View Full Version : you guys are great and i want more help
comhcinc
03-13-2007, 09:18 PM
so a couple of weeks ago i asked for recommendations to help me fall back into comics.
i got a great response and alot of help. thanks everyone.
now i have got back into my routine and i've decided to pick up an X-book but the question which one? i don't know. you tell me.
xyzzy
03-13-2007, 09:21 PM
X-Factor or Astonishing. Both are quite good. You should start with the trades to get caught up, though.
comhcinc
03-13-2007, 09:22 PM
X-Factor or Astonishing. Both are quite good. You should start with the trades to get caught up, though.
ahh but that is one of my things i want to be able to jump right on and in a couple of issues be mostly up to speed
conorkilpatrick
03-13-2007, 09:23 PM
There are only two worth getting in my opinion:
Astonishing X-Men
http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/153/916833~Astonishing-X-Men-1Variant-Cover-Posters.jpg
X-Factor
http://www.marvelcomics.com/comics/onsale/covers/1105/xfactor1.jpg
kwok_talk
03-13-2007, 09:24 PM
so a couple of weeks ago i asked for recommendations to help me fall back into comics.
i got a great response and alot of help. thanks everyone.
now i have got back into my routine and i've decided to pick up an X-book but the question which one? i don't know. you tell me.
If one that’s currently running – Astonishing X-men, hands down. I have my gripes with this book, but I have to admit it’s the best of the current X titles. Well..would x-factor count? If that does, maybe that too.
conorkilpatrick
03-13-2007, 09:24 PM
ahh but that is one of my things i want to be able to jump right on and in a couple of issues be mostly up to speed
You're talking about the X-Men, right? ;)
I think you can jump into the next issue of X-Factor without a problem. Astonishing I think you can jump into a new storyarc without a problem.
I don't think you're going to have much luck with that on an X-book. If that's what you're looking to do, check out Ultimate X-Men; it's at a pretty ideal jumping on spot right now.
But, really, I can't say enough good things about X-Factor. If you want some quality books, check out the trades and read from there.
X-Factor hands down
good every month
reads good monthly
kick ass story
you could pick it up around 14 I think
16 came out 2 weeks ago
xyzzy
03-13-2007, 09:28 PM
ahh but that is one of my things i want to be able to jump right on and in a couple of issues be mostly up to speed
I'm sure you could do it that way, but neither series is that old. I think X-Factor is in the teens and Astonishing is in the early 20s. There's so little to get caught up on, I don't know why you wouldn't.
comhcinc
03-13-2007, 09:28 PM
I don't think you're going to have much luck with that on an X-book. If that's what you're looking to do, check out Ultimate X-Men; it's at a pretty ideal jumping on spot right now.
But, really, I can't say enough good things about X-Factor. If you want some quality books, check out the trades and read from there.
i've got about 15 years of xmen reading under my belt so i know i won't be able to understand everything that is going on right away. i'm cool with that.
and i just can't get my head around the ultimate line. i know too much about the characters i guess
xyzzy
03-13-2007, 09:30 PM
Also, if you're thinking about getting into X-Factor, PAD's Maddrox mini was excellent and essentially a lead-in to the new series.
comhcinc
03-13-2007, 09:42 PM
so people are telling me to read a book with strong guy in it. wow it must be good, or a sick joke
I have to kind of argue the 'Ultimate's at a good point thing' a bit.
Xavier just died - everything that comes after(at least in the next arc or two) will hinge on that. That story itself is at the lowest point one arc long.
