Dear Mr. Louderback

[eminemdrdre00]

THIS is why we are "hating": (Please listen to all 35 minutes)
http://www.mavrev.com/tmp/Audio_0001.wma

It has NOTHING to do with the show! We never HATED on him, we just didnt like his show. Then he went on his 35 minute rant and hated on US for hating his show.

[Phatlip]

THIS is why we are "hating": (Please listen to all 35 minutes)
http://www.mavrev.com/tmp/Audio_0001.wma

It has NOTHING to do with the show! We never HATED on him, we just didnt like his show. Then he went on his 35 minute rant and hated on US for hating his show.

It's not worth it dude. The issue of hate speech was played off like it was nothing.

They don't care. At least we know now.

I guess I'll be contacting several people this weekend. I really didn't expect them to brush this off. I'm shocked.

They don't care.

[eminemdrdre00]

Good news, Jim just said in the chatroom he promised to listen to the whole rant tomorrow during his plane ride.

[xibalba]

I don't think Jim addressed it because he hadn't heard it yet and wants to hear it first before commenting.

Don't think Brian did, because he didn't want to deal with that topic causing more arguing and it could possibly get him in trouble if the wrong thing was said and took in the wrong way.

Wait and see if Jim addresses after he actually hears it before contacting sponsers.

[esophagus]

Lets be honest, "saying we didn't like his show" is putting that thread quite lightly. People were rude and he was rude back. He shouldn't have said what he said but neither should most of the people in the first 6-8 pages of that thread.

[eminemdrdre00]

Lets be honest, "saying we didn't like his show" is putting that thread quite lightly. People were rude and he was rude back. He shouldn't have said what he said but neither should most of the people in the first 6-8 pages of that thread.

But lets not forget...his whole show was telling MTV to "eat shit and die" because he didnt like THEIR show. I think the comments about his show were a bit over the line because of the way he reviewed MTVs "Cribs".

[Phatlip]

Lets be honest, "saying we didn't like his show" is putting that thread quite lightly. People were rude and he was rude back. He shouldn't have said what he said but neither should most of the people in the first 6-8 pages of that thread.

I'm sorry, but I find nothing wrong with someone saying they don't like a show.

Yeah, I'm sure there were some people that were jackasses about it, but there's no need to sugar coat everything. If you don't like something- you don't like it. It's not the end of the world. You're certainly right, you don't react the way he did. You take in what everyone says and try to make it better.

But the issue here is how he reacted and the things he said. No good came of his stunt. It reflected horribly on him, his show and the company. It's just bad business.

[esophagus]

But lets not forget...his whole show was telling MTV to "eat shit and die" because he didnt like THEIR show. I think the comments about his show were a bit over the line because of the way he reviewed MTVs "Cribs".
No matter which way you shake it everyone behaved poorly. Thats all I'm saying.

[JazGalaxy]

I actually saw this thread and listened to the audio before watching the show.

Here's what I think:

First, I like the show. I enjoyed it.

Second, I think the reason JV responded the way he did in the audio because his feelings were clearly hurt. I think he fancies himself the voice of the people, and when you go out front to lead a group of people only to find out that the people behind you are attacking you from behind, it has to be humiliating. I think that was clearly what was happening. It's like he thought he was DJ Professor K from Jet Grind Radio or something. Some kind of self styled pirate radio jockey. The audeince just didn't take it that way. And, again, I liked it.

Third, I think Revision 3 isn't what it once was perceived to be. With shows like The Broken and Systm, I think Revision 3 was supposed to be that underground voice of the streets kind of network that every nerd wants to watch. There's a romanticism about it that speaks to 18-24 year olds. But, I think Revision 3 is no longer that company. You can clearly see it in Diggnation these days. Its a company and it exists to make money, OF COURSE they dont' care about a dust up going on in internet forums. That kind of thing isn't important to a company.

Revision 3 are sellouts, but I don't necessarily blame them for it.

[speed]

Lets be honest, "saying we didn't like his show" is putting that thread quite lightly. People were rude and he was rude back. He shouldn't have said what he said but neither should most of the people in the first 6-8 pages of that thread.

No question about it, but he's the host of the show, he has to be more diplomatic about it. I'm not saying he has to be all nice about haters, but he doesn't have to go on a 35 minute diatribe about the whole viewership of the network. That's not going to help you. Look at Brian Brushwood, he doesn't take shit from trolls, but he does it in a way where it's all a big joke. He puts the hater in his place, but makes sure that he only hits the hater. Look at when a person accused him of providing no actual bar stunts or tricks, so he linked to every episode that had a trick or gag to pull at the bar (every episode minus a couple). It was mildly unprofessional (mainly the sarcasm), but it was done in a way where the troll got put in his place, but no one else got offended (also notice that he always ends up asking on twitter if he went too far whenever he does something like this, he doesn't want to hurt the audience).

The fact of the matter is, he got a taste of his own medicine, and he should have realized that he'd open himself up to stuff like this when he trashed Cribs the way he did and told the MTV execs to "fuck off, eat shit and die" for making it. Even if some users went too far (which I'm sure they did, but I don't feel like digging through 39 pages of comments), he should have calmed down before doing a response. Take a few deep breaths, write out what you want to say, read it later, get someone else to read it, then have some tea or something, read it one last time, then when you record your argument/rant, stick to the script. Don't deviate no matter how witty or biting that argument you just thought of is. Not only do you end up debating, rather than arguing or yelling, you ensure you don't say stupid things like "zit on your moms dick"

[DJ Silent]

lolol

http://thunkdifferent.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/normal_internet-seriousbusiness.jpg

[nesto37]

lolol

http://thunkdifferent.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/normal_internet-seriousbusiness.jpg

hahahaha

[speed]

Also, a comment on his rant:
You may have done all the recording and editing yourself, but that is no excuse for recording it with a crappy mic and webcam. If a relatively major internet video company says they want to give you a show, but the pilot has to be done completely by you, you still pay $80 for a semi-decent mic and stand (don't expect a lav. mic) and at the very least, borrow a digital camcorder from a friend or something. I have a Minidv camcorder from 2003 that's not great, but still a better quality than my webcam, so I'd use that. You have to have at least one friend with an OK camcorder to do your show with.

[tromoly]

Also, a comment on his rant:
You may have done all the recording and editing yourself, but that is no excuse for recording it with a crappy mic and webcam. If a relatively major internet video company says they want to give you a show, but the pilot has to be done completely by you, you still pay $80 for a semi-decent mic and stand (don't expect a lav. mic) and at the very least, borrow a digital camcorder from a friend or something. I have a Minidv camcorder from 2003 that's not great, but still a better quality than my webcam, so I'd use that. You have to have at least one friend with an OK camcorder to do your show with.

It's also minorly annoying that he tweeted about people hating his "pilot" that was shot 5 months ago. In that time he could have looked at it and thought to himself that it needs to be a bit higher quality and redone the whole thing, but with better audio/video.

[stevet819]

Ok the show was on Monday...It's now Wed and people are still whining...Wow sounds like your feelings were hurt since a guy on the radio called you names. Get over it. I can't believe people are holding on to this for so long. This is the internet. It's a show. Who cares already! Don't people have lives outside the internet or is spending all of your time going on and on your life? Just asking?

[jackie13]

lolol

http://thunkdifferent.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/normal_internet-seriousbusiness.jpg

omg. i am so insulted by that photo... are you trying to say asians with glasses, wearing track jackets and collared shirts, take the internet too seriously... stop right there... i dont appreciate the racism... and i dont appreciate that hatespeech...

[krishnancc]

omg. i am so insulted by that photo... are you trying to say asians with glasses, wearing track jackets and collared shirts, take the internet too seriously... stop right there... i dont appreciate the racism... and i dont appreciate that hatespeech...

why are you trying to start a race issue? that's not cool, its not the issue and you know it.

[tokenuser]

Dear Mr Louderback,

I suspect that many on the forums are having a hard time distinguishing the difference between a person and a persona. For example Stephen Colbert is not the character that Stephen Colbert plays on TV (they just share the same name). Sacha Baron Cohen is not Ali G, Borat, or Bruno. Similarly, I suspect that Jeff Vandergrift as a real person is a nice guy, and is not the JV character he plays on the radio.

Sometimes the real person leaks through to the persona, as evidenced by his interracial marriage, and week of shows dedicated to a murdered gay highschool student. Making the break from the persona to bring a human face to radio is difficult.

BUT, radio is a one way medium. It is pushed to the listeners. There is very little mechanism for feedback to the personalities behind the mics. When the radio medium is translated to an online environment the feedback is immediate. In a radio show , if someone is to call in they know what they are expecting - they will be publicly derided onair for the entertainment of other viewers. It is still a push media relationship though through a series of serial communications from callers.

The web is different.

It is an exciting landscape of opportunities, and I appreciate the way Revision3 is exploring those options. TV has translated well into the online realm. You are a timeshiftable microbroadcaster of niche content that would otherwise be ignored by the mass media outlets. For that I thank you.

Alongside this broadcast medium, the web also provides the technology for instant feedback via places like these forums and twitter. "Old media" (and I am looking at CNN here) has tried to bring new media elements to old school broadcasting via reading its witter feed. They dont get it though. They treat twitter as an instant "letters to the editor" section and there is no interaction.

When you look at oldschool media that would adapt well to an online world, radio does seem like a god choice .... especially talkback radio, and personality based radio shows like JV has.

But the interaction is different. It is not a "next caller on the line" type deal, it is more akin to a townhall meeting. Everyone gets the floor, people have multiple conversations. I don't think Jeff quite got that, and underestimated his new audience.

The issue at hand isn't the new show, it was the backlash to the negative feedback to the pilot for the show.

Should JV apologise? No.
Should Revision3 apologise? No.
Should Jeff Vanderrift apologise? Yes. He is the real person here. He is JVs "management".
Should a number of Revision3 forum members apologise? Absolutely. Its a fine line between constructive criticism and being downright insulting. Since I have known many of them (online) for several years, I am even more ashamed about their actions.

Anyway, this is a storm in a teacup and will blow over shortly. Jeff needs to reign JV in a little, step out from behind the mic, and participate on the forums a little. It will be rough at first, but will go a long way to strengthening the community.

Its a brave new world out there, and I am happy to be along for the ride.

Regards,
Craig "TokenUser" Evans
Revision3 Forum Moderator.

[Murphy1d]

Token..
Amen.

[jackie13]

why are you trying to start a race issue? that's not cool, its not the issue and you know it.

i was joking... and you know it...

i love asian people with glasses that wear collared shirts and track jacket... they are herra coor...
(oh... let me say this... i am an asian who wears glasses and wears collared shirts and track jackets...)

[Phatlip]

Accepting the word ****ot like it's nothing is the cause of things such as the murder of gay high school students. I realize that's pushing it to the extreme, and I'm not suggesting this one comment alone would cause that. But if everyone had that sort of mentality, there would be many other stories like this.

I have a serious question. Many people are obviously offended by a word considered to be hate speech. When so many are offended, shouldn't you just take it upon yourself and think: "Damn, I pissed those people off" and just apologize? Is it really that difficult to to do? All I want to know is if JV and Rev3 thinks using this word is acceptable. I want to know that because frankly, I'm getting mixed signals. The word is censored on these forums, and if any of us were to call someone that name here, we would more than likely be banned for hate speech. But it's okay when one of Revision3's people go on AIR and call their own customers (some of whom are gay) that very name. It's ridiculous.

It's not hard to apologize. The fact he's not means he or Revision3 doesn't care about the comment.

[chuckles]

lolol

http://thunkdifferent.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/normal_internet-seriousbusiness.jpg

Thanks. My new avatar.

-chuckles-

[Phatlip]

And for the record, I'm not going to apologize to JV. I didn't do anything wrong. I didn't like his show. Me not liking his show is nothing compared to what he did.

I don't care about his show. I even said that if it stayed I didn't mind, I just wouldn't watch.

http://revision3.com/forum/showpost.php?p=516481&postcount=109

My issue is with the attacks he made on his show.

[Guytheninja]

Should JV apologise? No.
Should Revision3 apologise? No.
Should Jeff Vanderrift apologise? Yes. He is the real person here. He is JVs "management".
Should a number of Revision3 forum members apologise? Absolutely. Its a fine line between constructive criticism and being downright insulting. Since I have known many of them (online) for several years, I am even more ashamed about their actions.


I agree with you Token. I don't mind apologizing if I said anything overtly out of line.

However, I think he will do what Brian said last night. If it works and he gets a million downloads a week --- he sure isn't going to apologize. If his show flops, he may say "well lets try and start on the right foot -- insulting people is how shock-jocks work". Etc...

But seriously, it is very obvious that many people on this forum have never seen a shock jock before, and they are really playing into his hands.

[Guytheninja]

i was joking... and you know it...

i love asian people with glasses that wear collared shirts and track jacket... they are herra coor...
(oh... let me say this... i am an asian who wears glasses and wears collared shirts and track jackets...)

I think this sums up the real debate on these boards.

[xibalba]

I don't see how some ok with racial profiling and doesn't think it is wrong, can be so mad over him using that word.

[Phatlip]

I don't see how some ok with racial profiling and doesn't think it is wrong, can be so mad over him using that word.

Who here is okay with racial profiling? Just wondering. It is a good question though. I can't answer though because I'm very much against racial profiling.

[xibalba]

As far as the question of "Is Racial Profiling wrong"? I don't think its wrong, I think its part of human nature sometimes. Its wrong if its acted upon (pulling African Americans over due to their race for example).

When i mention it being part of human nature consider the following situations:

The attacks on 9/11 were all carried out by men of middle eastern decent. I've never been on a plane my entire life, but I can ensure you I would be nervous to get on a plane for many reasons. If I saw a Muslim on a plane I think the first thing that would come to my mind would be 9/11. Thats as far as it would go though, I wouldn't stare him down or suggest that he is a terrorist. His race would only being a reminder of the event which is what I mean towards it being human nature.

......

[jackie13]

Who here is okay with racial profiling? Just wondering. It is a good question though. I can't answer though because I'm very much against racial profiling.

i dunno about you guys, but when i see an old asian female driver, i try to stay outta their way...

[Phatlip]

......

Um. Link to post for context? I can't remember how long ago that was. Of course you ignored the countless drawn out debates I've had looking down on racial profiling.

[Phatlip]

I found the thread myself. Bad things happen when you take things out of context. I went on to say:

Regardless to any stats, it doesn't justify the fact that racial profiling is silly. Why is this - because everything is unique, not all things are the same. I'm guessing almost everyone that posted in this thread is a white male. If any of you are having trouble understanding why racial profiling is wrong take a look at your next car insurance bill and compare it to a girls. Young males have to pay more for the simple fact that statictics show they are more likely to speed. Do you think its fair for you to pay more just because you have a penis regardless of how you drive? Same thing.

[quantumblink]

Dear Mr Louderback,

I suspect that many on the forums are having a hard time distinguishing the difference between a person and a persona. For example Stephen Colbert is not the character that Stephen Colbert plays on TV (they just share the same name). Sacha Baron Cohen is not Ali G, Borat, or Bruno. Similarly, I suspect that Jeff Vandergrift as a real person is a nice guy, and is not the JV character he plays on the radio.

Sometimes the real person leaks through to the persona, as evidenced by his interracial marriage, and week of shows dedicated to a murdered gay highschool student. Making the break from the persona to bring a human face to radio is difficult.

