View Full Version : Why the nasty comment?
kanuk
08-04-2008, 01:33 AM
Hello Patrick, I am a French Canadian. Can you explain to me what ulterior purpose was served with your gratuitous comment in episode 44? Being from LA you may not realize it, but this is a bit demeaning to us. Please stay away from the stereotypes even when quoting someone else. I enjoy the show.
comhcinc
08-04-2008, 01:40 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEEmxbqV3rg
it's not evil spirits it's just rain..........rain...........fine, try and kill it.
zorgul
08-04-2008, 01:47 AM
I'm also french canadian. Patrick comment is like saying the people in the US doesn't talk english but in the UK they do.
The spoken french in Québec is older than the one from France. Also they evolved seperatly for 300 years.
comhcinc
08-04-2008, 01:59 AM
Patrick comment is like saying the people in the US doesn't talk english but in the UK they do.
that happens to be true. in this country we speak AMERICAN! and don't you forget it buddy.
To be fair I've heard people from England say that american's don't speak "proper" english either.
Really all Patrick was saying is that the dialects of french are different in Quebec and in France
Guytheninja
08-04-2008, 03:14 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEEmxbqV3rg
it's not evil spirits it's just rain..........rain...........fine, try and kill it.
Hilarious show.
juniper-monkeys
08-04-2008, 04:03 AM
I don't see what's so nasty about it either. Linguistically, Quebec French isn't French. It's a Variety, just as you'll find across much of Northwestern and Central Africa, and parts of Southeast Asia. Saying "French Canadians get hung up on trivialities" would be a nasty stereotype, but saying that the language spoken in Quebec isn't strictly French is just a fact of the linguistic classification system, every bit as true as saying that French isn't strictly an Oïl language - it's a descendent of that family. And that's not just technicalities - QF and French do vary quite a bit in practice.
Ryudo
08-04-2008, 04:29 AM
Grr I am so offended I could just..I could just..sign on a internet forum make one post how gosh darn diddly widdly angry I am!:mad:
quantumfreak
08-04-2008, 04:30 AM
Quebec French and French are different, at least in the opinion of employment agencies in Wisconsin. Many bilingual jobs postings specify Canadian French and say French experience is insufficient.
Grr I am so offended I could just..I could just..sign on a internet forum make one post how gosh darn diddly widdly angry I am!:mad:
French canadians can be VERY VERY sensitive about the french language. Trust me.
mikec
08-04-2008, 04:51 AM
I must have missed what Patrick said, WHAT did he say? Thanks.
davmoo
08-04-2008, 07:08 AM
Of course Quebec French and France French are different. Considering they are on almost opposite sides of the planet they would have to be different, unless the French just came to Canada last month.
Just like what they speak in Central America is not the same Spanish as what they speak in Spain. Language tutor software even specifies which version of Spanish its for.
As for the British saying Americans don't speak proper English, screw them. The British are just being sour grapes because they're still mad about losing the Revolutionary War :D
computoman
08-04-2008, 12:14 PM
Why do not we speak a real american language like cherokee, apache, karankawa, arapahoe or etc?
tokenuser
08-04-2008, 12:22 PM
As for the British saying Americans don't speak proper English, screw them. The British are just being sour grapes because they're still mad about losing the Revolutionary War :DThey didn't lose. The conceeded. A country that doesn't understand cricket or the concept of morning tea doesn't deserve to be in the commonwealth.
Quebcois are too damn sensitive for their own good. If you speak French, you can get around the city and communicate pretty well. Same thing in Mexico if you know Spanish, Brazil if you know Portugese, Australia if you know English (barely).
You never see the same level of sensitivity in Montreal - its always the people from Quebec City with a bee in their bonnet about something.
(I deal with Canandian a lot in my job - both French Canadians, and the regular ones - and travel in/out of Montreal and QC as required)
Quebecois are too damn sensitive for their own good. If you speak French, you can get around the city and communicate pretty well. Same thing in Mexico if you know Spanish, Brazil if you know Portugese, Australia if you know English (barely).
You never see the same level of sensitivity in Montreal - its always the people from Quebec City with a bee in their bonnet about something.