When you tie that into his preexisting knowledge about the X-Men and the confusion the differences will bring, I have to say that Ultimate will be tough for him unless he wants to go back way farther than he's looking to.
so people are telling me to read a book with strong guy in it. wow it must be good, or a sick joke
it kicks serious ass every single month
conorkilpatrick
03-13-2007, 09:48 PM
I hate Stong Guy. HATE HIM. But I love X-Factor. It was one of iFanboy's Books of the Year for 2005 and 2006.
comhcinc
03-13-2007, 09:50 PM
I hate Stong Guy. HATE HIM. But I love X-Factor. It was one of iFanboy's Books of the Year for 2005 and 2006.
yeah i was just looking at an old issue of x factor where strong guy dies. what happen?
strong guy does kind of suck, but he's not that integral to the story. I'm into Madrox, Layla Miller, and Monet
drwally
03-13-2007, 10:15 PM
I hadn't the slightest idea who Strong Guy was when I jumped into X-Factor, but you can tell whatever happened before was before, and the writing is just excellent now. They call "Strong Guy" just Guido now. I think the writer Peter David just decided he can do whatever the hell he wants (almost, CW does intrude and feels like an intrusion between issues #8-10 or so), and I get the feeling he wants to write better than he ever has, hence the strength of the books.
I say this, get the trades for X-Factor, not because you should, but because they are just damn good reading and feature really fantastic art:
Madrox: Multiple Choice (lead in to the new series, damn good little story)
X-Factor: The Longest Night (also damn good little story)
People recommend these books not because you have to know whose mutant demon love child alien WHATEVER is related to whatever past storyline in whichever X-Continuity, but because each book gradually builds up your understanding of the personality of the characters. It's more like getting to know people rather than "catching up" on whatever continuity monster plotline thing was dictated from Editorial meetings.
And they are just damn good books in their own right. I loved both. I was just crawling through the Astonishing X-Men thread, as Astonishing get's lots of love thrown at it from people, and I think in about month (more because of money) I'm going to go with the consensus opinion:
(summary of Astonishing thread):
Just about all of Whedon's stuff on Astonishing is pretty good, but reads best in trades, with the best run that proceeds it being Morrison, which is where you run into some (maybe just a little) continuity confusion in Astonishing, and Morrison's run was both long and controversial in terms of who liked it, or where they liked it and where they didn't, as opposed to Whedon's stuff which mostly get's a thumbs up from just about everybody, so I don't know about you, but I will probably do this:
Order the trades of Whedon's past stuff (from last year?) and just Wikipedia the stuff I don't get which is leftover continuity threads from Morrison's run, while popping in now and again to check out the current monthly of Astonishing as kind of a "taste test," but probably wait for the trade. "Reads best in trade" is a very common comment about Whedon's stuff.
But get those X-Factor trades -- they are just so good. The current X-Factor monthlies are mostly just one shots, but they really do build on a growing appreciation of Madrox's personality (ies) in particular, as well as those of his little band of misfit mutants.
Luckily, I have no idea what Guido was like in previous books -- in the current X-Factor I really like him.
six-gun
03-13-2007, 10:57 PM
ahh but that is one of my things i want to be able to jump right on and in a couple of issues be mostly up to speed
Umm, all of the other X books probably require more background reading and aren't realy worth the effort.
six-gun
03-13-2007, 10:57 PM
Wolverine's Civil War Trade
it rocked!
horatio616
03-13-2007, 11:02 PM
I'd recommend the first part of Morrison's X-Men run. The E for Extinction 3-issue arc was excellent and forgotten in the wake of Astonishing and the disappointing end to his run on the book.
Morrison's run on X-Men is very similar to his run on JLA. The first three issues are some of the most exciting I've ever read, but then fizzle out by the end. Anyone else agree with that?
jerome
03-13-2007, 11:06 PM
I thought it was excellent all the way through. But i'm in the minority.
jo-relrollins
03-14-2007, 12:01 AM
As an avid Xmen reader( i own alot of the runs regardless of how sucky,darn those X symbols on the front,they should be paying me), alot of the titles are hard to jump into. Uncanny is in the middle of a 12 isue run that won't end until April. NOw XMen(adjectiveless) is starting on a new arc, but has repercussions from last arc(somehow some idiot made Rogue deathly ill with some virus,notice the bad arcs in this one,it has fallen off). New Xmen,about the young cast, is also on the last issue of an arc.
