Episode 64 - MythTV: Free Media Center From a Junk PC! [Discussion] [Archive]

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serafina

08-18-2008, 10:30 PM

Don't have a lot of money for a new Home Theater PC? No problem. Mythbox is open source, free and runs great on a cheap PC. It's perfect for a HTPC if you're on a budget!

Watch and download this episode of Systm here. (http://revision3.com/systm/bmwt)

agamotto

08-18-2008, 11:08 PM

Yep, just pray that you don't run into the dreaded "won't burn DVDs" problem that has cropped up with 8.04 and mythlib .21...

krigney

08-18-2008, 11:37 PM

Didn't Kevin and Dan do this? Like... Episode 2?

The answer is yes. I guess it is acceptable because you are doing a DIY home theater thing, but i was looking forward to a Projector. Oh well

computoman

08-19-2008, 12:28 AM

Things have changed a lot since episode 2. It is also a lot easier to set up than the old days and there are many new features. You can even control home devices like x10 modules and cameras to act as a security system. You can even add asterisk to it. You may want a beefier machine to do all that. You can use thin clients as front ends!!! Makes it easy to control what the kids watch.Traditional tv's are obsolete. Mythtv did deserve a second look. Good to see a "no excuse" show for a change! bravo! Freebsd jails rock!

shlorn

08-19-2008, 12:39 AM

Cool but I think it was kinda a cop out to cover a subject that was already done PERFECTLY. Idk, i don't want to hate but it is just kinda weird, like on diggnation are they going to follow up on episode 2.

blackstorm

08-19-2008, 10:27 AM

I have been wanting to do something like this for the last 6 months or longer, but couldn't figure anything out. I know Kevin and Dan covered this in one of the first episode of Systm, but I wanted to see something more current. Glad this was put out. Thanks for the update!

But, the only problem I am running into is that at the Mythbuntu website, there are 12 different download links. I'm confused. I assume since it is going on a machine without an AMD processor, I can forget the links under the "amd64 Builds" section. But, that still leaves 6 options. What is the difference between Direct Desktop Download and Direct Alternative Download? what is an md5sum? I'm confused here. =( any help would be great.

Also, I haven't decided on the full hardware specs I'll have it on, but I'll be using a P3 800MHz for the first build to see if it works how I want it to before I put the money into something better. =)

- Dustin

gobo

08-19-2008, 12:15 PM

I can help you about the md5sum at least.

If you run an md5 hash on the file you download it should match up with the md5sum listed on the mythbuntu site. It's to help you confirm you have the file you're looking for.

eddyman

08-19-2008, 01:02 PM

do i have to plug my computer into anything? cause both the tutorials seemed to make it seem like you just plug in the cards install mythtv and then you get tv on your computer

jerichobp

08-19-2008, 01:50 PM

Now here's my question: Can you run MythTV in VMWare on a windows box. Cause then I would definitely install it.

brotherlu

08-19-2008, 02:35 PM

Now here's my question: Can you run MythTV in VMWare on a windows box. Cause then I would definitely install it.

For sure since it is a linux distro. Also look at ELISA from the fluendo project people. They have Binaries for Linux Mac and Windows

bmwt

08-19-2008, 03:05 PM

But, the only problem I am running into is that at the Mythbuntu website, there are 12 different download links. I'm confused. I assume since it is going on a machine without an AMD processor, I can forget the links under the "amd64 Builds" section. But, that still leaves 6 options. What is the difference between Direct Desktop Download and Direct Alternative Download? what is an md5sum? I'm confused here. =( any help would be great.

