Jumping On

[mattk]

After hearing the good review of JLA #20, i went to my LCS yesterday to pick up a copy since there was nothing else i was planning on getting. The art looked good, i want to get into some DC characters, it was sort of a single issue story - it felt like a good fit. But then i see an issue of #17 on the previous issue racks and pick up that and thumb through and it makes me start wondering what happened before #20, and how i hate just picking up something and reading it in the middle. I ended up not buying it because i simply couldn't handle the feeling of wondering what happened before it.

Now i'm pretty new to monthly concepts and i'm not sure if this is something i just need to get over or what, but i think it is a problem the medium has with trying to get new readership in. I'm currently only picking up 2 main Marvel books - Cap and FF. I read through the Cap Omnibus, death HC, and found the other issues and am now monthly on it. FF i picked up at the begginning of the Millar and Hitch arc as that made it easier. Oh and i tried out Titans that i might be continuing on based on the next issue...

I'm left trying to figure out which main series that doesn't have a lot of issues to go after and either buy a lot of back issues on e-bay or try to catch up by trades - which is not easy as they are so far behind. I'm thinking of series like JSA or Mighty Avengers... But that would never allow me to jump on a series like Batman...

Does that make sense, or should i just get over it and jump on a book - Or maybe not worry about anything and just start looking for new series, expansions and reboots...

This is a subject i've been struggling with for weeks now and would love others thoughts/past experiences. Thanks.

[labor_days]

Does that make sense, or should i just get over it and jump on a book - Or maybe not worry about anything and just start looking for new series, expansions and reboots...

Do this.

Unless a series is a mini or is relatively new, there will always be catching up involved. Most folks do so via trade. If you don't want to go that route you have to just jump in. Hit wikipedia for the stuff you don't know about and get over it.

Mighty Avengers is pretty terrible. The series started off strong but is all over the place. With the last issue being heavily tied to Marvel continuity going back years.

I'd say the superior Avengers book is New Avengers. There are many cheap trades to be had beginning with Bendis' Breakout arc.

Same goes for the new JSA. The best team book on the racks hand down. Get a few of the first trades or the hardcover, Next Age, and go forward from there.

Hard to go wrong wth New Avengers and JSA. JLA is good, but if you are not too knowledgeable of the thigns going on I'm not sure the book will scratch that itch for you.

Also, we have a new to comics and recommendation thread sticky at the top of the forum. This should have been posted there.

[mikegraham6]

it all comes down to the fact that DC needs a recap page. Why DC? WHY? Do you hate new readers or something?

[labor_days]

Every comic book should have a recap page. Sometimes I forget what happened in the last Walking Dead, Buffy or Dan Dare as well.

[mikegraham6]

Mighty Avengers is pretty terrible. The series started off strong but is all over the place. With the last issue being heavily tied to Marvel continuity going back years.
the same could be said of JSA's current story arc (except for the terrible part)

[labor_days]

Um, no. You can not say that at all. The Kingdom Come stuff is explained flatly in a page and never touched on again till those two guys show up. The specific events of KC are not necessary to understand what is going on within JSA. You have to know of the events that led up to this Skrull thing.

The Mighty Avengers stuff with Fury is very continuity heavy. With no explanation of the Secret War, who the Skrull reveal is, why Fury is on the run, the Spider-Woman connection, etc. None of which is explained succinctly. I had to go to Wikipedia and the forums. And I read those issues and Secret War.

There will always be a bit of continuity in Marvel/DC hero books. But its the degree to which the reader has to work to figure things out that matters most.

To that end, I'm going to say Johns set up the Kingdom Come stuff very simply. Whereas Bendis is doing something a little more complex.

[mikegraham6]

alright labor, you've shown me up, you're right

[labor_days]

It is a common fallacy DC is more complex than Marvel. Especially so given Marvel is the more popular brand. Therefore more readers are likely to have a frame of reference w/r/t the Marvel books & characters. But really, they're both a mess of continuity and minutia.


http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Levitz/P_Levitz.jpg

"Continuity means the best writer at a company is stifled by the worst writer at that company." - Paul Levitz

[xebix]

It is a common fallacy DC is more complex than Marvel. Especially so given Marvel is the more popular brand. Therefore more readers are likely to have a frame of reference w/r/t the Marvel books & characters. But really, they're both a mess of continuity and minutia.


http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Levitz/P_Levitz.jpg

"Continuity means the best writer at a company is stifled by the worst writer at that company." - Paul Levitz

I like that quote. It is so true.

[xyzzy]

It is a common fallacy DC is more complex than Marvel. Especially so given Marvel is the more popular brand. Therefore more readers are likely to have a frame of reference w/r/t the Marvel books & characters. But really, they're both a mess of continuity and minutia.


I think that part of the reason DC has a bad rep is that they keep pointing at their continuity and all of its problems with big neon signs (Crisis on Infinite Earths, Zero Hour, Infinite Crisis, etc.), whereas Marvel just kind of ignores it.

[labor_days]

I don't think it is a "problem" though. There are great stories that come out of it. Bad ones too. But that is true of any fictional world.

Only Crisis on Infinite Earths was intended to "fix" things. The rest were playing with the ideas already out there.

[euchre0]

After hearing the good review of JLA #20, i went to my LCS yesterday to pick up a copy since there was nothing else i was planning on getting. The art looked good, i want to get into some DC characters, it was sort of a single issue story - it felt like a good fit. But then i see an issue of #17 on the previous issue racks and pick up that and thumb through and it makes me start wondering what happened before #20, and how i hate just picking up something and reading it in the middle. I ended up not buying it because i simply couldn't handle the feeling of wondering what happened before it.