BUT, radio is a one way medium. It is pushed to the listeners. There is very little mechanism for feedback to the personalities behind the mics. When the radio medium is translated to an online environment the feedback is immediate. In a radio show , if someone is to call in they know what they are expecting - they will be publicly derided onair for the entertainment of other viewers. It is still a push media relationship though through a series of serial communications from callers.

The web is different.

It is an exciting landscape of opportunities, and I appreciate the way Revision3 is exploring those options. TV has translated well into the online realm. You are a timeshiftable microbroadcaster of niche content that would otherwise be ignored by the mass media outlets. For that I thank you.

Alongside this broadcast medium, the web also provides the technology for instant feedback via places like these forums and twitter. "Old media" (and I am looking at CNN here) has tried to bring new media elements to old school broadcasting via reading its witter feed. They dont get it though. They treat twitter as an instant "letters to the editor" section and there is no interaction.

When you look at oldschool media that would adapt well to an online world, radio does seem like a god choice .... especially talkback radio, and personality based radio shows like JV has.

But the interaction is different. It is not a "next caller on the line" type deal, it is more akin to a townhall meeting. Everyone gets the floor, people have multiple conversations. I don't think Jeff quite got that, and underestimated his new audience.

The issue at hand isn't the new show, it was the backlash to the negative feedback to the pilot for the show.

Should JV apologise? No.
Should Revision3 apologise? No.
Should Jeff Vanderrift apologise? Yes. He is the real person here. He is JVs "management".
Should a number of Revision3 forum members apologise? Absolutely. Its a fine line between constructive criticism and being downright insulting. Since I have known many of them (online) for several years, I am even more ashamed about their actions.

Anyway, this is a storm in a teacup and will blow over shortly. Jeff needs to reign JV in a little, step out from behind the mic, and participate on the forums a little. It will be rough at first, but will go a long way to strengthening the community.

Its a brave new world out there, and I am happy to be along for the ride.

Regards,
Craig "TokenUser" Evans
Revision3 Forum Moderator.

This dude is totally on point with everything he has said. Not just this post but every post on this exhausted subject.

[joeyrock]

I'm reading all this stuff and listening to this audio at the moment.. this whole "incident" is pretty funny to follow.

So this guy's "character" or whatever is to be a monumental fuckwit. That's fine, some people make a good living doing that. The question is whether or not that spew of anger is something you are interested in spending your time listening to or watching. Personally, no, it's not something I'm interested in, regardless of the content it just gives me a headache.

[jlouderb]

We'll get there, thanks for the rational comments here.

Revision3 will continue to push the edge, as we try to figure out what works and what doesn't. Expect us to try things that won't work.. and to do things that might seem strange at first, but end up being awesome.

I really value all the great comments from our core audience, who really care for Revision3 and want us to keep developing great shows for them.

But I also love the creativity and passion from some of the new show creators we're talking to.

Give it 5 shows, see what happens - and remember, you don't have to watch it if you don't want to. Hopefully everyone will love everything we do, but that's not going to happen.

And remember, we are in business to make money, for our investors, our employees and in the end, our fans - if we don't make money, we won't be able to do any shows. Part of making money is expanding the audience and bringing new viewers into the tent. Hopefully our passionate fans can understand that our survival is predicated on growing viewership - and that's what we're trying to do here.

Thanks again to everyone for commenting, sharing their feelings and CARING.

jim

[Guytheninja]

Give it 5 shows, see what happens - and remember, you don't have to watch it if you don't want to. Hopefully everyone will love everything we do, but that's not going to happen.

Only five shows? It would be interesting to see the download numbers of each of these episodes. (hint, hint)


And remember, we are in business to make money, for our investors, our employees and in the end, our fans - if we don't make money, we won't be able to do any shows.


LOL, its sad that now-a-days this has to be spelled out. If JV ends up being a cash cow, he is going to stay.


Part of making money is expanding the audience and bringing new viewers into the tent. Hopefully our passionate fans can understand that our survival is predicated on growing viewership - and that's what we're trying to do here.


That sounds great Mr. Louderback, but I still am not convinced that this show will get enough extra viewership. Hopefully you may end up proving me wrong 10 episodes from now.

[eminemdrdre00]

We'll get there, thanks for the rational comments here.

Revision3 will continue to push the edge, as we try to figure out what works and what doesn't. Expect us to try things that won't work.. and to do things that might seem strange at first, but end up being awesome.

I really value all the great comments from our core audience, who really care for Revision3 and want us to keep developing great shows for them.

But I also love the creativity and passion from some of the new show creators we're talking to.

Give it 5 shows, see what happens - and remember, you don't have to watch it if you don't want to. Hopefully everyone will love everything we do, but that's not going to happen.

And remember, we are in business to make money, for our investors, our employees and in the end, our fans - if we don't make money, we won't be able to do any shows. Part of making money is expanding the audience and bringing new viewers into the tent. Hopefully our passionate fans can understand that our survival is predicated on growing viewership - and that's what we're trying to do here.

Thanks again to everyone for commenting, sharing their feelings and CARING.

jim
Thanks for commenting! I wish you'd speak a bit about JVs 35 minute audio clip though...

[Mr. Underachiever]

Give it 5 shows, see what happens

I don't know if they'll actually do that. They didn't give Social Brew five shows.

Just sayin'... >_>

[Phatlip]

We'll get there, thanks for the rational comments here.

Revision3 will continue to push the edge, as we try to figure out what works and what doesn't. Expect us to try things that won't work.. and to do things that might seem strange at first, but end up being awesome.

I really value all the great comments from our core audience, who really care for Revision3 and want us to keep developing great shows for them.

But I also love the creativity and passion from some of the new show creators we're talking to.

Give it 5 shows, see what happens - and remember, you don't have to watch it if you don't want to. Hopefully everyone will love everything we do, but that's not going to happen.

And remember, we are in business to make money, for our investors, our employees and in the end, our fans - if we don't make money, we won't be able to do any shows. Part of making money is expanding the audience and bringing new viewers into the tent. Hopefully our passionate fans can understand that our survival is predicated on growing viewership - and that's what we're trying to do here.

Thanks again to everyone for commenting, sharing their feelings and CARING.

jim

Thank you for commenting Mr. Louderback, and I agree with everything you said. I am however interested in hearing your thoughts on the rant as that seems to be the major issue now.

I realize you're a busy guy, but you really should take the time to listen to it. I'm interested to hear the companies stance on what transpired during that particular broadcast.

[myrridin]

I appreciate a response, but I don't feel you've addressed the real issue regarding his "rant" and slamming rev3 viewers on the whole. I agree that your responsibility to the company and the investors is to make money. Unfortunately I feel that by alienating portions of your viewer base by not defending them against or acknowledging direct attacks on them is not a keen strategy. I'm not a business major (never could stand the stuff myself), but I am a scientist, and I believe in the process of experimentation. So how about an experiment.

In a hypothetical, I and every rev3 viewer that is offended by being called a f***ot will stop purchasing domain names with rev3 codes, and every one of your new fans from JVs radio show can start. Do you think this will fill the gap, or does your strategy include new sponsors that don't cater to f***ot nerds such as ourselves?

I want to have an intelligent and adult conversation on this matter, but I have yet to hear anybody at rev3 make an official statement that intolerant terminology like f***ot is not endorsed. You don't have to even make him stop saying it, just say that you realize it's not cool. I learned that when I was a child, and it astonishes and depresses me that the rest of the world didn't seem to have been given the same lesson.

Why is the world so okay with this? Why hasn't this disgusting word gone the way of the racial slurs? If he said the n-word, you'd all be flipping wigs right now. For the record I am bisexual, and yes I'm offended when I'm called a derogatory and bigoted term such as that.

I've heard people say JV is a great guy, that he's not intolerant or bigoted in any way, and I'm actually willing to believe that. I recognize people have weaknesses, and that they say things they later realize they shouldn't have. Of the 35 minutes, I couldn't care less about 34.5 of them, but when people hear words like that and don't speak out, they enable and appear to support a society of injustice and intolerance. Call me a nerd, I don't care. Nobody's ever been strapped to the back of a truck and dragged to death for being a nerd.

At the end of the day, I realize JV isn't the only person who uses language like that. However, in his show he states he's "one of us". I don't know about the rest of "us" but I would never dream of calling somebody a f*g, period. I guess maybe I don't fit your mold of "us", but then again I rarely do.

If you want to appease your investors and your wallets, feel free. That's what the capitalist system is based on. If you want to be decent human beings, then speak up, and realize that what is does not always have to be, and only by discussing and debating human equality can we hope to grow and move forward.

If you've read this whole post, I applaud your tenacity. I know it was a long one :-)

Have an excellent evening, and let's work towards a world with "all love, no hate".

[Phatlip]

I appreciate a response, but I don't feel you've addressed the real issue regarding his "rant" and slamming rev3 viewers on the whole. I agree that your responsibility to the company and the investors is to make money. Unfortunately I feel that by alienating portions of your viewer base by not defending them against or acknowledging direct attacks on them is not a keen strategy. I'm not a business major (never could stand the stuff myself), but I am a scientist, and I believe in the process of experimentation. So how about an experiment.

In a hypothetical, I and every rev3 viewer that is offended by being called a f***ot will stop purchasing domain names with rev3 codes, and every one of your new fans from JVs radio show can start. Do you think this will fill the gap, or does your strategy include new sponsors that don't cater to f***ot nerds such as ourselves?

I want to have an intelligent and adult conversation on this matter, but I have yet to hear anybody at rev3 make an official statement that intolerant terminology like f***ot is not endorsed. You don't have to even make him stop saying it, just say that you realize it's not cool. I learned that when I was a child, and it astonishes and depresses me that the rest of the world didn't seem to have been given the same lesson.

Why is the world so okay with this? Why hasn't this disgusting word gone the way of the racial slurs? If he said the n-word, you'd all be flipping wigs right now. For the record I am bisexual, and yes I'm offended when I'm called a derogatory and bigoted term such as that.

I've heard people say JV is a great guy, that he's not intolerant or bigoted in any way, and I'm actually willing to believe that. I recognize people have weaknesses, and that they say things they later realize they shouldn't have. Of the 35 minutes, I couldn't care less about 34.5 of them, but when people hear words like that and don't speak out, they enable and appear to support a society of injustice and intolerance. Call me a nerd, I don't care. Nobody's ever been strapped to the back of a truck and dragged to death for being a nerd.

At the end of the day, I realize JV isn't the only person who uses language like that. However, in his show he states he's "one of us". I don't know about the rest of "us" but I would never dream of calling somebody a f*g, period. I guess maybe I don't fit your mold of "us", but then again I rarely do.

If you want to appease your investors and your wallets, feel free. That's what the capitalist system is based on. If you want to be decent human beings, then speak up, and realize that what is does not always have to be, and only by discussing and debating human equality can we hope to grow and move forward.

If you've read this whole post, I applaud your tenacity. I know it was a long one :-)

Have an excellent evening, and let's work towards a world with "all love, no hate".

What an excellent post. Kudos.

[peep]

Revision3 is a business that is in business to make money, so why have we not seen any official legal statement that revision3 is not responsible for what JV has or will say? You know at least the standard "the views of ... do not necessarily reflect the views of revision3". It's great to support new talent and make them feel free to do what they do, especially one with a built in base, but you really should think about covering yourselves.
I would think a guy with this kind of act can get expensive quick if you don't at least cover the basics.

[quantumblink]

Thank you for commenting Mr. Louderback, and I agree with everything you said. I am however interested in hearing your thoughts on the rant as that seems to be the major issue now.

I realize you're a busy guy, but you really should take the time to listen to it. I'm interested to hear the companies stance on what transpired during that particular broadcast.

Please boss please look at the "rant". I'm so hurt. Don't you care about my individual feelings and my 3 compadres? PLEASE PLEASE look at the "rant" and share my viewpoint. Aren't you as hurt as I am?

"I'm interested to hear the companies stance on what transpired during that particular broadcast."

AKA please side with me......I'm losing credibility faster than Mike Tyson at a Miss Black America pageant. Won't you feel my pain?

[joeyrock]

Please boss please look at the "rant". I'm so hurt. Don't you care about my individual feelings and my 3 compadres? PLEASE PLEASE look at the "rant" and share my viewpoint. Aren't you as hurt as I am?

"I'm interested to hear the companies stance on what transpired during that particular broadcast."

AKA please side with me......I'm losing credibility faster than Mike Tyson at a Miss Black America pageant. Won't you feel my pain?

Phatlip isn't losing credibility. He has just kept going and everyone else is hanging back to see what happens next. That doesn't make him wrong, just tenacious.

Bottom line JV insulted the forum members and said their mothers have dicks, called them ****ots etc etc. The forum members are Rev3's most steadfast customers and the one's who care enough to go out into the world and pimp Rev3. Of the few shows I've watched I know I've done that... mostly without even realising it. It's a valid grievance to be pissed off and want Louderback to defend them and it's reasonable to think that Jim cares what they think. If he didn't he wouldn't even look at the forums.

I'm curious, since you are a JV fan, how many people from here have gone to JV's forums and started up over there doing what you are doing here? I'm guessing there isn't anyone doing that. Generally speaking the people here bitch, myself included, but we don't really go out of our way to pick on people or call them childish names. So it's bizarre when that's directed at us. We'll call some show out for being crap and voice our knee jerk reactions... but I don't see that that anything to cry about. Brushwood didn't. He motored on, was confident people would like him if they got to know him, he was right and now he's part of the family.

Lastly, I'm going to defend Louderback, he gets a lot of stick for stuff round these parts. But he did say in the bbliveshow that he wouldn't close this forum after JV's feelings were hurt and he requested it be closed. That's sensible because it would have caused a lot more of a forum outcry than there has already been.

[nesto37]

Phatlip isn't losing credibility. He has just kept going and everyone else is hanging back to see what happens next. That doesn't make him wrong, just tenacious.

Bottom line JV insulted the forum members and said their mothers have dicks, called them ****ots etc etc. The forum members are Rev3's most steadfast customers and the one's who care enough to go out into the world and pimp Rev3. Of the few shows I've watched I know I've done that... mostly without even realising it. It's a valid grievance to be pissed off and want Louderback to defend them and it's reasonable to think that Jim cares what they think. If he didn't he wouldn't even look at the forums.

I'm curious, since you are a JV fan, how many people from here have gone to JV's forums and started up over there doing what you are doing here? I'm guessing there isn't anyone doing that. Generally speaking the people here bitch, myself included, but we don't really go out of our way to pick on people or call them childish names. So it's bizarre when that's directed at us. We'll call some show out for being crap and voice our knee jerk reactions... but I don't see that that anything to cry about. Brushwood didn't. He motored on, was confident people would like him if they got to know him, he was right and now he's part of the family.

Lastly, I'm going to defend Louderback, he gets a lot of stick for stuff round these parts. But he did say in the bbliveshow that he wouldn't close this forum after JV's feelings were hurt and he requested it be closed. That's sensible because it would have caused a lot more of a forum outcry than there has already been.