Now like everyone suggests i'd go with XFactor, for the most part even if you miss something(which on this book i have,'m picking up trades), you can actually still have a good time with it. Its well written,the art is consistent, and its one of the books i've seen with no delays. It has subtle comedy and a great mystery aspecy. Pick it up u'll like it
Now Astonishing is Also great, but being that ur jumping back in, i don't know if its for u. They're in the begining of an arc and there are delays with this book. The latest should be on its way. But it'll be awhile before the next. But if u pick it up and like it, imbetween to the next issue u'll have time to read the threads. This book has to be the number one Xbook with XFactor running a super close second. I honestly think u should pick up both(i do). They really have the best example of how writing and art come together to make a grat story.
Darn thats the most i've written on the thread(yeah). Hope this helped.
conorkilpatrick
03-14-2007, 12:07 AM
Morrison's run on X-Men is very similar to his run on JLA. The first three issues are some of the most exciting I've ever read, but then fizzle out by the end. Anyone else agree with that?
I'd agree with that about his New X-Men, but not about JLA which was great all the way through.
I thought it was excellent all the way through. But i'm in the minority.
I'm with Jerome.
We need a banner
NOw XMen(adjectiveless) is starting on a new arc, but has repercussions from last arc(somehow some idiot made Rogue deathly ill with some virus,notice the bad arcs in this one,it has fallen off).
I think you'd actually need to read Primary Infection and Supernovas to understand where they are now. Not that you be happy with it when you did, but that is my feeling.
Also, the art has SUCKED hardcore. It flips the hair behind its ear with one hand without looking. heh. Seriously though, it was Bachalo followed by Ramos. It's gone from ****ing totally indistinct to crazy giant-chinned cartoony manga bullshit. But some people like Ramos, so to each their own.
jo-relrollins
03-14-2007, 01:36 AM
I don't mind Bachalo, but the last two arcs have kinda disregarded alot and just thrown this group into some wacked storyline.
drwally
03-14-2007, 08:53 AM
See what I mean? X-Factor and Astonishing are basically your "everyone agrees" X-books. Morrison and others on X-Men: controversial, and more difficult to find agreement. I would also mention a Jimski comment -- much of what Morrison did was basically nullified by "House of M" and related events.
SO, everyone who hasn't read the previous posts and related threads can now go ahead and post on that topic now...Remember, this is a "recommend to new reader" thread, not a "fly a flag for your favorite" thread...
jo-relrollins
03-14-2007, 09:20 AM
Yeah,if u wanna jump back in i'd go with XFactor or Astonishing. But hy u might find another one u like. There's lots out there. Its comic book day today, explore.
:D
ekval
03-14-2007, 11:20 AM
Can't go wrong with either of the two popular choices here, X-Factor and Astonishing. Uncanny is in the middle of a way too long arc right now and X-Men just doesn't make any sense at all to me at least. New just holds no interest for me and Wolverine, well, it is just too spotty (as I feel it has always been) to really recommend to someone.
drwally
03-14-2007, 02:26 PM
Now like everyone suggests i'd go with XFactor, for the most part even if you miss something(which on this book i have,'m picking up trades), you can actually still have a good time with it. Its well written,the art is consistent, and its one of the books i've seen with no delays. It has subtle comedy and a great mystery aspecy. Pick it up u'll like it
Now Astonishing is Also great, but being that ur jumping back in, i don't know if its for u. They're in the begining of an arc and there are delays with this book. The latest should be on its way. But it'll be awhile before the next. But if u pick it up and like it, imbetween to the next issue u'll have time to read the threads. This book has to be the number one Xbook with XFactor running a super close second. I honestly think u should pick up both(i do). They really have the best example of how writing and art come together to make a grat story.
Darn thats the most i've written on the thread(yeah). Hope this helped.
I agree completely. This is a really great summation, and there is little I can add to that except this: Jo-Rel (possibly father of superman and a woman named Rollins) makes the point many others do: Astonishing reads better collected in 6-7 issue trade paperback collections, and not well in the monthly format. X-Factor, on the other hand, is currently a book that is designed to tell single issue stories, so great to add to your weekly purchase trip to the store.
The only thing I would add is this, which is an apparent diagreement above between me and Fred which is no disagreement at all. He likes some characters and Madrox in X-Factor, I like Madrox and some other characters in X-Factor. Point: X-Factor is like many really great ensemble cast TV shows where everyone likes the lead character, but then starts picking out who they like in the ensemble cast, and its different for many viewers/readers, just another sign of how good the book is.
