Project NATAL (360)

[thing2]

So - if you just finished catching the microsoft conference - you're no doubt aware of Microsofts attempt to dethrone Nintendo and the Wii on the interactivity front.

If you haven't - Microsoft is creating an add-on that will allow you to interact with games / GUI and who knows what else sometime in the future.

As a long time geek my initial reaction is always one of skepticism - but I'm curious what everyone else thinks?

This could be the first step to some true VR house hold gaming in 5-10 years...but somehow I doubt it's going to be much of anything right now or in the next 2-3.

I also kinda find it humorous that Microsoft is essentially spewing the same lines Nintendo did I dunno - 2 E3's ago - what with removing the controller from gaming to make it more approachable. I kinda chuckled when they said it cause - they said it like it was some groundbreaking thing - when in actuality - the world has been on board with that philosophy for a couple of years now.

[boldfire]

Hmmmm I'm on the fence. Although it is really impressive these things ALWAYS seem to work well on stage, the second you bring it into the living room you never have enough room, it's too light, too dark, something's in the way.

Frankly I like coming home and just sitting down with a controller and relaxing so I'm not fond of this move to everything needs to be acted out.

We'll see how it plays out but I'm impressed with the technology, but cynical about it in an actual gaming environment.

About the whole keynote itself I thought it was pretty good, looking forward to what Sony and Nintendo have in store for us tomorrow.

[cybersuchus]

I think Natal has the potential to make for some truly immersive games (though I feel a rumble peripheral should still be added). I find the technology behind it fascinating...especially if it can do half of what Microsoft is touting.

All that said, I don't see it causing a revolution in this generation. Further, I think that rather than tear down the barrier to gaming (that Spielberg was saying), it is actually going to create an even bigger rift than the Wii did. Real gamers like controllers damnit!

The Wii is fun and all, but at the end of the day, most of my gamer friends, as well as myself, would rather sit down and play a game, than stand up and pantomime.

On a related note, the Milo "game" was strange. It reminds me of a G-rated version of Seaman. Now imagine that on Natal! :)

[baldmonkey]

Is MS going to succeed in making us look even stupider in front of our TVs than Nintendo?

Who is going to buy this?

[thing2]

INDEED! That Milo demo was suuuuuper creepy. And yeah - one of the big problems with tech. like this is it doesn't work just right inside of peoples homes where you have ambient light - or poor light - or NO LIGHT. I'm not sure how Microsoft is going to get around that hurdle.....perhaps it's heat sensitive instead of relying purely on a camera - maybe a mixture of the two - but then what would one do in situations of extreme heat. If the family demo reel is to be believed - you can use it even in the dark - like the family who sat on the couch answering the gameshow questions. So - I'm guessing the technology is something "new" or at the very least improved.

I dunno - technically it could be a NIGHTMARE getting this thing to work in multiple environments / households. I'm thinking this is really just kind of a marketing tool to get more people to jump onboard the 360 train and pickup the console based on the 'Idea.' The kind of tech that's needed for something like this to be successful doesn't exist yet - maybe in a few years.....

Maybe.

[harryaka]

Seeing Natal instantly reminded me of the PlayStation Eye, which made my excitement studder a bit. But Microsoft's Xbox team has done pretty good so far, so I'm pretty optimistic

[ha1f]

This stuff really blows PS Eye out of the water, in my opinion. Plus, there's more to it than just motion sensing.

The AI for that Milo demo is... ridiculous. I don't know if I believe that it was completely unstaged.

If it wasn't: Microsoft is SKYNET. You heard it here first.

[ryudo]

Milo was just another Seaman,Nintendogs,hey you pikachu..meh.

The motion thing...HAHA Sega Activator mixed with Eyetoy and sold as a seperate device plus not coming for a while.

It's not native with the system.
Maybe can challenge the stupid Wiifit thing but as a whole..nah.

[mrpopular]

And after seeing the Natal my only thoughts are....

If anyone wants to by an Nintendo Wii let me know I'll be throwing it up on Ebay soon lol

[az0madman]

Milo was just another Seaman,Nintendogs,hey you pikachu..meh.

The motion thing...HAHA Sega Activator mixed with Eyetoy and sold as a seperate device plus not coming for a while.

It's not native with the system.
Maybe can challenge the stupid Wiifit thing but as a whole..nah.

Didn't I hear that they'll be shipping new 360s with the camera when it comes out?

I can see the potential for some fun, especially around a casual audience. Hell, it beats having to buy four controllers for a game if it can really detect multiple people at once.