I don't think the JV's fan base is connected to the "forum culture" I wasn't until a few days ago. The people who have followed his work are really diverse. I know people from "here" went on his twitter talking mess. So it’s the same thing. JV isn’t Bushwood. (THANK GOD!)I watched his show, watched his live thing about JV. He was a cool guy, but a really different guy. He doesn't seem like the confrontation type to me. JV is different, I’ve never seen him take drama lightly, he won't hold someone's hand in a conflict, So far, he's dealt with this the same way I’ve heard him handle many situations. With jokes, putting gas on the fire, and I hope eventually talking it out.

You would be surprised to know, the name calling has been pretty balanced. Both Rev3 and JV people have participated. If anything, there have been more Rev 3 people going at it with the same JV person. It’s been pretty funny to me. And over all it seems like people are taking things that are said waaay to serious. But that’s what makes it even funnier.

I’m with you; I’ve been pretty calm, just trying to connect thoughts, giving a different perspective then a lot of what I’m reading.

It’s hard for me to connect to people wanting an apology. It’s crazy. I've never thought I was owed an apology from a company or show I supported. I've gotten mad, or disagreed, but I never tried end it all. seems really extreme, and seems like JV is catching a lot of emotions that have to do with where this company has been and where it is going... and that’s not fair to him...I’d be pissed.. And it’s those people who his blast was directed toward. If he came out and apologized, cool. If he doesn't...cool, he better come out with some great episodes. Why can't it stop there?

[ZeroNeuro]

Basically, the forum and Rev3 community are very loyal and tight knit. And entirely different group than his friends and followers belong to (I am assuming). He came to the network, insulted everyone in the community by making stereotype slants and essentially trashed his audience.

What this tells us is that he really doesn't care about the Revision 3 community and just does not WANT to belong here. It's kind of hard to welcome someone who would rather just not be welcome. And since there are people who are friends of the community who have Beta shows, there is also a sense of betrayal I suppose.

I think the main problem here is that there is a clashing of ideals and cultures. People just don't understand or appreciate the other side of the coin because they have no idea how that side operates.

I'm fine with JV's show. I think that he deserves his say as anyone else does.

But you have to admit that he really overreacted. Also the words he chose are not acceptable words to use when you are calling people names.

Let me explain what I want an apology for. I want an apology for the usage of the bigoted words that he used. As soon as he crossed the line and insulted people by calling them f****ts ... that was unacceptable.

What he should have done, is go post by post and reply to people who were trashing his show the most. Without calling them names, and tear them a new one. That would have been totally acceptable. But he went into "you are ALL..." mode, and did a blanket stereotype. Which is really not all that well received by most people in a community. The geek jokes were pretty funny, I'll admit that I laughed a bit at some of them because of how off the wall they were.

DO I hate JV? No, absolutely not. Didn't like show 1, but that was only 5 minutes ya know? If he were to handle the negative criticism in a more mature and thoughtful manner it would have been awesome. His time to shine!

Instead he caused a lot of really harsh reactions. You just can't always fight fire by adding gasoline. Sometimes, things just have to be diplomatic.

And I understand that JV might not be that kinda guy. Hey, not everyone is. But this community is not his typical crowd, ya know? It was like the Blues Brothers at a Country & Western bar... but without the chicken wire.

[joeyrock]

It was like the Blues Brothers at a Country & Western bar... but without the chicken wire.

Wait are you saying JV is the Blue Brothers and we are country and western bottle throwers... bad analogy. :p He ain't no blue brothers, they know how to keep their mouth shut. :p

[tokenuser]

It was like the Blues Brothers at a Country & Western bar... but without the chicken wire.Huh? Stand by your man or Rawhide??

[Murphy1d]

It was like the Blues Brothers at a Country & Western bar... but without the chicken wire.

He's on a mission from God? :D

[tokenuser]

It was like the Blues Brothers at a Country & Western bar... but without the chicken wire.Are we the neo-Nazis chasing JV across the country, or is that him?

[Guytheninja]

Are we the neo-Nazis chasing JV across the country, or is that him?

The forum members are Carrie Fisher packing the bazooka :D.

[stevet819]

The funny thing is everyone is so surprised that JV called people names on this forum, but don't act like you are all innocent. There were a lot of trash talking about JV and he replied back. So basically if you are man enough to talk shit then you should be man enough to take it back without your whining and crying.

You guys remind me of elementary school...Someone called you a bad word and you go run to the principle (Mr Louderback) in this case...Get over it already.

[joeyrock]

The funny thing is everyone is so surprised that JV called people names on this forum, but don't act like you are all innocent. There were a lot of trash talking about JV and he replied back. So basically if you are man enough to talk shit then you should be man enough to take it back without your whining and crying.

You guys remind me of elementary school...Someone called you a bad word and you go run to the principle (Mr Louderback) in this case...Get over it already.

You see that's the other funny thing about this.. This forum is expected to be the adults and take it all on the chin and JV and his fans are free to call anyone anything they want.

JV/Rev3 releases a show and people him/it crap. JV then gets upset, asks Louderback to shut down the forum, Jim says no and then JV calls people here mother dicks, ****ots and yoda fuckers.... that pisses off the people here even more.. :p So who exactly appears the child in this here run of events? Who ran to the principle and who couldn't 'take it on the chin' originally? :p This is the internet, you are going to get some negative reactions first. The people who haven't made a decision yet don't have anything to say to counter the haters. People don't like anything new, JV just didn't understand the process.

[tokenuser]

... JV then gets upset, asks Louderback to shut down the forum, Jim says no and then ...JV asked to get the forum shutdown? Was that in the BBLive show the other night??

[jackie13]

JV then gets upset, asks Louderback to shut down the forum, Jim says no and then....

jv asked him to shut down the forum? really?

[joeyrock]

JV asked to get the forum shutdown? Was that in the BBLive show the other night??

Yeah. Louderback said it. Can't give you a time code but I only watched it this morning. Pretty certain.

[eminemdrdre00]

JV asked to get the forum shutdown? Was that in the BBLive show the other night??

Yes that came right from Mr. Louderback. JV requested that the entire JVs World forum be shut down! Thankfully, Mr. Louderback said he couldnt do that.

[jackie13]

Yes that came right from Mr. Louderback. JV requested that the entire JVs World forum be shut down! Thankfully, Mr. Louderback said he couldnt do that.

oh wow... i missed that... i didnt know that at all...

[wayoutwest]

oh wow... i missed that... i didnt know that at all...

Yeah, when I heard that I was like, "Wait, seriously?"

Like his show or not, I don't care (I personally thought it was lame and uninspired). But this guy has shown his complete lack of maturity, class, and integrity throughout this entire process. Does Revision3 really want someone like that representing them? I understand their desire to broaden their audience and I believe shows like XLR8 and JVs world are great for that. Unfortunately, JV has shown a laundry list of less than admirable qualities in less than a week of being on Rev3.

[tokenuser]

I noticed (via the @JVsworld twitter account) that today's radio show would focus on bullying.

Wonder what inspired that topic?

[jackie13]

I noticed (via the @JVsworld twitter account) that today's radio show would focus on bullying.

Wonder what inspired that topic?

he said that he was inspired by oprah... she had a show yesterday about 2 kids who committed suicide because they were being bullied...

and because everyone on rev3 are onesie wearing, racecar bed owning, leia loving bullies... jk...

[joeyrock]

I noticed (via the @JVsworld twitter account) that today's radio show would focus on bullying.

Wonder what inspired that topic?

Well, we've all given him some rounded, well thought out comments to misappropriate. Lets see what happens with that. :p

[tokenuser]

and because everyone on rev3 are onesie wearing, racecar bed owning, leia loving bullies... jk...Its not a onesie ... its a racing suit.

http://nascar.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pG01-2811320reg.jpg

[jackie13]

but i love buying those adult onesies at target during winter time... theyre so freakin comfy... but maybe its different cuz im a chick... i think i would be a bit weirded out if my man was wearing one of those... lol...

[travislopes]

JV asked to get the forum shutdown? Was that in the BBLive show the other night??

http://bbliveshow.com/episodes/1471238 - Time code: 1:27:40

[tokenuser]

http://bbliveshow.com/episodes/1471238 - Time code: 1:27:40I've been flat out with "real life" and hadn't listened to the BBLive show yet. I appreciate the link with a timecode.

I have no issues with JLo's comments. I think he balanced it out fairly well.

I suspect his "I'm sorry if anyone is offended" is as close to an apology people will get ... and to be honest, I think that is about all that is needed.

Oh yeah!! 1:36, Brian thinks I did the smart thing shutting down the thread.

Woo hoo. EAT FIRE AND DIE! :)

[eminemdrdre00]

I've been flat out with "real life" and hadn't listened to the BBLive show yet. I appreciate the link with a timecode.

I have no issues with JLo's comments. I think he balanced it out fairly well.

I suspect his "I'm sorry if anyone is offended" is as close to an apology people will get ... and to be honest, I think that is about all that is needed.

Oh yeah!! 1:36, Brian thinks I did the smart thing shutting down the thread.

Woo hoo. EAT FIRE AND DIE! :)

lol @ JLo.

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb115/P_Franklin_photos/JLo.jpg

[myrridin]

Two things:

1. The argument that I couldn't take what I dished out doesn't really apply here, since I didn't say anything in the forums against his show, and was unaware of the forum madness until the bbliveshow. He was attacking ALL rev3 viewers, not just those who attacked him.

2. I understand Jim is here to make money and appease investors. My hope was that Kevin would speak up and play the "person with a soul" role here.

That being said, I'm going to go watch TWiT live.

[tokenuser]

2. I understand Jim is here to make money and appease investors. My hope was that Kevin would speak up and play the "person with a soul" role here.If you follow his tweets, it shows that Kevin is on vacation.

Whatever the case, he might be a founder, but he doesn't appear in this list here (http://revision3.com/people/).

[Mr. Underachiever]

Why is everyone still bitching about him saying ****ot? If you actually LISTENED to the audio, he apologized for it IMMEDIATELY AFTER HE SAID IT.

And for anybody who says that he said queer after it, get off it. "Queer" has more definitions than simply "gay."

[myrridin]

If you follow his tweets, it shows that Kevin is on vacation.

Whatever the case, he might be a founder, but he doesn't appear in this list here (http://revision3.com/people/).

Actually, he tweeted me right after he got back from LV yesterday, and is currently shooting a diggnation with alex right now. If you follow his tweets, you'll see @myrridin in there. Please do your research before you call me on it.

And you're absolutely right, he's not part of the day to day management. I knew that we wouldn't get a real response from the suits. I guess I'm remembering the broken too fondly, and looking for my childhood hero to speak out himself, whether on behalf of rev3 or not. I understand though that he doesn't represent rev3 and has no voice here. Hopefully he'll reply my tweet again, and express his personal opinion. That being said, I see how this argument doesn't fit in a thread entitled "Dear Mr. Louderback"

[myrridin]

Why is everyone still bitching about him saying ****ot? If you actually LISTENED to the audio, he apologized for it IMMEDIATELY AFTER HE SAID IT.

And for anybody who says that he said queer after it, get off it. "Queer" has more definitions than simply "gay."

While you're right about his quick attempt to redeem himself, f***ot has many definitions as well. In the same vein, colored is a term with many definitions but we (at least I) still don't use it to refer to people. He wasn't saying the weather was queer.

[travislopes]

http://bbliveshow.com/episodes/1471238 - Time code: 1:27:40

For those interested, I cut out Jim Louderback's section of the last BBLiveShow and put it up on the podcast.

iTunes: http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=310360349
Feed URL: http://podcast.bbliveshow.com/feed.xml

[esophagus]

Two things:

1. The argument that I couldn't take what I dished out doesn't really apply here, since I didn't say anything in the forums against his show, and was unaware of the forum madness until the bbliveshow. He was attacking ALL rev3 viewers, not just those who attacked him.No he didn't.

2. I understand Jim is here to make money and appease investors. My hope was that Kevin would speak up and play the "person with a soul" role here.
What does Kevin have to do with any of this?

[mavrevMatt]

He's on the Revision3 Board of Directors, last I read, and was a founder of Revision3. While it's not his day job, I'd hope that someone who founded a company would care what they're doing.

Granted, he's not involved in the day to day running of Revision3 and he's been on vacation (see his Tweets), so it's reasonable that he hasn't had anything to say on the subject. I do hope that he'll take a look when he has time, and if he finds it necessary say something to Louderback about it.
What does Kevin have to do with any of this?

[xibalba]

Being part of the community and a viewer I don't feel like I was attacked by his rant at all. Though I don't agree with everything he said and do fell some of it was offensive but I understand that is how he is being a shock jock.

[xibalba]

He's on the Revision3 Board of Directors, last I read, and was a founder of Revision3. While it's not his day job, I'd hope that someone who founded a company would care what they're doing.

Granted, he's not involved in the day to day running of Revision3 and he's been on vacation (see his Tweets), so it's reasonable that he hasn't had anything to say on the subject. I do hope that he'll take a look when he has time, and if he finds it necessary say something to Louderback about it.

He will probably mention it on Diggnation and him and Alex will probably end up laughing about. Seeing as when he is drunk he thinks it is ok to cut off a woman's nipple if she kicks you in the nuts.

[Guytheninja]

He will probably mention it on Diggnation and him and Alex will probably end up laughing about. Seeing as when he is drunk he thinks it is ok to cut off a woman's nipple if she kicks you in the nuts.

Boy, is that the cold hard truth.

[GI_Josh]

Someone should record a rant about JV. Use as many terrible terms as possible, but right after them, make sure you say "I didn't mean them like that".

[quantumblink]

I'm curious, since you are a JV fan, how many people from here have gone to JV's forums and started up over there doing what you are doing here? I'm guessing there isn't anyone doing that. Generally speaking the people here bitch, myself included, but we don't really go out of our way to pick on people or call them childish names. So it's bizarre when that's directed at us. We'll call some show out for being crap and voice our knee jerk reactions... but I don't see that that anything to cry about. Brushwood didn't. He motored on, was confident people would like him if they got to know him, he was right and now he's part of the family.

First of all, you can come hang out at the other forums whenever you want.

Secondly, JV's show is here at this website, hence I'm here. JV is probably bashed all over the web, I ain't out looking for those sites to defend his name or some crap. But he has a show here, and I am here to support something I like. Not sure I see anything strange about that. This is simply me supporting JV at a site that hosts his show.

I don't think I've been overly offensive or anything. Phatlip's been on a crusade or just "tenacious", I think I have every right to nudge back. :)

[Phatlip]

He will probably mention it on Diggnation and him and Alex will probably end up laughing about. Seeing as when he is drunk he thinks it is ok to cut off a woman's nipple if she kicks you in the nuts.

Yeah, but Kevin had the balls to apologize when we said something stupid. We all say stupid things. Kudo's to him for that.

[Phatlip]

Phatlip's been on a crusade or just "tenacious", I think I have every right to nudge back. :)

I guess JV and I have something in common after all then. JV said "When something happens that isn't right he does something about it".

I don't believe it's right to call a community with openly gay members ****ots, and I also don't believe it's right to brush it off as if it's nothing. So I'm doing something about it.

But this isn't only me. I've been extremely vocal about this, but there are plenty of others just as pissed as I.

[Mr. Underachiever]

I guess JV and I have something in common after all then. JV said "When something happens that isn't right he does something about it".

I don't believe it's right to call a community with openly gay members ****ots, and I also don't believe it's right to brush it off as if it's nothing. So I'm doing something about it.