(I deal with Canandian a lot in my job - both French Canadians, and the regular ones - and travel in/out of Montreal and QC as required)
Quoted for absolute truth. It's actually a lot better now than it was when I was growing up.
bigshotprof
08-04-2008, 03:27 PM
Patrick's not from California. He is from the New York metropolitan area. So he knows a thing or two about battered dialects.
Guytheninja
08-04-2008, 03:57 PM
They didn't lose. The conceeded. A country that doesn't understand cricket or the concept of morning tea doesn't deserve to be in the commonwealth.
As for being in the commonwealth -- I am so glad that the US told England to take a hike back in the late 1700's. We, in America, shaped our own culture the way we wanted it. These commonwealth countries are still at home living with momma.
In America
1. We don't have Queen Elizabeth on our paper currency and coinage.
2. We don't speak British English.
3. We don't have rose gardens on every street.
4. We drive on the side of the road that we want to drive on.
5. We threw tea time, cricket, and all that other British stuff out the door a long time ago.
In other words, we have our own culture, and its on our terms.
I've been to New Zealand and Australia. I asked a guy in NZ why their culture was so British --- and he got angry about it. But I had a hard time determining what was British, and what was unique to these countries. New Zealand, Australia, UK, whats the difference?
I see the american education system is still doing a bang-up job teaching about foreign countries.
1. Pictures on currency != culture
2. Neither Australia, NZ or Canada speak British English, we all have our own different slang and colloqiualisms, just like the americans. Although we do have a fondness for the letter "u"
3. Why would you be proud that you have less flowers than someone else?
4. There are countries aside from commonwealth countries driving on the "wrong" side of the road, oh and in Canada we drive on the same side of the road as you.
5. Wow you got rid of some british things from the 1700s and kept others, just like Canada, NZ, Australia and EVEN the UK!
comhcinc
08-04-2008, 04:31 PM
the only time we learn about foreign countries is when we are deciding which targets to bomb thank you very much.
the only time we learn about foreign countries is when we are deciding which targets to bomb thank you very much.
I assume you're joking, but I've met people in the states who genuinely believe this which disgusts me.
comhcinc
08-04-2008, 04:54 PM
it is a truthful statement made as a joke.
darknessgp
08-04-2008, 04:59 PM
French Canadians are not French, American English is not British English, etc. etc.
To be honest, does it really matter?
fishtoprecords
08-04-2008, 07:48 PM
"Revolutionary War" They didn't lose. The conceeded.
Correct, more exactly, the British got tired of it, they were not winning, but not losing either. They were losing good men in a far off war that was not important.
Lots of wars are "lost" that way.
I noticed Patrick's comment, and thought it might raise eyebrows. A lot of French Canadians don't even think of themselves as Canadian.
If folks think that Americans all talk alike, they need to travel more.
Cacogen
08-04-2008, 07:58 PM
I don't see what's so nasty about it either. Linguistically, Quebec French isn't French. It's a Variety, just as you'll find across much of Northwestern and Central Africa, and parts of Southeast Asia. Saying "French Canadians get hung up on trivialities" would be a nasty stereotype, but saying that the language spoken in Quebec isn't strictly French is just a fact of the linguistic classification system, every bit as true as saying that French isn't strictly an Oïl language - it's a descendent of that family. And that's not just technicalities - QF and French do vary quite a bit in practice.
I think it's more reasonable to consider the two forms different dialects of French. For the most part, Quebec French and Metropolitan French are mutually intelligible -- much more so than, say, Swiss German dialects and Standard German.
tokenuser
08-04-2008, 08:08 PM
1. We don't have Queen Elizabeth on our paper currency and coinage.Very true. You instead choose slave owners. Its a fine distinction.
2. We don't speak British English.Neither do I.
3. We don't have rose gardens on every street.Really? Maybe not where you live. And if you did, it would be a much nicer place to live. Have you ever stopped to smell the roses?
4. We drive on the side of the road that we want to drive on.No you don't. You drive on the side of the road that your convention (as dictated to you by the teamsters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_on_the_left_or_right)) dictates you drive on - not because you "choose" to.