[tamtamg]

I'm going to hold my excitement till I see some software support. I thought the Wii motion control was the greatest thing ever when it first came out, then after the newly wed period I never played it again.

[ryudo]

Remember this idiot?

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4361/loldrums1.gif



He now has a girlfriend.
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/1430/2ylljrs.gif

[ha1f]

Remember this idiot?
He now has a girlfriend.


Not even close. On one hand you have a professional drummer playing a game what was a terrible idea, on a terrible system (yeah, I said it), where the motion sensing was freaking terrible (you remember what it *sounded* like when he did that?).

On the other hand you have a random girl blocking balls thown at her with a complete range of bodily motion. With very impressive accuracy at that.

NATAL is really a step above the current Wii motion controls. Plus, there's more to it than just motion. It's looks to me like its almost a biometrics suite for XBox, and I gotta say, it's pretty damn impressive.

Oh AND its still codenamed. That drum mess was done how many years after Wii was released?

[az0madman]

Don't forget that she's much easier on the eyes.

[ryudo]

If this was on Wii people would be insulting it..if it's on 360 it's praised.

Wii fit can suck balls Nasal ..Natal...Hey you Pikachu/Seaman/Milo can also suck balls.
However Wii has based it's business model on this out of the gate,MS bought that Z cam company shown off at E3 3-4 years ago and is just adding it on Xbox 3 years late like Sega did with Activator and Sony did with Eye toy.

all 3 consoles are good each with positives and negatives but there is a massive ignorant bias towards wii and ignore the many great games that came out this year and coming this year and next.

But true that is also Nintendo being retards esp in NOA not showing off the better stuff from the first party in Japan like Dynamic slash cosmic walker Disaster day of crisis Sin N Punishment 2.

Fuck the first party I am sure Nintendo will repeat last year on stage but I don't care about that.

Grinder looks sweet,NMH2 will rock,Murasmasa will rock ..intereted in Fragile esp now getting a US release,FFCB looks cool Arc of fantasia,Gladiator AD

I am still hoping LA NOIRE on PS3 is coming And Sega's VC was awesome and Trico is pure win.

[thing2]

If this was on Wii people would be insulting it..if it's on 360 it's praised.

Wii fit can suck balls Nasal ..Natal...Hey you Pikachu/Seaman/Milo can also suck balls.
However Wii has based it's business model on this out of the gate,MS bought that Z cam company shown off at E3 3-4 years ago and is just adding it on Xbox 3 years late like Sega did with Activator and Sony did with Eye toy.

Ryudo I think you're missing the point of this thread - let's not start an unnecessary and unwindable console flame war.

Also - I think the chick was trying to pretend that this could be an active game and used as exercise - (ie: compete with the Wii Fit somehow) - but that's a stretch - AT BEST.
They both did look incredibly goofy however - Sir Drummer and Madam Spaz. :)

[ryudo]

I just think like Mii's and Avatars Wiifit and Natal are BS.

Natal was shown years ago at E3 already(under a different name)...it just took MS to buy them to get noticed.

Dreamcast had Dreameye PS2 had Eye toy MS now has Natal and people every time get all excited then they get a few games then forgotten.
Then another new camera will come along and wow people and they get all excited for it,it's an on going cycle with people having short memories.
Heck UBI soft just showed off their lame cam for a new Wii fitness game.

Also as mentioned the Milo thing has been done before several times.

So I see no reason to act if this is new and exciting like most people are.

[az0madman]

Oh come on. How is it not cool to be able to swipe through the navigation using this camera, or it recognizing you to sign you in (though one questions use of a photo vs real thing).

You say Milo has been done, and in a sense, it has, but not with a camera. Not through visual interaction.

[cybersuchus]

Of course, we all realize that along with this kind of unparalleled interactivity...

...

...

...creepy sex games are right around the corner.

[ha1f]

Again, theres more too it than just motion sensing.

Hell they demoed "You're in the Movies" last year and no one was impressed.

Motion sensing is nothing new, but it it works like it did in the Milo demo, this is the best thing demoed on a console. Period. Nothing works this well, and they've freed the player from the controller. What they do with the tech is another story.

And the AI may have been done before. It depends on how Molyneux defines "real". If that interaction was staged, then whatever, it is what it is. But if it wasn't, again it's quite impressive.

It's not new tech, it's better tech.

[ryudo]

Until I get my star trek Holodeck and get freaky with Troi.

bullsnots on balance boards and camera's that need big rooms but still use a TV.
Some Motion is ok but it's easily overdone in it's current format.