But this isn't only me. I've been extremely vocal about this, but there are plenty of others just as pissed as I.

HE APOLOGIZED AS SOON AS HE SAID IT.

All this incessant bitching about has convinced me that this has nothing to do with him saying ****ot. A few people were pissed by his rant, and tried to act like it was bigger than it was because he said it. If he said pigeon fuckers instead, people would STILL be bitching ("we have open pigeon fuckers in our community, it's not right to use that term"). Fuck outta here, man. :rolleyes:

[Phatlip]

HE APOLOGIZED AS SOON AS HE SAID IT.

All this incessant bitching about has convinced me that this has nothing to do with him saying ****ot. A few people were pissed by his rant, and tried to act like it was bigger than it was because he said it. If he said pigeon fuckers instead, people would STILL be bitching ("we have open pigeon fuckers in our community, it's not right to use that term"). Fuck outta here, man. :rolleyes:

With the word queer. That's like calling someone a ****** and saying "I'm sorry- colored".

You'll notice the major complaint is with the word ****ot. People would be pissed, but not like this.

[Mr. Underachiever]

With the word queer. That's like calling someone a ****** and saying "I'm sorry- colored".

Why are people still acting like "queer" can only refer to gay people? It HAS other meanings, you know, like "weird," "obsessive," "questionable," all of which I think could apply with the context of what he said.

You'll notice the major complaint is with the word ****ot. People would be pissed, but not like this.

So, people are complaining about him using a word he apologized for using as soon as he said it. Okay...

[Phatlip]

Why are people still acting like "queer" can only refer to gay people? It HAS other meanings, you know, like "weird," "obsessive," "questionable," all of which I think could apply with the context of what he said.



So, people are complaining about him using a word he apologized for using as soon as he said it. Okay...

Yes, but ****ot and queer both refer to gay people and he used queer as a substitute after he said ****ot so that argument doesn't work.

[esophagus]

Jesus, you guys. You've left no stone unturned. You've said over and over why you are mad, what your reasoning is, what your course of action is or will be and what you want to see done about it. We get it. Its all in these threads. So how about you just lay off and see what happens next? I don't see what could POSSIBLY come from you guys continuing your tirade. Let someone react before you continue.

[krishnancc]

Yes, but ****ot and queer both refer to gay people and he used queer as a substitute after he said ****ot so that argument doesn't work.

If you say that to ****ot to some one in RL you will/could be brought up on hate crime charges, why is the internet different.

[dirtyhat]

Someone should record a rant about JV. Use as many terrible terms as possible, but right after them, make sure you say "I didn't mean them like that".

Next topic for my podcast called "Never Ending Rant"? We film episode 11 tomorrow night =)... should I do it???






...Nah I don't get off on bashing other people ;) it would interesting to see what happens though...

[Mr. Underachiever]

If you say that to ****ot to some one in RL you will/could be brought up on hate crime charges, why is the internet different.

Are you implying that he should be charged with a HATE CRIME? Tell me that's not what you're implying right now...

[Guytheninja]

Jesus, you guys. You've left no stone unturned. You've said over and over why you are mad, what your reasoning is, what your course of action is or will be and what you want to see done about it. We get it. Its all in these threads. So how about you just lay off and see what happens next? I don't see what could POSSIBLY come from you guys continuing your tirade. Let someone react before you continue.

Seriously,
I'm getting concerned that the Rev3 staff will start to tune us out if we continue down this path. Rev3 (especially Jim Louderback) knows our problems with this show host. Jim has responded to the Rev3 message board members 3 times --- twice on the board and once during Brian's show.

And he basically has said this:

1. Rev3 will give JV's show a chance to see if he makes the network money.
2. Rev3's goal is to expand its audience and its markets and to make money for its investors, employees, and lastly fans. (notice the order)
3. If you don't like it -- don't watch it.

I think the message is clear. Of course, he has said all this in a much nicer, professional, "CEO", type way.

[gimpbully]

Perhaps this is what I don't get about your crusade -- what does an apology signify? Does this stop a person from their actions? Does this suddenly rectify the solution? Does this prevent the person from further speech?
No, it makes you feel like you won some foolish crusade.

I can guarantee you Kevin will continue to make foolishly sexist jokes and you will continue to eat it up as entertainment. Perhaps now, however, the more raunchy stuff will simply be edited in post.

Kudos on real progress.
Yeah, but Kevin had the balls to apologize when we said something stupid. We all say stupid things. Kudo's to him for that.

[Phatlip]

Perhaps this is what I don't get about your crusade -- what does an apology signify? Does this stop a person from their actions? Does this suddenly rectify the solution? Does this prevent the person from further speech?
No, it makes you feel like you won some foolish crusade.

I can guarantee you Kevin will continue to make foolishly sexist jokes and you will continue to eat it up as entertainment. Perhaps now, however, the more raunchy stuff will simply be edited in post.

Kudos on real progress.

An apology signifies what was said WASN'T appropriate and acceptable. I don't believe calling someone ****ot is acceptable.

In my eyes, not apologizing hints that the comments made were acceptable.

That's what I think though, we already established you don't think the same and you're certainly entitled to your opinion. I respect your opinion.

[esophagus]

*cough*
http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5593
http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5847
*cough*

Not saying these are exactly the same thing, just saying I bet you wish it hadn't been dragged out like that in your case.

[xibalba]

wow i forgot about those threads

esophagus wins.

[samureye]

I am so glad I learned that back and forth on the internet is pointless.

*goes back to deleting Jordan shoe spam*

[Phatlip]

*cough*
http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5593
http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5847
*cough*

Not saying these are exactly the same thing, just saying I bet you wish it hadn't been dragged out like that in your case.

That's nothing I tried hiding. I brought this up myself. That thread is actually why badger and I are such good friends now.

After that happened, I personally sent badger an IM apologizing for what I said. That's exactly my point. I realized I made a mistake and I apologized. I didn't ignore Badger, I sent him an instant message and apologized.

As I already said once. Everyone makes mistakes and says stupid things. But when it happens you apologize.

So I'm not sure what your point is exactly. I said a stupid thing. I apologized. I never claimed I was perfect. That's why I brought this up MYSELF. Hell I'll say it again. It was wrong of me to say something was "gay" when referring to something lame. Stupid, immature and insensitive. I was ignorant. I thought the dictionary mentioned the word gay being another word for "lame". I was wrong. When I was educated on the matter I realized this and apologized and also became friends with a really cool dude.

[quantumblink]

*cough*
http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5593
http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5847
*cough*

Not saying these are exactly the same thing, just saying I bet you wish it hadn't been dragged out like that in your case.

OH SNAP

Hypocrisy 101 taught by Professor Phatlip

[quantumblink]

I thought the dictionary mentioned the word gay being another word for "lame".

:rolleyes:

I never claimed I was perfect.

Did JV claim to be perfect? NOPE

Did he immediately apologize for saying "****ot"? YUP

Don't use the stupid "queer argument" that's the same thing as what you were defending in the threads as "gay being lame".

Stop with all the semantics. ("It depends on what you mean by sex" - Bill Clinton)

I think it might be time to put down the pitchfork and torches. Check that ego son.

[renegade07661]

:rolleyes:



Did JV claim to be perfect? NOPE

Did he immediately apologize for saying "****ot"? YUP

Don't use the stupid "queer argument" that's the same thing as what you were defending in the threads as "gay being lame".

Stop with all the semantics. ("It depends on what you mean by sex" - Bill Clinton)

I think it might be time to put down the pitchfork and torches. Check that ego son.

word em up

[Phatlip]

OH SNAP

Hypocrisy 101 taught by Professor Phatlip

Hypocrisy? I've already pointed this out MYSELF. This is nothing I tried hiding. In fact, I pointed this out MYSELF to make it clear that I UNDERSTAND he's not perfect and that the issue is with the LACK OF AN APOLOGY. I said JV made a stupid comment and that all people say stupid things. The issue is with him not APOLOGIZING.

I was ignorant in making a comment I didn't realize was offensive. But once educated, I realized my mistake and apologized.

That's not hypocrisy. It only show's I'm a human being. Yeah, I made a mistake and said something stupid. I also apologized for it. What's your point? Your argument would be relevant if I was arguing JV was a horrible person who should never make mistakes.

[Phatlip]

:rolleyes:



Did JV claim to be perfect? NOPE

I already said he wasn't. Quite a few times. Perfect people don't exist. People say stupid things sometimes. It happens. The issue is the lack of an apology.


Did he immediately apologize for saying "****ot"? YUP


Followed by calling us Queer. That's like calling an African American a ****** and then saying "I'm sorry- colored". Still not good enough for you? Fine, he apologized for saying ****ots but followed it with another offensive term which he didn't apologize for.


Don't use the stupid "queer argument" that's the same thing as what you were defending in the threads as "gay being lame".


Yes, and once it was pointed out to me that my definition was wrong, I realized I made a mistake and APOLOGIZED. The issue is the lack of an apology.

[quantumblink]

Followed by calling us Queer. That's like calling an African American a ****** and then saying "I'm sorry- colored". Still not good enough for you? Fine, he apologized for saying ****ots but followed it with another offensive term which he didn't apologize for.

This is the 73rd time you've used this argument. Got anything better?

He was using "****ot" AND "queer" both in the same sense as "gay is lame". IT WAS THE SAME EXACT THING THAT YOU ARGUED FOR, JUST A DIFFERENT WORD. Not once was it strictly directed at homosexuals. You're insanely blinded by your wacky "I'm a hero for the forum and a crusader against social injustice on a freakin internet forum" mindset that somehow you are not seeing this.


Yes, and once it was pointed out to me that my definition was wrong, I realized I made a mistake and APOLOGIZED. The issue is the lack of an apology.

"...once it was pointed out to me that my definition was wrong..."Riiiiiight. Hilarious. You are one twisted individual.

[Phatlip]

This is the 73rd time you've used this argument. Got anything better?

He was using "****ot" AND "queer" both in the same sense as "gay is lame". IT WAS THE SAME EXACT THING THAT YOU ARGUED FOR, JUST A DIFFERENT WORD. Not once was it strictly directed at homosexuals. You're insanely blinded by your wacky "I'm a hero for the forum and a crusader against social injustice on a freakin internet forum" mindset that somehow you are not seeing this.




"...once it was pointed out to me that my definition was wrong..."Riiiiiight. Hilarious. You are one twisted individual.

Yeah, at one time I thought gay was another word for lame. I was wrong. When I was educated on the matter I apologized.

Gay doesn't mean "lame".

My "definition" WAS wrong. I was ignorant in thinking otherwise. That makes me twisted?

[Phatlip]

This is the 73rd time you've used this argument. Got anything better?

He was using "****ot" AND "queer" both in the same sense as "gay is lame". IT WAS THE SAME EXACT THING THAT YOU ARGUED FOR, JUST A DIFFERENT WORD. Not once was it strictly directed at homosexuals. You're insanely blinded by your wacky "I'm a hero for the forum and a crusader against social injustice on a freakin internet forum" mindset that somehow you are not seeing this.




"...once it was pointed out to me that my definition was wrong..."Riiiiiight. Hilarious. You are one twisted individual.

No. That is my argument. He made an offensive comment. It happens, I'm sure he's an otherwise nice person. But when you say something offensive like that you apologize. I see nothing wrong with that.

Yeah, at one time I thought gay was another word for lame. I was wrong. When I was educated on the matter I apologized.

Gay doesn't mean "lame".

My "definition" WAS wrong. I was ignorant in thinking otherwise. That makes me twisted?

[quantumblink]

Yeah, at one time I thought gay was another word for lame. I was wrong. When I was educated on the matter I apologized.

Gay doesn't mean "lame".

My "definition" WAS wrong. I was ignorant in thinking otherwise. That makes me twisted?

Are you a lawyer? If not, you chose the wrong profession.

[Phatlip]

Are you a lawyer? If not, you chose the wrong profession.

Nope. I seriously thought about going into law at one time though.

What I'm saying is truthful though. I'm now very good friends with the individual I apologized to for my ignorant comments. He can confirm everything I say.

[Phatlip]

I have a question QuantumBlink, why SHOULDN'T JV apologize for saying offensive things to homosexuals?

I realize you made the argument he apologized for saying ****ot, but he only followed it with another offensive term. So that wasn't an apology. Even if you think it was for some reason, he didn't apologize for saying queer.

So why shouldn't he apologize then? Is it okay to refer to a community with openly gay members as ****ots and queers?

[quantumblink]

Nope. I seriously thought about going into law at one time though.

What I'm saying is truthful though. I'm now very good friends with the individual I apologized to for my ignorant comments. He can confirm everything I say.

I don't doubt anything you say.

But to actually believe you had "mis-defined gay" as meaning lame?

Psychoooooooo

Shoulda gone into law....

[Phatlip]

I don't doubt anything you say.

But to actually believe you had "mis-defined gay" as meaning lame?

Psychoooooooo

Shoulda gone into law....

You mis-defined the term too. Does that make you psycho or does that mean your definition of a word was incorrect?

[quantumblink]

You mis-defined the term too. Does that make you psycho or does that mean your definition of a word was incorrect?

That's not my point.


I'm saying you sound insane or like a politician when you used to use the word and then all of a sudden you realized your mistake cuz you found out the "definition was incorrect". PUH-LEAZE


If the definition is incorrect, then it's incorrect. I still use it. I for one believe intent is everything as I believe forum member "Chuckles" had argued.

I also don't think that any member of this forum or at least a ridiculous majority does not want to keep gay people down or deprive them of equal rights. You're acting real crazy dude. I think that your motives might somehow be self-interested with a disguise that it is for the greater good.

Do you typically believe you have higher morals than most people?

You're a hero, we gotcha. Seriously, move on.

[Phatlip]

That's not my point.


I'm saying you sound insane or like a politician when you used to use the word and then all of a sudden you realized your mistake cuz you found out the "definition was incorrect". PUH-LEAZE


If the definition is incorrect, then it's incorrect. I still use it. I for one believe intent is everything as I believe forum member "Chuckles" had argued. My intentions were pure when I thought gay was another term for lame. That didn't make it right though. So I apologized when I learned I was wrong.

I also don't think that any member of this forum or at least a ridiculous majority does not want to keep gay people down or deprive them of equal rights. You're acting real crazy dude. I think that your motives might somehow be self-interested with a disguise that it is for the greater good.

Do you typically believe you have higher morals than most people?

You're a hero, we gotcha. Seriously, move on.

You made the comment that JV isn't perfect, but apparently I'm supposed to be? It's not like I said this yesterday and now I'm going back on my word. This happened in 2007. YOU MADE THE SAME MISTAKE I MADE. So what are you saying " PUH-LEAZE" to? You never mis-defined a word in your life? Guess what? You just did a few minutes ago. With the same word. Again, what is your point?

Okay, then you're consciously choosing to use a word in an incorrect manner even though you know it's incorrect. You can do that all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that you're wrong and the word doesn't mean that. But I'm the psycho one?

Calling people ****ots and queers is wrong. I don't believe I have higher morals than others. That's why I said JV isn't perfect, all people make mistakes but you apologize when it happens. It's wrong so I'm speaking out against it.

Do you think it's acceptable to call people ****ots and queers? The intent wasn't a joke. It was a 35 minute rant. So the intent argument is pretty is irrelevant. It was an attack and he didn't apologize. Is that acceptable?