So, I did what Jo-Rel did, which was after #15 I picked up the trades and loved them, more for the characters than for the story or plotline. This is what X-Books are supposed to be good at, were good at, back in the day. X-Factor #15, by the way, has this really hilarious "What has happened so far," which is basically Peter David saying, "I don't give a flying rats arse about what happened in other books/titles, but if you do, you should go buy them." But I still bought David's previous trades, and I now have a much better appreciation of the characters.
SO Jo-Rel, you like Jamie Madrox? He's kind of...oh, what's the word I'm looking for...
horatio616
03-14-2007, 02:43 PM
What the hell is up with that Xorn crap?
mikegraham6
03-14-2007, 03:28 PM
I'm with Jerome.
We need a banner
sign me up for that banner, i loved it and im proud! it helped bring me back into comics after a long hiatus!
The only thing I would add is this, which is an apparent diagreement above between me and Fred which is no disagreement at all. He likes some characters and Madrox in X-Factor, I like Madrox and some other characters in X-Factor. Point: X-Factor is like many really great ensemble cast TV shows where everyone likes the lead character, but then starts picking out who they like in the ensemble cast, and its different for many viewers/readers, just another sign of how good the book is.
Wally and I usually agree about everything but always in a different way
jo-relrollins
03-14-2007, 03:58 PM
I'm a huge Jamie Madrox fan, but from the ensemble I'm a fan of Layla,Rictor,Theresa, and M. By the way i'd fit in the superman's father category. Thanx for the love DrWally.
I hope my long windedness(is this even a word) helped u Com. I'd love to know which X-Book u chose to get.
sign me up for that banner, i loved it and im proud! it helped bring me back into comics after a long hiatus!
your wish is my command
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/fredhosley/jeromebanner.gif
mikegraham6
03-14-2007, 04:26 PM
your wish is my command
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/fredhosley/jeromebanner.gif
NICE! now i have to add that at the end of ALL my posts! :D
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/fredhosley/jeromebanner.gif
drwally
03-14-2007, 04:36 PM
What the hell is up with that Xorn crap?
FINALLY somebody gets it. LOL, thanks Horatio. By the way, I have been keeping dosiers on you all, you are all being monitored, SHIELD will be in contact any day now. Last I heard something called "Xorn" was temporarily banned to the "Astonishing 'New X-Men' Morrison Run on X-Men Thread," but he's escaped....he's with Fred, Jerome, and Mike, who are proudly displaying their Xorn journal entries as they march down the street...to the Decimation.;)
Jo-Rel:
I am totally a big fan of the man himself, Jamie Madrox. Have you read the trades Madrox: Multiple Choice and X-Factor: The Longest Night? Gosh, I loved those. I thought nobody could fill artist Raimondi's shoes, but Ryan Sook is just brilliant. Somebody is going to have to figure out why the Korean American community keeps turning out brilliant artists (like Frank Cho, Jae Lee, Jim Lee).
Monet to me is like a character I've seen done to death a dozen times. It's like Cordelia but with superpowers. Nothing wrong with that, I love Cordelia, and characters like that, but its just been done to death. I'm partial to Siryn and Rahne. I like Guido because he's just this big sweet dufus that's so slow on the uptake, which gives others the chance to explain what's going on (total writer's device, well used). Rictor is a really good character precisely because he has no mutant power, so there is absolutely no gimmick the writer can exploit, which forces him to be portrayed as human, and very well. I like Rictor.
And Layla? What can I say: "She knows stuff."
And I liked this comment on CBQ: "Wow, look at how all those guys died at that Hydra base. Crushed to death by multiple copies of Jamie. What a way to go..."
kwok_talk
03-14-2007, 04:41 PM
You can add me to the Xorn fan club.
