1972)
Freddy: Come on, Mr. Bono, you don't believe in ghosts, do ya?
Cher: Yeah, what are you, a man or a mouse, squeak up!
Sonny Bono: No, I don't believe in ghosts, like any other sensible person, I'm afraid of them.
Somehow, I don't think it was the writers of Scooby-Doo that created that gem.
astx813
04-11-2008, 01:47 AM
by the way, I was looking for the originator of the "afraid of ghosts" quote above, and was only able to find the following on imdb: First thing I thought of was "I don't believe in God, but I'm afraid of him" ("Well I do believe in God, and the only thing that scares me, is Kaiser Sosei")
tokenuser
04-11-2008, 04:02 AM
That's the funniest thing, too. I'm a pretty hardcore skeptic, but I'll still get creeped out by 3am sounds.
Who is it that said "I don't believe in ghosts, but i'm afraid of them?"
By the way, I don't know if it was on purpose, but you mentioned side by side that you're a skeptic and have had experiences that you can't explain... I get creeped out by things that go bump in the night. I have had some strange "encounters" as well. I know there must be an explanation, and perhaps it is spiritual - but I ask that is proven to me for me to accept. Like the whole faces thing - we are programmed to hear and see things that are not there from an early age.
I will categorically say though that I have had 3 experiences that I have no explanation for ... and like a true skeptic, I wont accept that - they have piqued my curiosity.
With no mystery in the world, we have no reason to learn. I think that is why we have a childlike fascination with magic tricks :)
BTW - I have video from a trip to Barcelona where I filmed Gyspies doing the 3 card monte on Los Ramblas ... until they busted me busting them.
Had to chime in and say I'm a lot like Tokenuser.
Kinda why I brought this topic up.
I've been on a couple of ghost hunt tours. During the first one I experienced something that I couldn't explain. It was as if some had exhaled right down the back of my head and neck. I both heard and felt it. However, my friends that were huddled around me heard or saw nothing.
I tend to leave it at something happened that I can't explain however, I was on a ghost tour that I had paid money to attend. So could my sub-conscience played a trick on me just so I felt I got my money's worth?
I won't rule it out as an option. I always find it interesting though that people have ghost stories themselves or know someone who has had a ghost encounter.
I like the stories and that why I read books about the stuff. I always like when your told history of old places to set the mood for a haunting tale.
That's my two bits.
shwooddotcom
04-11-2008, 05:39 PM
Man, I just love that you guys can acknowledge that the human body pulls some pretty weird tricks on you. Most people I talk to would just assume that weird feelings or noises have to always mean something.
Kudos.
Man, I just love that you guys can acknowledge that the human body pulls some pretty weird tricks on you. Most people I talk to would just assume that weird feelings or noises have to always mean something.
Kudos. I think it's because we are technically minded. Given that Revision 3's target audience are those who have been technically trained to troubleshoot for the most part.
Philly
04-11-2008, 06:35 PM
I was in a car accident once. Big one. Went over a cliff (read: 200 foot REALLY STEEP HILL) in a minivan with my dad. We both walked out with scratches.
During the crash, the windshield blew out (like they should) and I slipped out from under my seatbelt and went out the gaping windshield.
So there I was, in midair, on the hood of the van, facing up into the van, and my arms extended into the van (think Superman).
My dad grabs my right arm with his right arm (he was still in the driver's seat) and pulled me in.
After the accident, I asked him "How did you manage to reach all the way over and grab both my arms?"
He said "I only had you by one arm."
I would swear in front of a court, in front of the pope, in front of God himself, that I was pulled back into the vehicle by both arms.
What happened?
Was it an angel? Well, my upbringing would suggest as such.
Was it just an endorphen rush trying to make me feel secure and safe in what should've been the last 3 seconds of my life? (I was 13 at the time) That would probably make more sense.
Whatever it was, again, I have no explanation. I like to think it was an angel or some sort of supernatural intervention.
Or maybe the endorphen rush WAS supernatural intervention...........
:tinfoil:
shwooddotcom
04-11-2008, 09:01 PM
He said "I only had you by one arm."
I would swear in front of a court, in front of the pope, in front of God himself, that I was pulled back into the vehicle by both arms.