Generally speaking, you'll want the "desktop" version instead of the "alternative" (the alternative has a text based install and lacks the live cd). The "amd64" version is a generic 64 bit version (can be run on 64 bit intel machines as well) if you want to go that route, but there's really no need. Most people will want the "i386 Direct Desktop Download".

bmwt

08-19-2008, 03:08 PM

do i have to plug my computer into anything? cause both the tutorials seemed to make it seem like you just plug in the cards install mythtv and then you get tv on your computer

Yes :) you'll need power for the machine, network/internet to get your program data from schedulesdirect, and a connection per card for your antennae or cable connection. (in most non-sattelite instances you can split a single antennae/cable connection to multiple cards)

jerichobp

08-19-2008, 03:11 PM

For sure since it is a linux distro. Also look at ELISA from the fluendo project people. They have Binaries for Linux Mac and Windows

Thanks, Ill have to check that out. Now I just have to find out if VMWare would even detect a Tuner card and/or if it would be too generically labled for full featured mythtv use.

bani-banan

08-19-2008, 04:28 PM

Now here's my question: Can you run MythTV in VMWare on a windows box. Cause then I would definitely install it.

What's the point?

The VMWare server/workstation give the virtual machine a 16MB graphics memory, and it also doesn't allow the virtual machine to use any other than the ram and CPU of the "host" computer. Which means, it's just for shits and giggles. You won't be able to capture any video.

thecgmguy

08-19-2008, 05:23 PM

I'm pretty happy with SageTV. It's JAVA based so they offer versions for Linux, MAC OS, and Windows.

It's a bit pricey (80 bucks) but EPG services are unlimited so it's only a one time fee. Plus you can get Netflix and Pandora integration (at least for the windows release). =)

Just my two cents.

jca

08-19-2008, 05:58 PM

broderboy

08-19-2008, 07:14 PM

I was hoping for more advice on capture cards and the can/can't Do's of HD and myth

xfuuey

08-19-2008, 08:28 PM

hbeierg

08-20-2008, 12:36 AM

i have been wanting to do something like this for some time, and have a extra computer laying around that i picked up on the cheap. It is a IBM Pentium 4 1.60GHz 256mb Ram. If i stuck one of those PVR-150 cards in there would it be able to run fine?

megazone

08-20-2008, 06:03 AM

Kind of ironically I'm watching this on my TiVo Series3 via TiVoCast. ;-) MythTV is great, no question, but if you use digital cable or satellite it has limitations beyond their control - satellite being a closed system and CableLabs blocking CableCARD support. With the new H.264 HD capture devices, like the Hauppauge HD PVR, there are some options for capturing HD content from those sources, but it is expensive and more complex, and you end up with a D-A-D loop so you lose some quality. (I don't think this is a good thing, but unless the FCC steps in it is unlikely to change.)

But the real reason I'm commenting is that early on in this episode Patrick made an offhand comment about the media that is supported and quickly mentioned that you're screwed if you've purchased content from iTunes due to DRM. I suggest Googling for "Requiem 1.7.3" and you'll see how you can free your iTunes content to work in MythTV, or other systems. And if you purchase the DRM-free iTunes Plus content and have trouble with playback on some devices that should handle AAC, try "PutPinfInItsPlace".

Have fun.

tom61

08-21-2008, 12:34 AM

Nice show to cover the basics, but to truly understand the power of MythTV, you need to show off the features not found anywhere else. Like Commercial Detection and Auto-Skip, Pitch Corrected Time Stretch, DVD Archiving, Multi-Channel recording for DVB, etc.

It's not just a DVR, its the best DVR and more. Show everyone why.

I'd really like to see a more in depth view of features that MythTV now offers as well. The 'NetFlix' button (at 12:12 in the video) is intriguing, more details on that would be great, as I'm not a NetFlix subscriber. If it has the full streaming capabilities, it'd make getting a NetFlix account more valuable to me, as last I checked the streaming service only works under Windows Internet Explorer.

I'd also like to see what it now offers in integration with other sites for streaming media, like Pandora.com (selected from preferences streaming audio, which you've mentioned on other shows) and Hulu.com (free commercial TV on demand).

uPNP integration sounds interesting, showing that in action using the XBox 360, PS3, and one of those cheap settop boxes on the show would be great.

Oh, and to add to my wishlist, Wii Remote integration. Ever since hearing about the Japanese TV Guide thing for the Wii, I've wanted to be able to scroll through the channel listing at the speed I want based on the tilt of the controller. Seems like a Wii Remote would make an OK remote for it (the only real drawback is the lack of number keys), and that'd mean one less remote floating about the living room.