FINALLY somebody gets it. LOL, thanks Horatio. By the way, I have been keeping dosiers on you all, you are all being monitored, SHIELD will be in contact any day now. Last I heard something called "Xorn" was temporarily banned to the "Astonishing 'New X-Men' Morrison Run on X-Men Thread," but he's escaped....he's with Fred, Jerome, and Mike, who are proudly displaying their Xorn journal entries as they march down the street...to the Decimation.;)
Jo-Rel:
I am totally a big fan of the man himself, Jamie Madrox. Have you read the trades Madrox: Multiple Choice and X-Factor: The Longest Night? Gosh, I loved those. I thought nobody could fill artist Raimondi's shoes, but Ryan Sook is just brilliant. Somebody is going to have to figure out why the Korean American community keeps turning out brilliant artists (like Frank Cho, Jae Lee, Jim Lee).
Monet to me is like a character I've seen done to death a dozen times. It's like Cordelia but with superpowers. Nothing wrong with that, I love Cordelia, and characters like that, but its just been done to death. I'm partial to Siryn and Rahne. I like Guido because he's just this big sweet dufus that's so slow on the uptake, which gives others the chance to explain what's going on (total writer's device, well used). Rictor is a really good character precisely because he has no mutant power, so there is absolutely no gimmick the writer can exploit, which forces him to be portrayed as human, and very well. I like Rictor.
And Layla? What can I say: "She knows stuff."
And I liked this comment on CBQ: "Wow, look at how all those guys died at that Hydra base. Crushed to death by multiple copies of Jamie. What a way to go..."
Layla is awesome. You know, because she knows things.
Rahne - I feel like PAD doesn't (know how to) use her. She just pops in now and then and turns into a wolf or whatever the **** that is
Monet is the classic ***** with underlying good characteristics character. Yes, it's been done but I like it.
Siryn I just don't warm up to.
Rictor I like, but he isn't really used enough to be in my list of favorite X-Factor characters.
Guido's all right, but the look of the character is not my taste
mikegraham6
03-14-2007, 04:46 PM
FINALLY somebody gets it. LOL, thanks Horatio. By the way, I have been keeping dosiers on you all, you are all being monitored, SHIELD will be in contact any day now. Last I heard something called "Xorn" was temporarily banned to the "Astonishing 'New X-Men' Morrison Run on X-Men Thread," but he's escaped....he's with Fred, Jerome, and Mike, who are proudly displaying their Xorn journal entries as they march down the street...to the Decimation.;)
Jo-Rel:
I am totally a big fan of the man himself, Jamie Madrox. Have you read the trades Madrox: Multiple Choice and X-Factor: The Longest Night? Gosh, I loved those. I thought nobody could fill artist Raimondi's shoes, but Ryan Sook is just brilliant. Somebody is going to have to figure out why the Korean American community keeps turning out brilliant artists (like Frank Cho, Jae Lee, Jim Lee).
Monet to me is like a character I've seen done to death a dozen times. It's like Cordelia but with superpowers. Nothing wrong with that, I love Cordelia, and characters like that, but its just been done to death. I'm partial to Siryn and Rahne. I like Guido because he's just this big sweet dufus that's so slow on the uptake, which gives others the chance to explain what's going on (total writer's device, well used). Rictor is a really good character precisely because he has no mutant power, so there is absolutely no gimmick the writer can exploit, which forces him to be portrayed as human, and very well. I like Rictor.
And Layla? What can I say: "She knows stuff."
And I liked this comment on CBQ: "Wow, look at how all those guys died at that Hydra base. Crushed to death by multiple copies of Jamie. What a way to go..."
for the purpose of full disclosure, the Xorn thing was a little bizarre, but the rest is gravy!
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/fredhosley/jeromebanner.gif
drwally
03-14-2007, 05:02 PM
ahh but that is one of my things i want to be able to jump right on and in a couple of issues be mostly up to speed
These are the words of the person who started this thread. So how many issues of the Morrison run are there, and how much of that has a bearing on X-Men today?:p
You superheroes -- So good, so pure of heart, so sincere, so honest, so charming...but you never see the goddamn BIG red button on the desk before the supervillain pushes it and the trap door opens under your feet...and you fall into the death trap and Xorn...:D
Note to self: Make trap door button BIGGER.:rolleyes:
comhcinc
03-14-2007, 08:23 PM
okay so i am going to pick up x-factor and amazing....too much praise from everyone not to.
what about new x-men? i have always liked the training aspect.
drwally
03-14-2007, 10:02 PM
okay so i am going to pick up x-factor and amazing....too much praise from everyone not to.
what about new x-men? i have always liked the training aspect.