[Shinku]

lolz.

Alright, I had to get involved. I tried to resist but it's not working.

This is gonna go around in circles from now until the end of time if you just keep rehashing the same arguments over and over. Neither side of this argument is going to back down, no-one's going to change their minds and nobody's going to agree to disagree.

People are gonna have different ways of looking at things, that's part of being human, we all have opinions and they don't necessarily match up with others' opinions, so sometimes we have to just accept that people might think differently to us.

I will also note that some users here may or may not be trolling their asses off, on either side of the fence, and that you should probably take that into account during these discussions. Hell, that's practically what the show host himself is paid to do, why would you expect anything less? That said, I agree with those who have said that if hosts are allowed to go off the rails then surely it makes absolutely no sense to censor the forum. If it turns into a cess pit of assholes and trolls then so be it, if that's what the show attracts. Maybe that's your audience, you have to deal with that. The internet's an interactive medium and as such people will give as good as they get, and rightly so.

So is it right to call someone a ****ot? Probably not, but people are going to do it anyway. Search for it on the internet, you'll find a lot more than references to pork offal products. Point is that whether you like it or not, you're never going to stop people willingly saying things you don't like. Is it even relevant considering JV never said it on one of Rev3's shows? Probably not, take it up with him in person. Should Rev3 apologise? No, but an official comment might be nice, just for clarification, but I don't particularly care either way until I start seeing JLB scrawling racial slurs on walls with a spray can or Jay trash talking a bunch of black guys. Do I think JV's an appropriate fit for Rev3? Not right now, but that's the whole point, widen the audience and eventually the audience will include fans of JV's show (all being well, of course). There are so many questions here I'm not even sure where to stop asking them, but I will make one last point here, and that's the fact that on radio you can say what you like, you control the flow of input, but on the internet that's not how things work. If you say something people don't like, you're going to get a backlash, people are vocal and they know what they like. Suck it up, big boy.

The show? I thought it had potential. That's about all I have to say, and frankly I think that's all that needs to be said on that note. One episode isn't enough to judge but I think the idea has mileage.

[Phatlip]

So is it right to call someone a ****ot? Probably not, but people are going to do it anyway. Search for it on the internet, you'll find a lot more than references to pork offal products.

Who cares if people are going to do it anyway? That doesn't make it any more acceptable. So what, because people are going to do it anyway I shouldn't care? People are going to do a LOT of unacceptable things anyway. I'm still going to care.


Point is that whether you like it or not, you're never going to stop people willingly saying things you don't like.

That doesn't mean you don't stand against it. There are a lot of wrong things that happen in this world. You do something about it (at least you should).


Is it even relevant considering JV never said it on one of Rev3's shows? Probably not, take it up with him in person. Should Rev3 apologise? No, but an official comment might be nice, just for clarification, but I don't particularly care either way until I start seeing JLB scrawling racial slurs on walls with a spray can or Jay trash talking a bunch of black guys.

I think so, but that goes back to what you said earlier about us simply having different opinions on the matter. No, it didn't happen on the show, but it was directed at Revision3's audience by one of their people on an event the CEO of the company tweeted about. I think that leaves them both responsible. That's just what I think though.

[Shinku]

Sorry mate, the internet's not a democracy, shit happens and you move on. You're not going to fix the world, and you're especially not going to do it on an internet forum.

[Phatlip]

Sorry mate, the internet's not a democracy, shit happens and you move on. You're not going to fix the world, and you're especially not going to do it on an internet forum.

Democracy is irrelevant. I'm not trying to change the world and I'm not going to sit by and do nothing- whether it's online or offline. I don't believe in just sitting by and moving on. I care enough about Revision3 that I hope to change their stance on what I think was very wrong and hateful comments. But I said my argument.

But I do plan on moving on. Some things I said came under attack so I'm simply defending my argument.

[esophagus]

You've made 3/4 of the posts in all of these threads. If you want to ignore this stuff I'd recommend ignoring stuff directed to you as well.

[Shinku]

Frankly I think this is all a waste of time and the only reason I'm bothering to post is because I have literally nothing better to do this morning. If you think it's a worthy cause and that you'll actually get somewhere then by all means go for it, I can't tell you what to do just like you can't tell JV or Rev3 what to do.

[quantumblink]

I have a question QuantumBlink, why SHOULDN'T JV apologize for saying offensive things to homosexuals?

He wasn't addressing homosexuals. Yes, there were homosexual listeners, but he was not specifically targeting them. Again he was using "****ot, queer, gay" as meaning "lame or uncool". HE WAS NOT ATTACKING THE SPECIFIC HOMOSEXUAL AUDIENCE. So if his error was a "mis-defintion" as you like to argue then that is not offensive to all homosexuals. Remember you were screaming hate speech at first. What a joke. People like you are scary.

Again, I don't expect you to know this of JV because you have only known him for 40 abrasive minutes, but he is extremely accepting, kind, helpful, and loving towards the gay community. He broadcasts out of San Francisco (I don't even have to explain) currently and was once #1 (including beating Stern) for 10 years at market 4 SF (just after NY, LA, Chi.). He has a crazy track record of standing out and speaking out against intolerance towards gays. When there is news of hatred towards a member of the gay community he is absolutely infuriated and outraged over it and uses TONS of air time to put it on blast. And he also speaks with his money with his support.


I realize you made the argument he apologized for saying ****ot, but he only followed it with another offensive term. So that wasn't an apology. Even if you think it was for some reason, he didn't apologize for saying queer.

Why don't you just admit you want him to bend over and kiss your ass as the ringleader of all this crusading against "social injustice"?

He owes you or anyone else nothing more. He has apologized. He has just shown poor taste. This was not hate speech. This was him using poor taste. Get over yourself.


So why shouldn't he apologize then? Is it okay to refer to a community with openly gay members as ****ots and queers?

First of all, I hope you realize that you have used that word more than anyone else since the issue arose. Moving on...

All communities have openly gay members, so this one should not take it personally. Whenever you behave like he did and use those words, you will surely be offensive. Don't take it personally. I will say it one final time, HE CLEARLY WAS NOT TARGETING HOMOSEXUALS .

Do you never say things like "wow, that was retarded" or "stop acting like a bitch dude"?

If not, you must be one amazing super human being. (But you obviously know that already)

There is an offensive word or action for every human being on this Earth.

Stop being so hyper-sensitive (which I don't believe is the case, you're just in love with yourself) and if it bugs you that mich just change the dial.

Get off that high horse. Then you can suck my balls. I'm done.

[Phatlip]

Frankly I think this is all a waste of time and the only reason I'm bothering to post is because I have literally nothing better to do this morning. If you think it's a worthy cause and that you'll actually get somewhere then by all means go for it, I can't tell you what to do just like you can't tell JV or Rev3 what to do.

I thought I would get somewhere because I honestly thought Revision3 was better than this, and wouldn't let one of their own people insult their customers. I especially thought they wouldn't stand for one of their own people calling those customers ****ots and queers. I guess I was wrong though.

So, I'm taking to a new strategy (off the forums). At that point I would have done everything possible, and if still nothing happens, I'll simply stop watching Revision3.

[quantumblink]

lolz.

Alright, I had to get involved. I tried to resist but it's not working.

This is gonna go around in circles from now until the end of time if you just keep rehashing the same arguments over and over. Neither side of this argument is going to back down, no-one's going to change their minds and nobody's going to agree to disagree.

People are gonna have different ways of looking at things, that's part of being human, we all have opinions and they don't necessarily match up with others' opinions, so sometimes we have to just accept that people might think differently to us.

I will also note that some users here may or may not be trolling their asses off, on either side of the fence, and that you should probably take that into account during these discussions. Hell, that's practically what the show host himself is paid to do, why would you expect anything less? That said, I agree with those who have said that if hosts are allowed to go off the rails then surely it makes absolutely no sense to censor the forum. If it turns into a cess pit of assholes and trolls then so be it, if that's what the show attracts. Maybe that's your audience, you have to deal with that. The internet's an interactive medium and as such people will give as good as they get, and rightly so.

So is it right to call someone a ****ot? Probably not, but people are going to do it anyway. Search for it on the internet, you'll find a lot more than references to pork offal products. Point is that whether you like it or not, you're never going to stop people willingly saying things you don't like. Is it even relevant considering JV never said it on one of Rev3's shows? Probably not, take it up with him in person. Should Rev3 apologise? No, but an official comment might be nice, just for clarification, but I don't particularly care either way until I start seeing JLB scrawling racial slurs on walls with a spray can or Jay trash talking a bunch of black guys. Do I think JV's an appropriate fit for Rev3? Not right now, but that's the whole point, widen the audience and eventually the audience will include fans of JV's show (all being well, of course). There are so many questions here I'm not even sure where to stop asking them, but I will make one last point here, and that's the fact that on radio you can say what you like, you control the flow of input, but on the internet that's not how things work. If you say something people don't like, you're going to get a backlash, people are vocal and they know what they like. Suck it up, big boy.

The show? I thought it had potential. That's about all I have to say, and frankly I think that's all that needs to be said on that note. One episode isn't enough to judge but I think the idea has mileage.

Nicely said buddy.

[Phatlip]

He wasn't addressing homosexuals. Yes, there were homosexual listeners, but he was not specifically targeting them. Again he was using "****ot, queer, gay" as meaning "lame or uncool". HE WAS NOT ATTACKING THE SPECIFIC HOMOSEXUAL AUDIENCE. So if his error was a "mis-defintion" as you like to argue then that is not offensive to all homosexuals. Remember you were screaming hate speech at first. What a joke. People like you are scary.

Except the words ****ot and queer DON'T mean lame and are offensive words used towards homosexuals. So while not directly targeted at homosexuals, calling someone a "****ot" is an insult to homosexuals. It is because it's a derogatory term used to be-little homosexuals. If I stub my toe and call it a "nig***", I'm sure I would offend some African Americans. Even though it was a "mis-definition" and not directed at blacks- the word by itself means otherwise and is offensive. I don't see the harm in an apology. The fact he wont means he think he did nothing wrong.

People tolerant of words like this scare ME.


Again, I don't expect you to know this of JV because you have only known him for 40 abrasive minutes, but he is extremely accepting, kind, helpful, and loving towards the gay community. He broadcasts out of San Francisco (I don't even have to explain) currently and was once #1 (including beating Stern) for 10 years at market 4 SF (just after NY, LA, Chi.). He has a crazy track record of standing out and speaking out against intolerance towards gays. When there is news of hatred towards a member of the gay community he is absolutely infuriated and outraged over it and uses TONS of air time to put it on blast. And he also speaks with his money with his support.

From what I heard it sounds like he's an otherwise good person. But good people make mistakes. You apologize when it happens. Again, I don't see why it's so hard to apologize. ESPICALLY if he has spoken out about hatred towards the gay community in the past. Then there's no excuse for not apologizing, because he understands how hurtful these words can be.


Why don't you just admit you want him to bend over and kiss your ass as the ringleader of all this crusading against "social injustice"?

I think he should apologize for making offensive, intolerant questions. I have no regret for speaking out against intolerance.



He owes you or anyone else nothing more. He has apologized. He has just shown poor taste. This was not hate speech. This was him using poor taste. Get over yourself.


First of all, I hope you realize that you have used that word more than anyone else since the issue arose. Moving on...

Quoting what he said.


All communities have openly gay members, so this one should not take it personally. Whenever you behave like he did and use those words, you will surely be offensive. Don't take it personally. I will say it one final time, HE CLEARLY WAS NOT TARGETING HOMOSEXUALS .

That's fine. Doesn't change the fact it's offensive language regardless.



Do you never say things like "wow, that was retarded" or "stop acting like a bitch dude"?

If not, you must be one amazing super human being. (But you obviously know that already)

There is an offensive word or action for every human being on this Earth.

Stop being so hyper-sensitive (which I don't believe is the case, you're just in love with yourself) and if it bugs you that mich just change the dial.

Get off that high horse. Then you can suck my balls. I'm done.

You obviously haven't read a word I've said then. And you wonder why I keep repeating myself. Yes I said stupid things before. Everyone has. I'm sure JV is an otherwise good person. But when you make a mistake you apologize.

We simply disagree about this and are running in circles. I think we both made our arguments clear. So, I'm done too.

[kzap]

Except the words ****ot and queer DON'T mean lame and are offensive words used towards homosexuals. So while not directly targeted at homosexuals, calling someone a "****ot" is an insult to homosexuals. It is because it's a derogatory term used to be-little homosexuals. If I stub my toe and call it a "nig***", I'm sure I would offend some African Americans. Even though it was a "mis-definition" and not directed at blacks- the word by itself means otherwise and is offensive. I don't see the harm in an apology. The fact he wont means he think he did nothing wrong.

People tolerant of words like this scare ME.
Me too, I haven't watched the show yet but I have heard enough of his rant.
Although I know understand some people on this forum don't think using insulting words is wrong. Which is there opinion.

[Murphy1d]

Ignore him and he will go away.
(this is even funnier when you don't know who I am talking about).

[Guytheninja]

I thought I would get somewhere because I honestly thought Revision3 was better than this, and wouldn't let one of their own people insult their customers. I especially thought they wouldn't stand for one of their own people calling those customers ****ots and queers. I guess I was wrong though.

So, I'm taking to a new strategy (off the forums). At that point I would have done everything possible, and if still nothing happens, I'll simply stop watching Revision3.

Now, I'm really curious as to what you are going to do.

[arcticfox]

Ive steered well clear of this thread, but im going to add my 2p worth.

I am gay, i have followed Revision 3 since day one, i was even following Kevin and Patrick and then Alex on the Screen Savers back in the day when i didnt even have the channel in the Uk i had to aquire it elsewhere, Ive been following Roger and Jim from DL.TV, ive been watching Diggnation, Totally Rad Show, Co-op from day 1, i even watched The Broken before Revision 3 was even a twinkle in Kevins eye, ive clicked ads, ive subscribed to help out financially before they got rid of subscriptions, ive spread the word to all my friends about revision 3 and i find all this disgusting.

It doesnt really bother me about all the people on the forums wondering what the big deal is as they have their right to their own opinion as much as i disagree with it, what does bother me when the company that took this tool on wont even issue a statement of apology, take this guy off revision 3 or even force the guy to apologise for his language. If this was on TV Revision 3 would have been hit with a huge fine (at least in the UK) but apparently on the internet its acceptable.

If i dont get a satisfactory response from Jim or Revision 3 they can kiss my support goodbye, i wont be buying from any sponsors, i wont be clicking ads, i wont be watching their shows and i will recommend to all the people ive told to watch to stop watching.

I find it disgusting Revision 3 would treat its viewers this way, the whole point Rev 3 was set up is to get away from the corporate environment that destroyed Tech TV/G4 Tech TV, to make the viewer matter, now the hippocrits are going in the same direction and the same mistakes are being made.

But then what do they care, me not watching Revision 3 shows anymore wont even make a ripple in their pond, and that makes me sad.

[krishnancc]

Ive steered well clear of this thread, but im going to add my 2p worth.

I am gay, i have followed Revision 3 since day one, i was even following Kevin and Patrick and then Alex on the Screen Savers back in the day when i didnt even have the channel in the Uk i had to aquire it elsewhere, Ive been following Roger and Jim from DL.TV, ive been watching Diggnation, Totally Rad Show, Co-op from day 1, i even watched The Broken before Revision 3 was even a twinkle in Kevins eye, ive clicked ads, ive subscribed to help out financially before they got rid of subscriptions, ive spread the word to all my friends about revision 3 and i find all this disgusting.