What happened?
Man, that's a tough one, especially since memory is such a funny thing. I talk a bit about memory in my lecture:
SSS (5of14) False Memory and Eyewitness Testimony (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfhIuaD183I)
I suppose there's a chance that your memory of the event is right, and your Dad's misremembering? Who knows?
Philly
04-13-2008, 01:25 AM
Man, that's a tough one, especially since memory is such a funny thing. I talk a bit about memory in my lecture:
SSS (5of14) False Memory and Eyewitness Testimony (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfhIuaD183I)
I suppose there's a chance that your memory of the event is right, and your Dad's misremembering? Who knows?
Oh, there's always the chance. I don't deny that the sheer adrenaline of the situation makes it all a bit fuzzy. It's one of those few things where I can't shake off the memory. Other things I can talk myself out of or intentionally change the situation and suddenly create a new memory. Like when I lose my keys or something, I swear to God I can remember them being everywhere in my apartment (In a bag in the back of the freezer? I totally remember stashing my car keys that I use multiple times a day in the back of the freezer. That makes perfect sense. ....or was it under the washing machine I was thinking? Oh, totally....) and despite the fact that they're in my pants, I remember putting them down EVERYWHERE.
But this is one of those situations that I can't change by remembering some other way.
Anyhow, I had a friend who saw all kinds of creepy shit when he was growing up, like his teddy bear standing up and walking towards him or hearing his Teddy Ruxpin talking tape player/bear talking from the closet when there were no batteries in it.
But then again he was kind of messed up.
rabidbadger
06-29-2008, 10:32 PM
I was in a car accident once. Big one. Went over a cliff (read: 200 foot REALLY STEEP HILL) in a minivan with my dad. We both walked out with scratches.
During the crash, the windshield blew out (like they should) and I slipped out from under my seatbelt and went out the gaping windshield.
So there I was, in midair, on the hood of the van, facing up into the van, and my arms extended into the van (think Superman).
My dad grabs my right arm with his right arm (he was still in the driver's seat) and pulled me in.
After the accident, I asked him "How did you manage to reach all the way over and grab both my arms?"
He said "I only had you by one arm."
I would swear in front of a court, in front of the pope, in front of God himself, that I was pulled back into the vehicle by both arms.
What happened?
Was it an angel? Well, my upbringing would suggest as such.
Was it just an endorphen rush trying to make me feel secure and safe in what should've been the last 3 seconds of my life? (I was 13 at the time) That would probably make more sense.
Whatever it was, again, I have no explanation. I like to think it was an angel or some sort of supernatural intervention.
Or maybe the endorphen rush WAS supernatural intervention...........
:tinfoil:
dang, amazing story/experience! I was raised in a religion that didn't push the supernatural, other than a God/son thang, so an angel saving me would never have entered my mind at age 13. Oddly enough, when I quit religion the no-supernatural thing stuck with me. which is why I am an athiest sceptic to this day. Religion saved me after all. haha.
therage800
06-30-2008, 01:44 AM
Man, that's a tough one, especially since memory is such a funny thing. I talk a bit about memory in my lecture:
SSS (5of14) False Memory and Eyewitness Testimony (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfhIuaD183I)
OMG, I didn't see that one before... I put anger, WTF?!
rabidbadger
06-30-2008, 09:54 PM
dang, the famous basketball memory video has been removed from the web as far as I can tell, the creator wants to sell dvds of a 3 minute video, understandable, being his creation and all, but was so interesting it's a shame it cant be shared.
any way, in searching for that, found this...
from the basketball makers friend...
I bet brian could find a way to make this work live, somehow.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=voAntzB7EwE
pcbb_david
07-08-2008, 04:55 PM
my house is kinda in the middle of no where and as such we have our own well that pumps water to the house, and when it turns off, it sounds like a loud piece of wood is falling down or someone ran into something.
this becomes great fun when people are over at my house, I can either freak them out and be totally scared when they hear it the first time (ill admit it does catch me sometimes) and then have tehm all freaked out about the axe murderer in my basement who is going to kill us, or i can tell them that its just my poltergeist who lives in the basement like its nothing. both get great reactions