Until then bring me more Trico,LA Noire,No More Heroes 2,The Grinder.:p

[ha1f]

With how disgustingly bad Ubisofts conference was, I think we should all just rage about how they talked about No More Heroes 2 for 30 seconds and spent 20 FUCKING MINUTES TALKING ABOUT AN AVATAR GAME THAT THEY HAD NO MEDIA FOR. But thats probably better suited for a different thre--

AND THEN THEY POSTED SCREEN SHOTS OF THE GAME RIGHT AFTER THE CONFERENCE.

yeah. different thread.

[dolson]

Remember this idiot?

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4361/loldrums1.gif



He now has a girlfriend.
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/1430/2ylljrs.gif





LOL, I literally laughed at that!

Again, theres more too it than just motion sensing.

Hell they demoed "You're in the Movies" last year and no one was impressed.

Motion sensing is nothing new, but it it works like it did in the Milo demo, this is the best thing demoed on a console. Period. Nothing works this well, and they've freed the player from the controller. What they do with the tech is another story.

And the AI may have been done before. It depends on how Molyneux defines "real". If that interaction was staged, then whatever, it is what it is. But if it wasn't, again it's quite impressive.

It's not new tech, it's better tech.

Can I push Milo into the water? And hold him under? THAT would be impressive.

[ryudo]

^ haha!

Also remember Wiimotes through screens?

How many people will kick the tv over now?

Also can see a NEW 360 exclusive carnival games plus more party games using the whole body.


EDIT yup I remember this thing when it demoed the boxing thing E3 2007...Matt at IGN was hyped about it then.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZCam


ruh oh A challenger appears..so is this the camera happy E3?
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-09-your-shape/50153#comments_top

[wideawakewesley]

I think Project Natal is a fantastic innovation and I have a lot of faith it'll work as shown in the clips based on hands-on feedback from E3 last year where the company behind it were running a boxing demo that worked like a dream apparently.

My hope is that developers don't go too crazy. A good example is with the girl taking a penalty in the intro trailer. I don't want to play a full Fifa football match with Natal, but I would like to be able to take set pieces within the game. I think adding moments like that would greatly improve game immersion and if you can dial down or dial up that immersion it would be even better.

I'd love to play Call of Duty on my controller, but throw a grenade with my hand. That's not to say I wouldn't want full immersion for party style games, because I would, but for a single player or more hardcore experience, using Natal to complement the existing experience would be better than trying to replace it wholesale.

[bjkrautk]

You know why I like to play games with a controller?

Because it works.

Do you think that Natal will have you acting out things like QTEs from God of War? I played Ricochet back on the 8-bit NES....when it was called "Super Glove Ball." Even when it works, it's not that fun. Paint Party looked less impressive than MS Paint on my PC.

It would be interesting to see how the technology develops (I would kill to play a motion controlled SSX....but probably because it means I'm playing a new SSX). That said, I'm not convinced that enough people are going to buy in to this new peripheral for it to actually matter.

[gta_bmx]

You know why I like to play games with a controller?

Because it works.

Do you think that Natal will have you acting out things like QTEs from God of War? I played Ricochet back on the 8-bit NES....when it was called "Super Glove Ball." Even when it works, it's not that fun. Paint Party looked less impressive than MS Paint on my PC.

It would be interesting to see how the technology develops (I would kill to play a motion controlled SSX....but probably because it means I'm playing a new SSX). That said, I'm not convinced that enough people are going to buy in to this new peripheral for it to actually matter.


Well if it works well, it oughta sell very well. Games will have to be programmed with 2 control schemes -- controller and this motion based control. The only problem I see with it is player fatigue -- because instead of using a few fingers to control the game, you're using your whole body.

[cyborger]

I for one was blown away by Project Natal. I do not think about how certain genres will work on Natal (like FPS) instead I think about what can work and how cool it will be to play those types of games. When people mention how it takes away the controller and how FPS won't work, I get very angry. It's insane how people jump to conclusions like that. Some people don't realize that this is something optional. It's not the next Xbox console and you don't have to buy it if you don't want to.

Well if it works well, it oughta sell very well. Games will have to be programmed with 2 control schemes -- controller and this motion based control. The only problem I see with it is player fatigue -- because instead of using a few fingers to control the game, you're using your whole body.


No offense but isn't that kinda... lazy? Unless you have a physical condition of some sort, why should you be worried about tiring yourself out? When people go to an amusement park do they make every effort to reduce physical activity?

[franneldort]

Natal will far outdo the Eye toy and Wii if Microsoft can pull it off with the aplomb they say they will. As for not working in the dark, Natal uses two cameras to do just that. Check this out: http://spammingmyblog.weebly.com/blog.html