5. We threw tea time, cricket, and all that other British stuff out the door a long time ago.Adn replaced it with drivethru coffee windows, baseball, and a shitload of stuff from other nationalities as the emigrated to the US.
In other words, we have our own culture, and its on our terms.... or so "they" lead you to believe.
I've been to New Zealand and Australia. I asked a guy in NZ why their culture was so British --- and he got angry about it. But I had a hard time determining what was British, and what was unique to these countries. New Zealand, Australia, UK, whats the difference?Have you ever been to Britain? I've been to Britain (and the rest of the UK and Ireland), as well as Australia. My experience in NZ is the transit lounge at Auckland airport on way to USA - so I wont count that.
Tell me something uniquely culturally American - and I bet it can be traced back to English roots.
You are not as unique as you might like to think you are.
"I just got back from Australia. It was so clean, the people were so friendly, the food was great." ... that then gets followed by "How do you find America?" (well, if you think Australia is clean, we think America is - wel, you get the picture), or "What are you doing here?" (sometimes I wonder myself).
comhcinc
08-04-2008, 08:23 PM
Tell me something uniquely culturally American - and I bet it can be traced back to English roots.
Drive by shootings.
myketuna
08-04-2008, 08:28 PM
lol. man. i kinda agree with this guy. but seriously i guess the only thing uniquely American is we got a lot of people from everywhere else. You know the whole "melting pot" scenario. But then again, there are probably other melting pots somewhere else.
Certainly there are ones that don't hate the people that are melting into the pot as much.
myketuna
08-04-2008, 09:15 PM
Certainly there are ones that don't hate the people that are melting into the pot as much.
True that says a son in a family of current and former illegal immigrants. No, but I don't know about using "hate." But that's debatable... they certainly don't want some of us here.
Cacogen
08-04-2008, 09:21 PM
Correct, more exactly, the British got tired of it, they were not winning, but not losing either. They were losing good men in a far off war that was not important.
Lots of wars are "lost" that way.
"Got tired of it" might be a bit of an understatement. It was a hugely expensive campaign for the Brits, without good prospects for ever securing enough territory to "win."
Cacogen
08-04-2008, 09:23 PM
Certainly there are ones that don't hate the people that are melting into the pot as much.
And there are certainly countries which "hate the people that are melting into the pot" quite a bit more.
The Japanese are an interesting case. They are going to be forced to allow much more immigration at some point, or face economic collapse as their population ages.
Cacogen
08-04-2008, 09:33 PM
Hello Patrick, I am a French Canadian. Can you explain to me what ulterior purpose was served with your gratuitous comment in episode 44? Being from LA you may not realize it, but this is a bit demeaning to us. Please stay away from the stereotypes even when quoting someone else. I enjoy the show.
Parisians don't own the French language, but many certainly think they do. I doubt Mr. Norton has a dog in that fight. How is alluding to the linguistic snootiness of some French speakers of French offensive?
This whole "be aggrieved and offended first - ask questions latter"--thing, so prevalent these days, disturbs me.
KilroyPerrywinkle
08-04-2008, 09:46 PM
Wait is this the thread where we're mad about the word "basically" or is the one where we're mad that Veronica said "fuck" or is this the thread that we're mad because our lives are too empty and we have nothing worth caring about except what some balding man on a internet TV show said about how some people talk?
Right.
I'll be outside for a bit.
/feels kind of dark in here.
davmoo
08-04-2008, 10:03 PM
Wait is this the thread where we're mad about the word "basically" or is the one where we're mad that Veronica said "fuck" or is this the thread that we're mad because our lives are too empty and we have nothing worth caring about except what some balding man on a internet TV show said about how some people talk?
I was thinking about setting up an Excel spreadsheet so I could keep track of who hates or is offended by what, and which thread it goes in...
mikec
08-04-2008, 10:39 PM
Drive by shootings.
Might have to credit that one to the Brit's as well. The SAS, Special Air services, nasty bastards God love them, used a type of drive by shooting in Africa and France during the little row called WW II.