It doesnt really bother me about all the people on the forums wondering what the big deal is as they have their right to their own opinion as much as i disagree with it, what does bother me when the company that took this tool on wont even issue a statement of apology, take this guy off revision 3 or even force the guy to apologise for his language. If this was on TV Revision 3 would have been hit with a huge fine (at least in the UK) but apparently on the internet its acceptable.

If i dont get a satisfactory response from Jim or Revision 3 they can kiss my support goodbye, i wont be buying from any sponsors, i wont be clicking ads, i wont be watching their shows and i will recommend to all the people ive told to watch to stop watching.

I find it disgusting Revision 3 would treat its viewers this way, the whole point Rev 3 was set up is to get away from the corporate environment that destroyed Tech TV/G4 Tech TV, to make the viewer matter, now the hippocrits are going in the same direction and the same mistakes are being made.

But then what do they care, me not watching Revision 3 shows anymore wont even make a ripple in their pond, and that makes me sad.

I see where you coming from arcticfox, It is sad. I don't think they have said anything as of now about this but it would be nice.

I don't think ill stop watching rev3 shows, but im not watching JV (can't believe i watched it the first time.)

If you look at the "now viewing" JVs world was at like 600+ viewers at the beginning now its down to 50 or so on the forums. I hope people will just ignore him and maybe he will go away.

[DaTipi]

It's the fucking internet. there is always going to be something you don't like or something that offends you. it's not NBC or FOX. it's the internet. He's is saying everything he is to solicit the exact reaction you are giving so he gets more attention. there is no point to arguing or complaining. in the end his show is going to run and that's just the way it is.

[eminemdrdre00]

It's the fucking internet. there is always going to be something you don't like or something that offends you. it's not NBC or FOX. it's the internet. He's is saying everything he is to solicit the exact reaction you are giving so he gets more attention. there is no point to arguing or complaining. in the end his show is going to run and that's just the way it is.

The issue here is that hes on a network that was built around "geeks" and probably 80% of Rev3 shows are geek related. Yet he went on a 35 minute anti-geek rant, and used words that I'm sure Revision3 wasnt proud of.

[DaTipi]

The issue here is that hes on a network that was built around "geeks" and probably 80% of Rev3 shows are geek related. Yet he went on a 35 minute anti-geek rant, and used words that I'm sure Revision3 wasnt proud of.

I agree. but they brought him on because he is different. Rev 3 is just trying to expand their market and get more viewership and thus make more money. I've never heard of this guy before he was on rev3 but i don't mind him. He's just a dude with an opinion and has been given the opportunity to voice it. if people don't like it they don't have to watch. He's essentially one giant troll. the more people whine and moan and flame him he's going to get right back in their face just because he can and he want's to walk the line and be "edgy". i doubt he meant, wholeheartedly, anything he said in that audio recording.

[crumpsbrother]

Except the words ****ot and queer DON'T mean lame and are offensive words used towards homosexuals. So while not directly targeted at homosexuals, calling someone a "****ot" is an insult to homosexuals. It is because it's a derogatory term used to be-little homosexuals. If I stub my toe and call it a "nig***", I'm sure I would offend some African Americans. Even though it was a "mis-definition" and not directed at blacks- the word by itself means otherwise and is offensive. I don't see the harm in an apology. The fact he wont means he think he did nothing wrong.

People tolerant of words like this scare ME.



From what I heard it sounds like he's an otherwise good person. But good people make mistakes. You apologize when it happens. Again, I don't see why it's so hard to apologize. ESPICALLY if he has spoken out about hatred towards the gay community in the past. Then there's no excuse for not apologizing, because he understands how hurtful these words can be.



I think he should apologize for making offensive, intolerant questions. I have no regret for speaking out against intolerance.



He owes you or anyone else nothing more. He has apologized. He has just shown poor taste. This was not hate speech. This was him using poor taste. Get over yourself.



Quoting what he said.



That's fine. Doesn't change the fact it's offensive language regardless.




You obviously haven't read a word I've said then. And you wonder why I keep repeating myself. Yes I said stupid things before. Everyone has. I'm sure JV is an otherwise good person. But when you make a mistake you apologize.

We simply disagree about this and are running in circles. I think we both made our arguments clear. So, I'm done too.

I think he was refering to :

1. a bundle of sticks, twigs, or branches bound together and used as fuel, a fascine, a torch, etc.
2. a bundle; bunch.
3. a bundle of pieces of iron or steel to be welded, hammered, or rolled together at high temperature

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3642/3412503323_ba706638ec.jpg

or this:

http://www.schoolplaten.com/nl-kleurplaat-kleurplaten-foto-fagot-p8088.jpg


Only one G, not two G's.


by THE WAY, HAVE YOU ventured outside lately? Something tells me you need some sun and fresh air.

Push away from the keyboard
K.thanks

[Phatlip]

by THE WAY, HAVE YOU ventured outside lately? Something tells me you need some sun and fresh air.

Push away from the keyboard
K.thanks

Heh. Dude, you've made more posts here than myself over these past couple of days.

I only posted so much last week because it was a hot issue and I was stuck inside anyway because I was sick.

I'll probably be in Ocean City, MD (http://www.atbeach.com/portraits/pjsmith/gallery1/pix/image3.jpg) this weekend buddy. What about you?

[crumpsbrother]

I only posted so much last week because it was a hot issue and I was stuck inside anyway because I was sick.

I'll probably be in Ocean City, MD (http://www.atbeach.com/portraits/pjsmith/gallery1/pix/image3.jpg) this weekend buddy. What about you?

I only post here because I've been a JV supporter for over 12 years.

So are you trying to convince me or yourself.

I leave it at this, the day Jv shows up at your mazda B2000 pickup and tells you how to run your leafblower, then start complaining.

as far as my weekend,

Well, um, actually a pretty nice little Saturday, we're going to go to Home Depot. Yeah, buy some wallpaper, maybe get some flooring, stuff like that. Maybe Bed, Bath, & Beyond, I don't know, I don't know if we'll have enough time.

[tokenuser]

FFS. Will you two drop it. You've been bickering like an old married couple for a week now.

How about this ...

Phatty, help choose the wall paper on Saturday morning.
CrumpsBrother look online at what you need at BB&B. If they have what you want great, otherwise skip the place until you get a 20% off coupon.

Then both of you head to the beach in the afternoon, have a hotdog, grab an icecream ... enjoy yourselves.

Comeback on Monday refreshed ... and ready to go at it again when JV has his second podcast up.

[crumpsbrother]

FFS. Will you two drop it. You've been bickering like an old married couple for a week now.

How about this ...

Phatty, help choose the wall paper on Saturday morning.
CrumpsBrother look online at what you need at BB&B. If they have what you want great, otherwise skip the place until you get a 20% off coupon.

Then both of you head to the beach in the afternoon, have a hotdog, grab an icecream ... enjoy yourselves.

Comeback on Monday refreshed ... and ready to go at it again when JV has his second podcast up.

Uh this is the first correspondence we have had, you must be mistaking me for someone else.

[Phatlip]

FFS. Will you two drop it. You've been bickering like an old married couple for a week now.

How about this ...

Phatty, help choose the wall paper on Saturday morning.
CrumpsBrother look online at what you need at BB&B. If they have what you want great, otherwise skip the place until you get a 20% off coupon.

Then both of you head to the beach in the afternoon, have a hotdog, grab an icecream ... enjoy yourselves.

Comeback on Monday refreshed ... and ready to go at it again when JV has his second podcast up.

Only if he agrees to get on the Ferris wheel with me. Otherwise the deal's off!

[crumpsbrother]

Only if he agrees to get on the Ferris wheel with me. Otherwise the deal's off!

I dont like the ferris wheel, got stuck on one as a kid, how about a roller coaster?

[Phatlip]

I dont like the ferris wheel, got stuck on one as a kid, how about a roller coaster?

Only if you hold me hand and make funny faces with me as we pass the high speed camera.

haha

[crumpsbrother]

Only if you hold me hand and make funny faces with me as we pass the high speed camera.

haha

dealeeo

[quantumblink]

Only if he agrees to get on the Ferris wheel with me. Otherwise the deal's off!

There's a ferris wheel in Ocean City?

All I remember is a ton of bars....and that weird DJ Werewolf guy or something who creeps out all the ladies at the Green Turtle...

[trunolimit]

I only post here because I've been a JV supporter for over 12 years.

So are you trying to convince me or yourself.

I leave it at this, the day Jv shows up at your mazda B2000 pickup and tells you how to run your leafblower, then start complaining.

as far as my weekend,

Well, um, actually a pretty nice little Saturday, we're going to go to Home Depot. Yeah, buy some wallpaper, maybe get some flooring, stuff like that. Maybe Bed, Bath, & Beyond, I don't know, I don't know if we'll have enough time.

I love bed bath and beyond. I spend O.D. money when I go planning on only getting one thing. They have excellent pillows that go with my race car bed. :D

[trunolimit]

Except the words ****ot and queer DON'T mean lame and are offensive words used towards homosexuals. So while not directly targeted at homosexuals, calling someone a "****ot" is an insult to homosexuals. It is because it's a derogatory term used to be-little homosexuals. If I stub my toe and call it a "nig***", I'm sure I would offend some African Americans. Even though it was a "mis-definition" and not directed at blacks- the word by itself means otherwise and is offensive. I don't see the harm in an apology. The fact he wont means he think he did nothing wrong.


how do you pronounce ****?

[arcticfox]

Still no reply from Revision 3, looks like theyve lost this viewer then and possibly a few more, but then what do they care a few users wont matter....right?

[esophagus]

Still no reply from Revision 3, looks like theyve lost this viewer then and possibly a few more, but then what do they care a few users wont matter....right?
You're going to stop watching shows you enjoy because the network also hosts one you don't? That's silly logic.

[kzap]

You're going to stop watching shows you enjoy because the network also hosts one you don't? That's silly logic.
Not really by watching the show he enjoys he is support the station (though watching sponsors) and if he hates the show that much, he will do anything to stop the station hosting it.
Duh!
It's the same if Fox started promotion racism (not saying they would) I would stop watching all my favorite shows on the channel because I wouldn't want to found them.
That said I personally don't hate JV so much that I will stop watching TRS, I will just ignore it and hope that it will go away.

[quantumblink]

You're going to stop watching shows you enjoy because the network also hosts one you don't? That's silly logic.

I can't stand Oprah or the View but it won't stop me from watching basketball games on ABC.

Hmmmm maybe I should stop watching those games cuz I still want an apology from ABC cuz I got offended when Barbara Walters showed too much cleavage that one time...


Not really by watching the show he enjoys he is support the station (though watching sponsors) and if he hates the show that much, he will do anything to stop the station hosting it.
Duh!
It's the same if Fox started promotion racism (not saying they would) I would stop watching all my favorite shows on the channel because I wouldn't want to found them.
That said I personally don't hate JV so much that I will stop watching TRS, I will just ignore it and hope that it will go away.

Rev 3 is not "promoting" homophobia...

Does anyone here actually believe that JV will ever be using that word in any episode on this network ever again?

The dude made a mistake, backed down and will not say it on any episodes....move on

Anyone who will stop watching the shows they normally did because they think they deserve some huge public apology is only hurting themselves.

It's hard enough to find places to get your laughs from and now you will deprive yourself of things that entertained you in the past. Ignore the content you don't like and watch the content that you do. Don't make it a bigger issue than it needs to be.

[arcticfox]

You're going to stop watching shows you enjoy because the network also hosts one you don't? That's silly logic.
Yup, they havent issued any statement of apology or otherwise, while there is no episode 2 he is still on the main page and has his own forum, i can only conclude that Revision 3 thinks this is acceptable behaviour.

You might think i am cutting my nose off to spite my face but i will not support a tv station, internet or otherwise, that lets what JV said slide.

If i watch a show i am supporting Revision 3 by watching the adverts and contributing to the viewing figures, it would be hypocritical of me to sit there and carry on watching the shows despite my disgust.

I dont deserve or even expect anything, it wont affect Revision 3 one little bit if i stop watching their shows, it would have been nice for a bit of solidarity but it looks like Revision 3 despite all the fluff about getting away from the corporate mentality that now destroys network television are no better than those.

[trunolimit]

Yup, they havent issued any statement of apology or otherwise, while there is no episode 2 he is still on the main page and has his own forum, i can only conclude that Revision 3 thinks this is acceptable behaviour.

You might think i am cutting my nose off to spite my face but i will not support a tv station, internet or otherwise, that lets what JV said slide.

If i watch a show i am supporting Revision 3 by watching the adverts and contributing to the viewing figures, it would be hypocritical of me to sit there and carry on watching the shows despite my disgust.

I dont deserve or even expect anything, it wont affect Revision 3 one little bit if i stop watching their shows, it would have been nice for a bit of solidarity but it looks like Revision 3 despite all the fluff about getting away from the corporate mentality that now destroys network television are no better than those.

see now this is where I am torn. on the one hand it was messed up of JV to play us like that, calling us nerds and pimples on dicks ..ect, but honestly go back to where this whole thing started and tell me we as a community didn't ask for it. Yeah the show was bad but a simple dude your show is not that great do better would have sufficed. I think JV should apologize for what he said it would be the right thing to do but will I stop watching if he don't? nah. I like me some diggnation, TRS, Tekzilla, and digg reel way to much. to let that dude bother me.

and on the gay thing, JV doesn't Gay bash or anything like that. he is very outspoken about being cool with everybody.

[arcticfox]

see now this is where I am torn. on the one hand it was messed up of JV to play us like that, calling us nerds and pimples on dicks ..ect, but honestly go back to where this whole thing started and tell me we as a community didn't ask for it. Yeah the show was bad but a simple dude your show is not that great do better would have sufficed. I think JV should apologize for what he said it would be the right thing to do but will I stop watching if he don't? nah. I like me some diggnation, TRS, Tekzilla, and digg reel way to much. to let that dude bother me.

and on the gay thing, JV doesn't Gay bash or anything like that. he is very outspoken about being cool with everybody.
Gay bashing or not using a term thats associated with homosexuals as a derogatory slur wether hes "ok" with gays or not is still wrong, if he had used a racial epithet in his rant against the community his show would have been yanked so fast off Revision 3.

I certainly didnt ask for his childish rantings at me, i had done nothing to him to warrant that kind of abuse, wether hes a "shock jock" or not Revision 3 should have done something about it.

If he stays on Revision 3 and a second episode appears on this site i will be thinking about taking the matter further to someone who will listen, if this were on TV in the UK Revision 3 would have had a huge fine slapped on them.

[trunolimit]

Gay bashing or not using a term thats associated with homosexuals as a derogatory slur wether hes "ok" with gays or not is still wrong, if he had used a racial epithet in his rant against the community his show would have been yanked so fast off Revision 3.

I certainly didnt ask for his childish rantings at me, i had done nothing to him to warrant that kind of abuse, wether hes a "shock jock" or not Revision 3 should have done something about it.

If he stays on Revision 3 and a second episode appears on this site i will be thinking about taking the matter further to someone who will listen, if this were on TV in the UK Revision 3 would have had a huge fine slapped on them.