Also, showing Brendan White's home MythBox would be cool. Sounds like he has it fairly decked out.

Wow, with all these features you could easily make a series of shows on just this one topic, like you did with the MAME machine.

kai-chrostoph

08-21-2008, 11:00 AM

Hi,
I just installed Mythbuntu on my former VDR PC. The system works, but it was not able to detect my Technotrend FullFeatured 1.6 DVB-S Card.
Can someone help me to get this running?

Cheers

KC

bmwt

08-21-2008, 04:51 PM

did you get any boot messages that look useful? With a lot of dvb-s cards, it can often detect the backend chip, but gets tripped up with frontend. (i actually have a technotrend dvb-s card, tho it seems to be autodetected). I might first swap some pci cards around- i've seen driver issues get resolved simply by swapping slots. If that doesnt seem to do it (is this a dvb-s2 card perhaps?) you may need to hit up linuxtv.org. Often the problem will be a missing firmware, or the need for a more up to date driver.

http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/DVB-S_PCI_Cards
http://linuxtv.org/repo/

(if you need to update drivers, see "how to build the v4l-dvb kernel modules", and dont forget the corresponding firmwares)

mortimer50s2

08-22-2008, 12:52 AM

do i have to plug my computer into anything? cause both the tutorials seemed to make it seem like you just plug in the cards install mythtv and then you get tv on your computer
I was wondering how they plugged things in. I have one TV tuner in my Vista machine. Does each card need to me plugged into the cable/antenna?

I would have also liked to hear more about the TV tuner cards. I have the ATI Wonder 650 and the picture is not as good as a normal tv's

Thanks for doing the show. I have wanted to put together a media PC for my parents for a while.

computoman

08-22-2008, 03:47 AM

I just use a coax splitter and cables to add the connection for the tv card. It's that simple.

kai-chrostoph

08-22-2008, 11:17 AM

did you get any boot messages that look useful?
Nope, but I still testing... ;)

...(i actually have a technotrend dvb-s card, tho it seems to be autodetected).
My csrd is a Technotrend dvb-s (V1.6) too, so it has to work...

So I keep on trying.
I'll be back, if it's not working...

humanbeing

08-22-2008, 08:27 PM

empty3000

08-22-2008, 08:57 PM

If you are a newbie and you just want to do DVR (no photos and music) check out Beyond TV! It is very easy to setup and has a great interface. The one time price is $69.99 with free tv guide downloads forever.

Like with any pc based dvr software you need a decent machine (P4 2 Gh +) to play HD content.

http://www.snapstream.com/products/beyondtv/

tom61

08-23-2008, 07:30 AM

Why no KnoppMyth love? It's so much easier to set up than MythBuntu because of all the auto-detection and auto-configuration scripting. Just because something has "buntu" in the name doesn't make it easier :)

Interesting, I had thought the project was dead, but it appears that it received an update just last month. The last time I had tried it, a few months ago, it seemed to be little changed compared to the version I got shortly after Systm number 2. Mythbuntu looks a fair bit more polished than the last version of KnoppMyth I tried. Mythbuntu seems to have a fair bit of autodetection and setup, how much better is KnoppMyth in that regard?

metatr0n

08-24-2008, 01:24 PM

For anyone in the UK you can buy a cheap, small, and quite powerful MythTV system from http://efficientpc.co.uk/. I have to say the Wraith system with 2TB of storage, Hauppauge Nova-T 500 dual tuner and a Microsoft Media Center Remote all pre-configured for under £450 is a good deal.