Other sources say that people on horse back using guns not really common in the US, they were replaced by more modern guns by the time this land was being settled, would ride up and shoot people and then rid off.
mikec
08-04-2008, 10:42 PM
Very true. You instead choose slave owners. Its a fine distinction.
An the Queen's family is lily white? They have not profited from the labo(u)r of people in lands that the Crown took from the rightful rulers/leaders? The British never employed the concept of slavery? (Or forced labor?)
bigshotprof
08-04-2008, 10:57 PM
Tell me something uniquely culturally American - and I bet it can be traced back to English roots.
.
The banjo. African.
bigshotprof
08-04-2008, 10:59 PM
Might have to credit that one to the Brit's as well. .
Indeed, where do you think he got the name "Robbin' 'Hood.?"
comhcinc
08-04-2008, 11:02 PM
Might have to credit that one to the Brit's as well. The SAS, Special Air services, nasty bastards God love them, used a type of drive by shooting in Africa and France during the little row called WW II.
Other sources say that people on horse back using guns not really common in the US, they were replaced by more modern guns by the time this land was being settled, would ride up and shoot people and then rid off.
umm i am sorry but gangsters in the '20s were doing drive bys.
you just ran up against FAIL.
tokenuser
08-04-2008, 11:06 PM
The British never employed the concept of slavery? (Or forced labor?)No - that was called "colonisation". They had a flag to prove it.
uEx5G-GOS1k
mikec
08-04-2008, 11:32 PM
umm i am sorry but gangsters in the '20s were doing drive bys.
you just ran up against FAIL.
You read what you want. I included two options, one the SAS, the other men on horses. For me that pre-dates the "Roaring 20's".
comhcinc
08-05-2008, 12:00 AM
i do read what i want it is called history. you should try it some time.
tokenuser
08-05-2008, 01:17 AM
i do read what i want it is called history. you should try it some time.Yeah - Robin Hood. Original drive bys.
KilroyPerrywinkle
08-05-2008, 01:35 AM
Oh! Oh! Oh!
I'm of Dutch decent, if we're talking about slavery... I know how to make a profit!
Za-zing!
westudi
08-05-2008, 01:37 AM
Trying to say the U.S. or the U.K is more unique than the other is folly. We are so closely linked that to criticize one is essentially to criticize the other. Besides, why bother?
fishtoprecords
08-05-2008, 04:45 AM
"Got tired of it" might be a bit of an understatement. It was a hugely expensive campaign for the Brits, without good prospects for ever securing enough territory to "win."
Funny how expensive wars can be when the locals support the insurgents. I think the Brits figured this out and it was one of the reasons they gave up most of their empire. The French relearned it over and over. They left SouthEast Asia for the same reason.
Makes you wonder why politicians don't learn from history.
Cacogen
08-05-2008, 10:48 AM
Funny how expensive wars can be when the locals support the insurgents. I think the Brits figured this out and it was one of the reasons they gave up most of their empire. The French relearned it over and over. They left SouthEast Asia for the same reason.
Makes you wonder why politicians don't learn from history.
Yeah, it's not at all hard to find modern analogs....
tokenuser
08-05-2008, 11:36 AM
Makes you wonder why politicians don't learn from history.C average?
Tritium
08-05-2008, 07:29 PM
I can sum this thread up:
* French canadians have a bee in their bonit about something. this is nothing new. You can compliment them without them being insulted.
* Americans are evil and stupid, and everything every other contry in the world does is better and they did it first.
* Everyone eles in the world is stupid, and everything every other contry does was done by americans first, and they do it better.
http://images.wikia.com/evchk/images/0/06/Arguing_on_the_internet.jpg
Im risking a ban for that image, but it makes the point clear.
comhcinc
08-05-2008, 07:42 PM
if you don't like it don't read it.
Tritium
08-05-2008, 07:52 PM
Why post it? Why argue? Seriously. What benifit does it have? You get the stupidest of the representitive groups prooving the other parties points. Does this aregument EVER get anywhere? Patrick was called out on it, he'll prolly say something next episode along the lines of "Im sorry about last week, i didnt intened to offend anyone" and it will be done with, over. They arnt reading deep into the thread to see this cause it really dosnt matter.
Your telling me not to read it? tell everyone else not to read the stuff they are constently bickering about.