It's a shame you did this with JLA, since it is one of the least continuity tied books that came out in the last week or so. Really, you don't need to know anything to read issue #20.

[xyzzy]

I don't think it is a "problem" though. There are great stories that come out of it. Bad ones too. But that is true of any fictional world.

Only Crisis on Infinite Earths was intended to "fix" things. The rest were playing with the ideas already out there.

I'm just saying that I think the reason people often say/think that DC has more continuity problems is that DC draws attention to them. Whereas Marvel's typical response to problematic continuity is to ignore it.

And, I, personally do think that continuity is a burden on big 2 comic stories. It's just a personal preference. For some people, continuity is the big draw of comic books. For me, it's the opposite. I hear the iFanboy reviews sometimes complaining that a story "doesn't matter." because it's out of continuity or it isn't referenced by other books, and I know that's just coming from a completely different point of view than me. Whether or not it has an impact on the series as a whole, or the shared universe as a whole is something that I just don't care about.

[mikegraham6]

I'm just saying that I think the reason people often say/think that DC has more continuity problems is that DC draws attention to them. Whereas Marvel's typical response to problematic continuity is to ignore it.


Problematic continuity isn't really what we're talking about though, it's more about storylines relying on older stories. Labor pointed out that JSA relies on them but presents new stories without the same amount of baggage. Bendis isn't really doing that with MA. His story relies heavily on an old story of his. The difference between the two is that 1)Bendis wrote the story he is referenecing, so anyone who is a fan of Bendis is more likely to have read his previous work and 2) His storyline is only a few years old while the ones DC usually rely on can be 10, 20, or even 30 years old (hell in the case of Morrison's run on Batman, it's upwards of 60-70 years old). that's a big difference

[neb]

mattk, as someone who has left comics numerous times only to come back years later, I will admit that things can be daunting. But fear not! I think this is best approach, and one that I have used many times:

Just pick up whatever characters you are into. The most you should ever go back is to get issues at the beginning of the current story arc (i.e. if you pick up Part 3, buy 1 & 2). After reading it, if you're still confused, hop on boards, e-mail other comic friends, search the web, etc. to get caught up. Labor already mentioned Wikipedia which is an excellent source for finding stuff.

If you end up digging a character/team a lot, then I recommend picking up essential trades (not the cheap black and whites, but the most essential stories for the character), and beyond this site, you can usually find that kind of stuff on Amazon or asking at your local LCS.

Part of picking up something new in regards to superheroes is that there never really is a good time to jump on.

As for books out now that are good ones to jump onto:

JSA
Green Lantern (the Secret Origin story started last month, so there's a good one)
Nova (12 issues in and it's dynamite. Next issue should be a good place to jump on)
Detective Comics (one and dones)
Jonah Hex (one and dones)
Black Canary/Green Arrow (about 9 issues in, but I'm sure you can find the back issues...a trade is also coming out soon)
Scapled (seriously, buy the two trades out now and find the two back issues...not only one of the best series going but easy to catch up to)
Fell (anytime this comes out, buy it)
Wolverine (Jason Aaron is rocking this book...it's only three issues in and really good)
Nightwing (Again, it's three issues in to a new story arch that is awesome)
Criminal (completely amazing, always buy it)

...Ok, that's enough...I could go on. Really, a lot of Marvel titles are new reader friendly as the "Previously in..." page contains relevant information.

[labor_days]

Neb spitting straight fiyah here.


Also, I agree with points of both Mike G and Xyzzy. They are both right to a certain degree. But a more thorough conversation on this will have to wait for another day.

[aerodash84]

So I just got back into comics recently mainly buying up trades and now getting more titles. I hopped onto Green Lantern due to the Secret Origins recommendation and enjoying it. I'm actually going to subscribe and hope it keeps going like it is. I'm also collecting the Avenger Books involved with Secret Invasion. New Avengers was a little more accessible then Mighty Avengers, but it's been some good reads.

[mikegraham6]

Neb spitting straight fiyah here.


Also, I agree with points of both Mike G and Xyzzy. They are both right to a certain degree. But a more thorough conversation on this will have to wait for another day.
ya i liked the path that conversation was going, maybe we should start a seperate thread about "problematic continuity"

[mattk]

Well, i just thought i would check back in. I've decided to blend the advice.

I jumped onto Green Lantern and picked up issues #29 and 30 - loved 'em. I think my next TPB project will be going back and grabbing the rest of this series in trade.

I also got the first 11 issues of the current JSA run for cheap on e-bay so i'm gonna scrounge around and see if i can't find 12-14 before 15 comes out.

Other than that, i'm still looking at maybe picking up Nova on this new arc - not sure, i'll check out this issue this Wed and see if it looks like its up my alley.

There are also some new books coming out for me to start on that i'll be looking at like Invincible Ironman and Avengers/Invaders.

The only other one i'm interested jumping on right now that i don't really have a clue about is Nightwing... maybe i'll start with the next arc?

Thanks for the thoughts guys.

[gungadin]

The only other one i'm interested jumping on right now that i don't really have a clue about is Nightwing... maybe i'll start with the next arc?

I think this week's is the start of a new arc... Start there :)

[ruo21]

I just recently jumped on to JSA with not to much trouble. I was able to get issues 2-14 and have been hardily enjoying it. It's not to confusing even though the whole JLA/JSA Lightning Saga frustrated me. I really like the way this series is going.