I see your point.

I think the problem is that we as a society just aren't to that point where the whole sexual preference thing is on the same level as the race thing (we are close ). I mean we fought wars over this race issue. I use the word fag and gay in negative ways all the time without thinking twice but I'll be very careful to who or how I make my race jokes and insults. this doesn't mean I'm against homosexuals it just means that to me its not a big deal. I think the diggreal had a similar beef not to long ago.

[rabidbadger]

I see your point. ...I use the word fag and gay in negative ways all the time without thinking twice but I'll be very careful to who or how I make my race jokes and insults. this doesn't mean I'm against homosexuals it just means that to me its not a big deal...

You do WHAT?

You use "gay" and "fag" conciously in negative ways, but only if we are not around? That, sir makes you a hypocrite of the highest order.

If your av is you, then I see you are not a "honkey" but I would never watch you leave a room, then say to my "cracker" friends: "thank god the "n-word" is gone, now we can make fun of "n-words".

People like you sicken me.

[Phatlip]

You do WHAT?

You use "gay" and "fag" conciously in negative ways, but only if we are not around? That, sir makes you a hypocrite of the highest order.

If your av is you, then I see you are not a "honkey" but I would never watch you leave a room, then say to my "cracker" friends: "thank god the "n-word" is gone, now we can make fun of "n-words".

People like you sicken me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cthCSXadyrI

[rabidbadger]

perfect

[masherscf]

It's all hate speech. It's not cool. It's not funny. It's not hip. It's not clever. It is a big deal.

Labels like the ones mentioned above are meant to neutralize people and deny their humanity. Italian, Irish, Black, brown, Asian, Arab, Muslim, Jew, woman, homosexual, overweight, handicapped and the elderly... all groups targeted by these "harmless" labels.

You would think that "geeks" would know better.

[rabidbadger]

It's all hate speech. It's not cool. It's not funny. It's not hip. It's not clever. It is a big deal.

Labels like the ones mentioned above are meant to neutralize people and deny their humanity. Italian, Irish, Black, brown, Asian, Arab, Muslim, Jew, woman, homosexual, overweight, handicapped and the elderly... all groups targeted by these "harmless" labels.

You would think that "geeks" would know better.

Which post are you referring to?

[xibalba]

I agree hate speech of any kind is wrong. But I won't crucify someone for using it, I have used words before myself though I tend to catch myself before doing so since I think before speaking.

[rabidbadger]

I agree hate speech of any kind is wrong. But I won't crucify someone for using it, I have used words before myself though I tend to catch myself before doing so since I think before speaking.

We all mess up once in while. And that's fine. But most of us 'fess up, and apologize, afterward. THAT is the issue here. Neiter JC, VG, JB, what ever his name is.... refuses to do. And so does Rev3.

[xibalba]

JV is the only one who should since he did it on his own time and I believe someone said he isn't a employee just his show is just contracted through revision3. I don't hold them responsible for what he said and released on his own site.

I hope no one is holding their breath waiting for him to apologize I don't want anyone to die. :D

He won't apologize odds are he probably considers the one he said after he said the word good enough.

[quantumblink]

It's all hate speech. It's not cool. It's not funny. It's not hip. It's not clever. It is a big deal.

Hate speech actually needs to have hate behind it. It's all in the context. If you can't get that, then that's your problem.

As Chuckles said before, it's all about the context. There is a "hate word" for all of us. When it's said amongst friends and I know it's a joke, I don't act like a crybaby about it. In fact, it's usually funny. Again, it's all about context.

(Not talking about what JV said, just a general argument)

Labels like the ones mentioned above are meant to neutralize people and deny their humanity. Italian, Irish, Black, brown, Asian, Arab, Muslim, Jew, woman, homosexual, overweight, handicapped and the elderly... all groups targeted by these "harmless" labels.

What? And those labels are acceptable?

By saying "overweight" instead of "fat" or "handicapped" instead of "retarded" you're still pointing out a difference.

It's very interesting that you left out "white" and "man". Feel guilty much?

"Human" usually works better than all those.

[rabidbadger]

...I don't want anyone to die....

hold on. you said you want every1 to die. But only if you sr5. :eek: :D

[Guytheninja]

We all mess up once in while. And that's fine. But most of us 'fess up, and apologize, afterward. THAT is the issue here. Neiter JC, VG, JB, what ever his name is.... refuses to do. And so does Rev3.

Rabid.... Bigfoot will be knocking on your front door before JV apologizes for Jack Diddly (and I think he left town anyways). Shock Jocks don't apologize ----> unless they get fired with a monumental media circus in tow. :rolleyes: And then the sign up with a new media company (and probably make more money to boot).

Its a very strange career choice, but offending the audience is the name of the game! Just look at what wikipedia says about Don Imus!

As "shock jocks", Imus and his crew, mainly Bernard McGuirk, repeatedly used "politically incorrect" remarks through skits and character impersonations in what they considered a comical format which critics labeled as racist, misogynist, homophobic and anti-semitic. He has also been accused of making offensive remarks off the air.
src:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_imus

[trunolimit]

You do WHAT?

You use "gay" and "fag" conciously in negative ways, but only if we are not around? That, sir makes you a hypocrite of the highest order.

If your av is you, then I see you are not a "honkey" but I would never watch you leave a room, then say to my "cracker" friends: "thank god the "n-word" is gone, now we can make fun of "n-words".

People like you sicken me.

I'm not a hypocrite. I use to watch my mouth around my boss because he is gay (actually all of upper management is at my job) until I noticed that he uses the word fag and the phrase ( wow that's gay) all the time. when ever I whine about my job he tells me to stop being such a fag. so obviously using those words is not a big deal.

now I don't use the N word and when I do I watch how I use it ( I'm not African American) because racist terms are a big deal.

I don't feel that the gay thing is on the same level as the race thing.

ya digg? I'm probably digging myself a bigger hole by posting but it's whatever

gay straight black or white who cares. we are all people and at the end of the day they are just words and only have as much value and meaning as you as an individual attach to them. I don't hate anyone I just really don't care what you do or be.

[arcticfox]

For JV not apologising i dont really care what this guy does, im more dissappointed with Revision 3, wether he is staff or not you would expect the "station" who decided to take on his podcast would have at least apologised for the situation.

Its been nearly 2 weeks and not even a peep, makes me angry that i ever thought that Revision 3 would be different than other "tv" stations and that i supported them for 4 years.

[Phatlip]

I'm not a hypocrite. I use to watch my mouth around my boss because he is gay (actually all of upper management is at my job) until I noticed that he uses the word fag and the phrase ( wow that's gay) all the time. when ever I whine about my job he tells me to stop being such a fag. so obviously using those words is not a big deal.

So, following your logic if just one black person uses the "n-word" as your boss uses the word fag that would make the "n-word" okay to use?

The last I checked, a single person doesn't represent the feelings of an entire group of people.


now I don't use the N word and when I do I watch how I use it ( I'm not African American) because racist terms are a big deal.

You DON'T use the N world, but when YOU DO you watch how you use it. So what is it? Do you or don't you use the N word


I don't feel that the gay thing is on the same level as the race thing.

Why do you think degrading remarks towards homosexuals are less relevant than those made towards other groups of people? What do you have against homosexuals?

[trunolimit]

So, following your logic if just one black person uses the "n-word" as your boss uses the word fag that would make the "n-word" okay to use?

The last I checked, a single person doesn't represent the feelings of an entire group of people.



You DON'T use the N world, but when YOU DO you watch how you use it. So what is it? Do you or don't you use the N word



Why do you think degrading remarks towards homosexuals are less relevant than those made towards other groups of people? What do you have against homosexuals?

I have nothing against homosexuals. some of the coolest people I've met are gay. I just don't think the gay issue is at the same level as the race issue. millions of people have died and suffered over hundreds of years because of what race they are. gay people have had it rough I'll give you that but not on that level.

I don't know I just don't feel right using the N word every other sentence like my friends do. I'll use it once in a while as a joke but that's it.

[rabidbadger]

I have nothing against homosexuals. some of the coolest people I've met are gay. I just don't think the gay issue is at the same level as the race issue. millions of people have died and suffered over hundreds of years because of what race they are. gay people have had it rough I'll give you that but not on that level.

I don't know I just don't feel right using the N word every other sentence like my friends do. I'll use it once in a while as a joke but that's it.

learn your history, dude. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_LGBT_history)
And read news beyond your border. (http://globalvoicesonline.org/2009/05/10/iraq-organised-crackdown-on-homosexuals/)

[trunolimit]

learn your history, dude. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_LGBT_history)
And read news beyond your border. (http://globalvoicesonline.org/2009/05/10/iraq-organised-crackdown-on-homosexuals/)

so according to that wikipedia article homosexuals had it good until the 4th century. homosexuality was common and excepted until the western religion came into play and under christian rule it became a nono. while its never been ok to be a different race. if you where a different race you've always faced persecution.

this is what I am trying to say that you cant say that if he had said some racial stuff everyone would have demanded his head on a platter but if he said some anti homosexual stuff no one seems to care. because its just not the same.

that Iraq thing is messed up. but again this gay issue is just starting to create waves as compared to the race issue. I think (hope) that history will come around full circle and homosexuality will be excepted once again.

[masherscf]

It's very interesting that you left out "white" and "man". Feel guilty much?

"Human" usually works better than all those.

You're such a white man. Doesn't really work, does it. But, add them if you want.


I'm not going to sit here and tell you how you can talk. But, I'm just going to say that I don't find it funny or clever, and I don't think it's alright. Jesus said (Mathew 5:11) "It is not what enters into the mouth that defiles the man, but what proceeds out of the mouth, this defiles the man." The person you hurt by speaking so it yourself. You bring honor to yourself by not acting a Douchebag.

[quantumblink]

You're such a white man. Doesn't really work, does it. But, add them if you want.

So there aren't hateful words to describe whites or men?

Interesting.

[masherscf]

So there aren't hateful words to describe whites or men?

Interesting.

Herein lies the dilemma.

[dirtyhat]

You're such a white man. Doesn't really work, does it.

What if you are an albino, like my friend john, he might take offense to it ;)


/sarcasm

[myrridin]

Rev 3 is not "promoting" homophobia...

Does anyone here actually believe that JV will ever be using that word in any episode on this network ever again?

The dude made a mistake, backed down and will not say it on any episodes....move on

Anyone who will stop watching the shows they normally did because they think they deserve some huge public apology is only hurting themselves.

It's hard enough to find places to get your laughs from and now you will deprive yourself of things that entertained you in the past. Ignore the content you don't like and watch the content that you do. Don't make it a bigger issue than it needs to be.

Actually Rev3 is not "promoting". However they are earning advertising dollars on a show that has received at least some views due to JVs homophobic comments. In this way they're not consciously promoting it, but rev3 and everybody there is profiting from it.

I've had conversations with both Hak5Darren and Patrick Norton and since then have been watching their shows. I never did get a response from Kevin, or anybody at Rev3, but I don't care anymore. A lot of people can't be bothered to stand against what is wrong in this world, and it becomes obvious pretty quickly who those people are.

To Phatlip, arcticfox, and many others in these forums, you've impressed and invigorated me by continuing to protest hate even in the face of JV's "army" and Rev3 throwing you to the road side. I hope to see you around twit.tv and hakhouse.com

I am an open-minded accepting and tolerant person. For these things I will never be sorry and I will never be embarrassed. Let the flag of tolerance and responsibility wave in the winds of change.

Just to cut you other guys off, yes I am a fag/queer/homo. Fortunately I'm not an intolerant douchebag, and I hope one day you'll grow up and say the same thing.

[Phatlip]

learn your history, dude. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_LGBT_history)
And read news beyond your border. (http://globalvoicesonline.org/2009/05/10/iraq-organised-crackdown-on-homosexuals/)

People also forget that homosexuals fell victim during the holocaust along with Jews and other groups of people.

[rabidbadger]

Actually Rev3 is not "promoting". However they are earning advertising dollars on a show that has received at least some views due to JVs homophobic comments. In this way they're not consciously promoting it, but rev3 and everybody there is profiting from it.

I've had conversations with both Hak5Darren and Patrick Norton and since then have been watching their shows. I never did get a response from Kevin, or anybody at Rev3, but I don't care anymore. A lot of people can't be bothered to stand against what is wrong in this world, and it becomes obvious pretty quickly who those people are.

To Phatlip, arcticfox, and many others in these forums, you've impressed and invigorated me by continuing to protest hate even in the face of JV's "army" and Rev3 throwing you to the road side. I hope to see you around twit.tv and hakhouse.com


Bravo. Nicely stated.
I am an open-minded accepting and tolerant person. For these things I will never be sorry and I will never be embarrassed. Let the flag of tolerance and responsibility wave in the winds of change.

Just to cut you other guys off, yes I am a fag/queer/homo. Fortunately I'm not an intolerant douchebag, and I hope one day you'll grow up and say the same thing.

Bravo, nicely stated. Keep the faith.

[Guytheninja]

You're such a white man. Doesn't really work, does it. But, add them if you want. I'm not going to sit here and tell you how you can talk. But, I'm just going to say that I don't find it funny or clever, and I don't think it's alright. Jesus said (Mathew 5:11) "It is not what enters into the mouth that defiles the man, but what proceeds out of the mouth, this defiles the man." The person you hurt by speaking so it yourself. You bring honor to yourself by not acting a Douchebag.

Even though I agree with your general premise. Choosing Jesus of Nazareth was an interesting choice indeed! Jesus would disagree with certain things that JV says and does, but --- Jesus was quite the controversial individual.

Example 1: John 2:13-16
13When it was almost time for the Jewish Passover, Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 14In the temple courts he found men selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money. 15So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. 16To those who sold doves he said, "Get these out of here! How dare you turn my Father's house into a market!"

Disturbing the peace like this would have been a crucifiable offense by itself as far as the Romans were concerned.

Example 2: John 6:48-53
48I am the bread of life. 49Your forefathers ate the manna in the desert, yet they died. 50But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which a man may eat and not die. 51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world."
52Then the Jews began to argue sharply among themselves, "How can this man give us his flesh to eat?"
53Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

And His disciples? John 6:60 60On hearing it, many of his disciples said, "This is a hard teaching. Who can accept it?"

Now these verses have to do with communion and the "New Covenant". This verse means that Jesus is the passover lamb, or the sacrifice for the sins of humanity. Jesus could have presented the new covenant in a much easier to accept way, but He chose to hit His disciples with a theological ton of bricks.

Example 3: (by far my favorite) Luke 11:39-53
39Then the Lord said to him, "Now then, you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside you are full of greed and wickedness. 40You foolish people! Did not the one who made the outside make the inside also? 41But give what is inside the dish [j] to the poor, and everything will be clean for you.
42"Woe to you Pharisees, because you give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all other kinds of garden herbs, but you neglect justice and the love of God. You should have practiced the latter without leaving the former undone.
43"Woe to you Pharisees, because you love the most important seats in the synagogues and greetings in the marketplaces.
44"Woe to you, because you are like unmarked graves, which men walk over without knowing it."
45One of the experts in the law answered him, "Teacher, when you say these things, you insult us also."
46Jesus replied, "And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.
47"Woe to you, because you build tombs for the prophets, and it was your forefathers who killed them. ...
52"Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering."