GET OVER YOURSELVES!
Ryudo
08-05-2008, 07:53 PM
I can sum this thread up:
* French canadians have a bee in their bonit about something. this is nothing new. You can compliment them without them being insulted.
* Americans are evil and stupid, and everything every other contry in the world does is better and they did it first.
* Everyone eles in the world is stupid, and everything every other contry does was done by americans first, and they do it better.
http://images.wikia.com/evchk/images/0/06/Arguing_on_the_internet.jpg
Im risking a ban for that image, but it makes the point clear.
Welcome to the internet.
And you just became by posting in the topic esp with that pic as retarded as the rest of us as you so claim us to to be.
Tritium
08-05-2008, 07:55 PM
sometimes you just haveto get everyone pissed off at yourself so they will stop whineing about stupid stuff.
Ryudo
08-05-2008, 07:57 PM
Never was upset.
But agree the OP is whining over something pretty trivial.;)
Tritium
08-05-2008, 08:01 PM
I dont know why I got pissed. Maybe ive just seen this community actually be constructive, and have good ideas. It seams this thread is a waste. But thats my opinion.
comhcinc
08-05-2008, 08:05 PM
Why post it? Why argue? Seriously. What benifit does it have? You get the stupidest of the representitive groups prooving the other parties points. Does this aregument EVER get anywhere? Patrick was called out on it, he'll prolly say something next episode along the lines of "Im sorry about last week, i didnt intened to offend anyone" and it will be done with, over. They arnt reading deep into the thread to see this cause it really dosnt matter.
Your telling me not to read it? tell everyone else not to read the stuff they are constently bickering about.
GET OVER YOURSELVES!
people should be allowed to do what they want to. if they want to fuss with each other fine. what isn't fine is you playing thought police with your cute little stolen because i am not witty enough to do it myself pic
Tritium
08-05-2008, 08:09 PM
I dont recall telling anyone what to do. I infact recall you doing that. Anyways, Seriously, if you want to continue to argue of this trivia, fine. I cant stop you.
comhcinc
08-05-2008, 08:17 PM
I dont recall telling anyone what to do. I infact recall you doing that. Anyways, Seriously, if you want to continue to argue of this trivia, fine. I cant stop you.
no you did not in fact say something like "stop that" but most of us here are over the age of four and understand "impiled demands"
so not only have you made demands of people on here, but you have also said we are a bunch of morons.
tokenuser
08-05-2008, 08:46 PM
Why post it? Why argue? Seriously. What benifit does it have? You get the stupidest of the representitive groups prooving the other parties points. Does this aregument EVER get anywhere? Patrick was called out on it, he'll prolly say something next episode along the lines of "Im sorry about last week, i didnt intened to offend anyone" and it will be done with, over. They arnt reading deep into the thread to see this cause it really dosnt matter.I don't think Patrick will apologise. He has nothing to apologise about ... but if he did, he would do it in English (actually, he might apologise in really bad French - just to annoy the Quebcois even more).
Your telling me not to read it? tell everyone else not to read the stuff they are constently bickering about.
GET OVER YOURSELVES!Either way, if you want to take a holier than thou attitude, make sure you have a spell check turned on ... or you might just come across as the guy in the pic you posted.
westudi
08-06-2008, 01:08 AM
he might apologise in really bad French - just to annoy the Quebcois even more
But then they might think he is French Canadian.
Sorry, I couldn't pass that up.
Chèque that. I'm not really sorry.
tokenuser
08-06-2008, 10:58 AM
As mentioned earlier, I do some work with Quebcois. When in town, I make sure my Australian accent is a little thicker than normal. They hate arrogant Americans, but love Aussies :) [even the arrogant ones]. Same thing happens in Europe with French, German, Italian, and Spanish.
Its amazing how much an accent can break the ice and help international relations.
davmoo
08-06-2008, 12:13 PM
Ever notice how all those countries that hate us arrogant Americans are also the ones who have their hands out asking us for help and money every time they have a disaster? Funny how that works.
comhcinc
08-06-2008, 12:19 PM
canada is asking us for money?