Edit, I'd say if you want to build your own system go with LinuxMCE from http://www.linuxmce.org/

humanbeing

08-27-2008, 03:53 AM

Interesting, I had thought the project was dead, but it appears that it received an update just last month. The last time I had tried it, a few months ago, it seemed to be little changed compared to the version I got shortly after Systm number 2. Mythbuntu looks a fair bit more polished than the last version of KnoppMyth I tried.
KnoppMyth isn't about installer eye candy, so the installer hasn't changed in appearance for years. You can run MythTV in about 20 minutes after inserting the installation CD, though, so it's probably the fastest method to turn a computer into a Mythbox.
Mythbuntu seems to have a fair bit of autodetection and setup, how much better is KnoppMyth in that regard?
I wasn't aware that Mythbuntu had any autodetection and setup. KnoppMyth will autodetect and set up nVidia cards, most capture devices (including HDHomeRun), and most remote controls. R5.5 introduces scripting to make setup of digital audio trivial, but it has to be run manually at this point (though it's just one command). Even performance-based settings are made, based on polling the CPU and graphics capabilities.

computoman

09-01-2008, 02:45 AM

I just installed the latest Mythbuntu 8.04. I will probably have to wait till after Gustav to play with it.

peppersghost

09-01-2008, 06:48 AM

I thought Kevin and Dan did this back in like 2005.

computoman

09-01-2008, 12:16 PM

It was done on one of the first shows, but lot has changed since then,...... A lot is the same but their were a few important changes also. I wished they could of spent some time or at least mentioned in passing some the add-ons you can now to mythtv. You probably know what they are. I can't wait for hak5!!!!!!

piranio

09-11-2008, 05:53 AM

I have decided to go with linuxmce instead of mythtv, it is so much better packaged.

wiseadamj

09-15-2008, 05:00 AM

I'm very new to the idea of MythTV and the ideas behind the DVR from an old PC idea. I'm looking at putting a box together with either an old P4 1.8 GHz, 256 MB RAM system or a 2700+ AMD Athlon, 2 GB RAM box. On either of these boards, I'll be stuck with using a PCI-based tuner.

While the hardware I'm using is older, I'm trying to look for future use out of the system as well, namely the Digital Television Transition Act that will make analog features obsolete in February. This is where I start having issues since the terminology isn't something I'm familiar with. I'm finding terms such as ATSC, over-the-air digital, and SDTV that are making things a bit more difficult in determining what I should and shouldn't be looking for considering my plans for future use of the system. I know at some point I'll be switching from analog to a digital cable service, but I'm not sure how digital cable will be affected by the transition (which I'm speculating is not at all, but I won't assume) or if I'll even be switching to a digital service before February 17th.

Given the specifications and potential outcomes, what should I be looking for out of a tuner card? Does anybody have any suggestions for a tuner card that could meet my needs?

Additionally, what specifics should I be looking for from a video card? Is/are there any method(s) other than S-video to allow a television to act as the display?

tom61

09-15-2008, 05:18 AM

I'm finding terms such as ATSC, over-the-air digital, and SDTV that are making things a bit more difficult in determining what I should and shouldn't be looking for considering my plans for future use of the system.

ATSC is the over-the-air digital standard for the US, you'll want that if you live in the US. SDTV is lower-end digital, it means you'll be able to display HDTV digital signals on a 4:3 screen, more or less. My 17" 4:3 CRT TV is "SDTV" since it can display ATSC signals.

I know at some point I'll be switching from analog to a digital cable service, but I'm not sure how digital cable will be affected by the transition (which I'm speculating is not at all, but I won't assume) or if I'll even be switching to a digital service before February 17th.

Cable isn't mandated to change over, and many cable networks are putting up ads to say that normal users with analog will still be able to use cable for their TV needs. There is a problem is you have premium digital channels though, as you have to use an external tuner (usually the box that comes with your cable service) with analog recording if you're in the US. If you're not in the US, and your laws are compliant with such uses, you can get the signals decrypted using unofficial software, but the stupid DMCA makes that illegal in the US.

Given the specifications and potential outcomes, what should I be looking for out of a tuner card? Does anybody have any suggestions for a tuner card that could meet my needs?

Most newer cards should meet your needs.

Is/are there any method(s) other than S-video to allow a television to act as the display?

Depends on your TV. Higher end TVs can take DVI or VGA in, which are two of the best ways. Next there is Component output(Red, Green, and Blue cable ends), not quite as good as VGA for HDTV, but pretty close. On the very low end there is composite video (yellow cable end).