Can you say 0wned? Many people in the U.S. think of Jesus as this long haired Guy carrying a shepherd's staff in one hand and a lamb in the other. Its true that Jesus gave the sinner the parable of the prodigal son, but Jesus was not afraid to step on toes either --- especially if they were the religious leaders' toes of His day! Anyway, I could go on and on, but I don't want to write a dissertation on this subject :D.

[Phatlip]

Even though I agree with your general premise. Choosing Jesus of Nazareth was an interesting choice indeed! Jesus would disagree with certain things that JV says and does, but --- Jesus was quite the controversial individual.

Example 1: John 2:13-16


Disturbing the peace like this would have been a crucifiable offense by itself as far as the Romans were concerned.

Example 2: John 6:48-53


And His disciples? John 6:60

Now these verses have to do with communion and the "New Covenant". This verse means that Jesus is the passover lamb, or the sacrifice for the sins of humanity. Jesus could have presented the new covenant in a much easier to accept way, but He chose to hit His disciples with a theological ton of bricks.

Example 3: (by far my favorite) Luke 11:39-53


Can you say 0wned? Many people in the U.S. think of Jesus as this long haired Guy carrying a shepherd's staff in one hand and a lamb in the other. Its true that Jesus gave the sinner the parable of the prodigal son, but Jesus was not afraid to step on toes either --- especially if they were the religious leaders' toes of His day! Anyway, I could go on and on, but I don't want to write a dissertation on this subject :D.

Heh, how was any of that relevant to what Masher said?

[Guytheninja]

Heh, how was any of that relevant to what Masher said?

I'm just saying that Jesus was controversial for His day. I don't have a problem with people being controversial, but if they are controversial in a harmful way, --- in a way that does not help their fellow man --- I'm not for that.

Thats what I was trying to get across Phatlip.

[Phatlip]

I'm just saying that Jesus was controversial for His day. I don't have a problem with people being controversial, but if they are controversial in a harmful way, --- in a way that does not help their fellow man --- I'm not for that.

Thats what I was trying to get across Phatlip.

I know, I just don't understand why you were.

;)

[Guytheninja]

I know, I just don't understand why you were.

;)

I thought it was interesting that Masher was using a quote from Jesus of Nazareth to communicate an idea in relation to controversial speech given by JV in "the rant".

Now as I said, and showed above, Jesus was no stranger to controversial speech. There were other characters in history like Socrates, also known as the "gadfly of the state", who generated controversy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socrates

Well, what is the difference between say, Socrates, Jesus of Nazareth, and JV?

All three are/were controversial. But I think the real difference has to do with the nature of what is being said in the controversial speech.

Socrates was trying to open men's minds to explore reason and inquiry via the Socratic method. Jesus was interested in bringing the Kingdom of God to mankind..... What is JV trying to do?

I think that is the real problem. As far as I know, shock jocks generate controversy for the money. If someone gets hurt or stepped on, well its just business. Now I have a problem with that.

Anyway, that is the collection of my current thoughts right now. If anyone wishes to disprove them, disprove away! I'm an open minded person.

[masherscf]

Can you say 0wned? Many people in the U.S. think of Jesus as this long haired Guy carrying a shepherd's staff in one hand and a lamb in the other. Its true that Jesus gave the sinner the parable of the prodigal son, but Jesus was not afraid to step on toes either --- especially if they were the religious leaders' toes of His day! Anyway, I could go on and on, but I don't want to write a dissertation on this subject :D.

I don't feel owned in the slightest. Your acceptation to my reference is really quite odd. I was only tapping Jesus for that particular aphorism and using it to punctuate my feelings on the matter. If you're likening JV to Jesus, we have lots of other problems.

[arcticfox]

I like how the moderators have deleted all the posts i made a few hours ago, nothing like a nice bit of censorship of the truth.

[masherscf]

I like how the moderators have deleted all the posts i made a few hours ago, nothing like a nice bit of censorship of the truth.

That's funny. I don't see any deleted posts from you in the last few hours. Are you sure you submitted it properly?

I guess it could have been hard deleted. We don't usually do that though. We like to keep a open record of we do and when.

[trunolimit]

That's funny. I don't see any deleted posts from you in the last few hours. Are you sure you submitted it properly?

I guess it could have been hard deleted. We don't usually do that though. We like to keep a open record of we do and when.

you guys keep records? I had a couple of my post deleted and I have no clue as to why, I didn't say anything inappropriate.

[arcticfox]

That's funny. I don't see any deleted posts from you in the last few hours. Are you sure you submitted it properly?

I guess it could have been hard deleted. We don't usually do that though. We like to keep a open record of we do and when.
Yes im 100% sure.

[tokenuser]

Yes im 100% sure.100% positive that they aren't the posts you created in this thread (http://revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28206)?

[Guytheninja]

I don't feel owned in the slightest. Your acceptation to my reference is really quite odd. I was only tapping Jesus for that particular aphorism and using it to punctuate my feelings on the matter. If you're likening JV to Jesus, we have lots of other problems.

I was talking about the Pharisees being owned btw not you. :D

[masherscf]

I was talking about the Pharisees being owned btw not you. :D

Damn, that 4:40am forum reading... :) sorry.

[Guytheninja]

Damn, that 4:40am forum reading... :) sorry.

I'm not convinced that my idea got across correctly. I was trying to say that being controversial is not wrong. The message behind the controversy is the key to whether it is right or wrong behavior.

And yes, I think the messages are very different.

But as for other differences between the two. I'm sure you could write a large dissertation on that one.

[arcticfox]

I just had a nice reply from Jim Louderback in my email, just a shame i had to actually email him to get any response from Revision 3 on the issue.

Enjoy JV's World its clear Revision 3 care more about money than the viewers, looks like ill be going elsewhere to get my tech podcast fix.

[Guytheninja]

I just had a nice reply from Jim Louderback in my email, just a shame i had to actually email him to get any response from Revision 3 on the issue.

Enjoy JV's World its clear Revision 3 care more about money than the viewers, looks like ill be going elsewhere to get my tech podcast fix.

Can you post what he said? Does he care if you post what he said?

[quantumblink]

Well, what is the difference between say, Socrates, Jesus of Nazareth, and JV?

That's an easy one.

Socrates and JV aren't fictional characters.

[kzap]

That's an easy one.

Socrates and JV aren't fictional characters.
Ohhh!!! Low blow, I think you have offended every Christian on the board and you don't know there is more evidence Jesus exists than Julius Ceaser and he is considered fact.

[masherscf]

Ohhh!!! Low blow, I think you have offended every Christian on the board and you don't know there is more evidence Jesus exists than Julius Ceaser and he is considered fact.

Not so low. It could merely be argued that Jesus is the name of a historical person who's life story was fictionalized.... sort of like Daniel Boone.

[Guytheninja]

Not so low. It could merely be argued that Jesus is the name of a historical person who's life story was fictionalized.... sort of like Daniel Boone.

I'm curious if Revision3 is going to have a show about this! If they want controversy, they could just show William Lane Craig and Christopher Hitchens every week! I'm sure people would have strong opinions both ways.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9NlRKJBKt4&feature=channel_page

I can see the title now: "Theist vs Atheist"

[masherscf]

A big argument, an ultimately pointless. People seek to disprove the historical existence of Jesus in order to dismiss his followers. The problem of Jesus' status in history is irrelevant. We live in a culture that is directly informed by Jesus worship. I person might think Jesus is fiction. But, Jesus is real to enough people that it has practical consequences. Jesus is real enough to matter.

[quantumblink]

and you don't know there is more evidence Jesus exists than Julius Ceaser and he is considered fact.

riiiiiight

[tokenuser]

Not so low. It could merely be argued that Jesus is the name of a historical person who's life story was fictionalized.... sort of like Daniel Boone.It could be that the story of Jesus is the amalgum of several folk tales attributed to the same fictionalised person.

Christianity isn't about believing in Jesus. It is about following the lessons taught in the Bible that are attributed to the lead character (in the second part of the book). Who Jesus was is immaterial to the argument, because he is allegorical - giving a solid form to abstract ideas. It was a teaching method that was needed until Victorian England when reading and education became more prevalent. Its much easier to tell a story about how a man settles an argument than trying to teach jurisprudence to the uneducated masses.

[quantumblink]

People seek to disprove the historical existence of Jesus in order to dismiss his followers.

His followers seek to prove his existence so that they can continue to grasp onto their beliefs that he was child of god. Remember that the onus of proof is on the positive claim.

Any questioning or researching into his existence is a search for truth not some petty personal squabble with his followers.

You're right though, that real or not those beliefs have molded our society.

[masherscf]

His followers seek to prove his existence so that they can continue to grasp onto their beliefs that he was child of god. Remember that the onus of proof is on the positive claim.

Any questioning or researching into his existence is a search for truth not some petty personal squabble with his followers.

You're right though, that real or not those beliefs have molded our society.

The big dealio with religion is the afterlife. Since offering people rewards in this life can be quite pricey. Most religions defer compensation until after you're dead.

[trunolimit]

The big dealio with religion is the afterlife. Since offering people rewards in this life can be quite pricey. Most religions defer compensation until after you're dead.

If you had to pick your religion based on what you get after you die which would you pick?

I'd go with the reincarnation thing. which scientifically speaking is not to far from the truth. when you die your body becomes food for the earth and you are broken down and become part of everything else.

[trunolimit]

Ohhh!!! Low blow, I think you have offended every Christian on the board and you don't know there is more evidence Jesus exists than Julius Ceaser and he is considered fact.


I know jesus. I think he cuts my lawn Mondays.

[Murphy1d]

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/Intricate_Girl/Crummychurchsign-1.jpg
This is Jesus' church! Don't touch it! Aaaah! Aaaah! Drop it! :D

[Quix]

If you had to pick your religion based on what you get after you die which would you pick?

I'd go with the reincarnation thing. which scientifically speaking is not to far from the truth. when you die your body becomes food for the earth and you are broken down and become part of everything else.

For me it depends. I'd probably go with Christianity assuming I would get into heaven, but if I was having to choose a religion knowing I had failed to meet its criteria I would definitely go with Hinduism as it would mean I would keep coming back until I was able to transcend my Jiva.

[rabidbadger]

Really what IS heaven? close your eyes. think for a bit. Come back and tell me what your "vision" of heaven is. Honestly curious.

[Quix]

I don't have any specific notion. I don't think it would consist of laying back on an fluffy cloud playing a harp or anything. If I were to try to make a concrete description out of the standard platitude that in heaven "You'll have everything you want and everyone throughout history will be there." I'd probably picture my heaven (as it would have to contain every possible desire that someone would want) would essentially be a grand coffeeshop in the sky where I'd get to talk to the great thinkers throughout history and then get to go to my sky house and have sex with my supermodel wife.

[quantumblink]

I don't have any specific notion. I don't think it would consist of laying back on an fluffy cloud playing a harp or anything. If I were to try to make a concrete description out of the standard platitude that in heaven "You'll have everything you want and everyone throughout history will be there." I'd probably picture my heaven (as it would have to contain every possible desire that someone would want) would essentially be a grand coffeeshop in the sky where I'd get to talk to the great thinkers throughout history and then get to go to my sky house and have sex with my supermodel wife.

If you're willing to settle for the great thinkers of today and your house to be grounded, there's nothing stopping you from having heaven right now. (Plus you don't have to be bound by only one supermodel)

[Quix]

Heck, I have fun with it even when the people I'm talking to aren't even the great thinkers of today and I'm not sleeping with a supermodel. :p

[crumpsbrother]

Thanks for the ban guys, if what I posted was considered to be Abusive, then you guys are pretty god damn sensitive. I wasn't even attempting to be abusive.

Oh and thanks for erasing my sig also

[abehammy]

THIS is why we are "hating": (Please listen to all 35 minutes)
http://www.mavrev.com/tmp/Audio_0001.wma

It has NOTHING to do with the show! We never HATED on him, we just didnt like his show. Then he went on his 35 minute rant and hated on US for hating his show.

He didn't just insult the Revision3 user community, he also insulted the talent and personalities of the other, clearly better Rev3 shows. This is because he said, "I am on Revision3 and you probably expected me to make animations that you jerk it to." What the hell??

[Quix]

You realize that outrage towards a shock jock is pointless right?

[rabidbadger]

You realize that outrage towards a shock jock is pointless right?

Well, Mancow gave me hope that a few shock jocks can learn.

[dirtyhat]

Really what IS heaven? close your eyes. think for a bit. Come back and tell me what your "vision" of heaven is. Honestly curious.

A place where the women are hot and the beers are cold :D ...

[Quix]

Well, Mancow gave me hope that a few shock jocks can learn.

I don't see JV volunteering to be Waterboarded. :p

[rabidbadger]

I don't see JV volunteering to be Waterboarded. :p

If he wants ratings for his POS show, that's the best way to get em.

[Quix]

You really think people would download a 3 second episode?

[rabidbadger]

You really think people would download a 3 second episode?

Good point. The loudest are the cowards.

Quote me on that. And I mean, seriously, cause that's a good quote. haha

[trunolimit]

Good point. The loudest are the cowards.

Quote me on that. And I mean, seriously, cause that's a good quote. haha

NOT NECESSARILY, I AM LOUD AND TYPE IN ALL CAPS BECAUSE IT MAKES ME SOUND SMART. :p

[Quix]

Good point. The loudest are the cowards.

Quote me on that. And I mean, seriously, cause that's a good quote. haha

I've got to admit, the quote is pretty nice.

NOT NECESSARILY, I AM LOUD AND TYPE IN ALL CAPS BECAUSE IT MAKES ME SOUND SMART. :p

lol.

[dam7ri]

I don't see JV volunteering to be Waterboarded. :p

I don't ever recall JV saying that waterboarding was not torture, but since we are just throwing out names, I see you haven't volunteered to be waterboarded either.

[krishnancc]

I don't ever recall JV saying that waterboarding was not torture, but since we are just throwing out names, I see you haven't volunteered to be waterboarded either.

what???

[Quix]

I don't ever recall JV saying that waterboarding was not torture, but since we are just throwing out names, I see you haven't volunteered to be waterboarded either.

It was a smug quip, not something to be dissected logically.

[moomaster716]

So I just watched all 6 of JVs episodes and came here to comment on how great they now are but stumbled on to this controversy. Listened to hes rant and I have to say I like the guy even more. He insulted me directly but I guess this is his first online show or something and needs to realize than people who don't stand in front of you when they insult you can be brutal. I'm guessing he'll eventually pick up like the Pop Siren gals did and ignore all the forum D bags. Ill be a weekly watcher as this satisfies my Howard Stern fix. Also REV3 has only gotten better by adding all these new shows. I really don't see a problem with them diversifying as Diggnation still makes me laugh more than ever.

My only problem with Revision 3 is that its starting to take up a noticeable portion of my life and my tv is barely getting used. Also his insult bit on me beating it to VU meters in a sock. LOL thank you JV just be yourself.

[RottNKorpse]

Ok I like the show because it is funny especially with the story about the guy at Target but I do have to say JV needs to chill with insulting people of the forums.

Sure there are douchebags in the forums...because there are douchebags in pretty much everything but he kind of overreacted.

Anyway, I like the show and JV is funny.

I do like his idea of having live calls based on his show...that would be cool.

Even though I like the guy and the show...he's right, I hate him cuz his wife is too damn hot. :)