Well we do sell you a lot of oil and electricity, and we sure as hell aren't giving it away ;)
tokenuser
08-06-2008, 12:50 PM
Ever notice how all those countries that hate us arrogant Americans are also the ones who have their hands out asking us for help and money every time they have a disaster? Funny how that works.Really? When was the last time the US sent aid money to Canada or Australia?
(BTW - We dont hate Americans ... just the arrogant "everything is bigger an better in the good ole US of A" ones)
tokenuser
08-06-2008, 12:51 PM
Well we do sell you a lot of oil and electricity, and we sure as hell aren't giving it away ;)And wood. There would be no plywood available to board up windows in hurricanes if it weren't for Canadians ... and I think a lot of it comes from Quebec :)
I always forget about the wood, and yeah there's lots from BC and Quebec.
I think a bunch of Quebec Hydro employees have been down a few times to help out in major power outages
westudi
08-06-2008, 08:04 PM
Ah, jingoism is great isn't it?
fishtoprecords
08-06-2008, 08:16 PM
And wood.
And OIL. The US imports more crude oil from Canada than any other country.
I expect that love us wasteful Americans giving them all that money for wood, oil, pot, etc.
darknessgp
08-06-2008, 09:55 PM
And OIL. The US imports more crude oil from Canada than any other country.
I expect that love us wasteful Americans giving them all that money for wood, oil, pot, etc.
yea, but they don't because they know if they cut us off then we might just invade... not like they would put up much of a fight anyways.
myketuna
08-07-2008, 12:19 AM
yea, but they don't because they know if they cut us off then we might just invade... not like they would put up much of a fight anyways.
Geez, really dude? Was that necessary? As for the topic, I don't have anything to say about it considering I'm not Canadian and have never been. Although, I kind of want to. Canada seems cool.
tokenuser
08-07-2008, 02:44 AM
And OIL. The US imports more crude oil from Canada than any other country.That was in the list of things that I replied to. People always forget wood for some reason.
tokenuser
08-07-2008, 02:45 AM
yea, but they don't because they know if they cut us off then we might just invade...What would you invade with? Wisconsin Girl Guide Troop #67? I think everyone else is doing more important stuff like keeping sand out of their Humvees.
KilroyPerrywinkle
08-07-2008, 04:36 AM
People always forget wood for some reason.
Token every since I was 13 I've never forgotten it...
Never forget....
heh.
Wood.
tokenuser
08-07-2008, 04:38 AM
Token every since I was 13 I've never forgotten it...
Never forget....
heh.
Wood.Very true ... and with disaster relief efforts, the Canadians have always been there to help the homeless *ahem* pitch a tent.
jks15
08-07-2008, 06:40 AM
I feel like I'm a debate in my intro Linguistics class that has seriously derailed lol
Cacogen
08-07-2008, 08:02 AM
I feel like I'm a debate in my intro Linguistics class that has seriously derailed lol
Being that my school is on the quarter system, there was no time for debating in the Intro to Linguistics course I took a few years back -- phonetics, phonology, morphology, syntax, semantics, historical/comparative, a pinch of L1 & L2 acquisition, and a dash of psycholinguistics, all in 12 weeks. Blech.
darknessgp
08-07-2008, 02:29 PM
What would you invade with? Wisconsin Girl Guide Troop #67? I think everyone else is doing more important stuff like keeping sand out of their Humvees.
Yes actually, as that is all it would take... Jokes aside though, does it really matter what Canada exports to the US? To say that random American doesn't respect random Candian guy doesn't say much. There will always be people who don't care about anyone but themselves, and there are people who do care. I have a friend serving in Iraq, and he is excited that he gets to work with the French, British, Australians, etc.
So, as for why this thread was created... Patrick made a comment, big deal. Get over it.
mikec
08-07-2008, 04:33 PM
What would you invade with? Wisconsin Girl Guide Troop #67?
Troop 67 has a long and storied combat history. They would march through Canada like bad Mexican food through a tourist. All they have to do is seize the Molson plant in Toronto and stop the trucks delivering back bacon and Canada would be on their knees.
FYI, I grew up along the border and have enjoyed my time North of the border.