If there are any "New X-Men" currently, I don't see much praise for it. Morrison's run was like 5+ trades, and that's what people mean when they put "New X-Men" on their "I'm with Jerome banner" which is basically not really "new," but several years ago, and seems like it was lots of unique turns and twists to the concept way beyond and past original X-Men concepts. Most agree that the first set of Whedon X-Men books (last year?) were pretty great, and those are all available now in trades. Whedon's thing was basically "get back to the roots of X-Men" and I think that may be what you are looking for--I sure as hell am myself. But Caveat: The Danger Room arc Whedon did is generally considered his weakest arc.
These days, any "New X-Men" is sometimes referred to "New New X-Men," with lots of past continuity taking all kinds of crazy twits and turns not everyone is very crazy about.
But I must defer to others on "New New X-Men" post Morrison (or post Morisson Nu X-Men" now being published currently. Or spend the bank on all the trades of the past Morrison that got erased in the "House of M" storyline. If you read the "Astonishing X-Men" thread you can get a pretty good sense of the Morrison run (and a list of all the trades it came out in).
Morrison's New X-Men actually lived in the adjectiveless X-Men book for about 40 issues.
New X-Men is another book of its own.
When people talk about New X-Men and say it was good they're generally talking about Morrison's.
comhcinc
03-14-2007, 10:14 PM
yeah i am talking about the title currently being put out
I can only say that upcoming issue #37 is being partially drawn by Niko Henrichon who drew Pride of Baghdad. That was a beautiful book.
iSteve
03-14-2007, 11:00 PM
yeah i am talking about the title currently being put out
I read it for a while. But it was only o.k. So I dropped it.
mikegraham6
03-14-2007, 11:18 PM
i picked up New X-men right when it started and dropped it shortly thereafter. i felt it was far too kid/pre-teen friendly. it was full of high school drama, which by itself isn't bad if its done properly, but this book just wasn't that well written. i had heard that it got a lot better after House of M and i was thinking of picking up the first decimation trade to give it a shot. it does have x-23 in it if your interested (am i the only one who thinks she is redundant? i mean isn't wolverine already in EVERYTHING???)
x-23 target has been good. I wouldn't go to the store if it was my only book that week(as if that ever happens) but it's fun and pretty.
six-gun
03-17-2007, 03:46 PM
i felt it was far too kid/pre-teen friendly. it was full of high school drama, which by itself isn't bad if its done properly
I'm 16 and I should probably love teen books, but realy, thaey all just piss me off.
Yeah, I read Young Avengers for Jim Cheung's art, but real teenagers don't wear their emotions on their sleeves the way Heinberg wrote them.
Yeah, I buy runaways because Vaugh is good and Whedon is great, but real teenagers aren't so dissagreeable.
Yeah, I buy Teen Titans because Tony Daniels and Johns/Beechan rock, but real teenagers aren't so noble.
But in truth, I guess that if there ever was a realistic teen bok, that it'd be boring, teenagers today aren't too exciting, from my perspective we're either pretty normal, or so screwed up its sad.
BTW: I HATE EMO's!!!!!!!!!!
paper
03-17-2007, 03:47 PM
[QUOTE=Mikegraham6;78244]i felt it was far too kid/pre-teen friendly. it was full of high school drama, which by itself isn't bad if its done properly[QUOTE]
I'm 16 and I should probably love teen books, but realy, thaey all just piss me off.
Yeah, I read Young Avengers for Jim Cheung's art, but real teenagers don't wear their emotions on their sleeves the way Heinberg wrote them.
Yeah, I buy runaways because Vaugh is good and Whedon is great, but real teenagers aren't so dissagreeable.
Yeah, I buy Teen Titans because Tony Daniels and Johns/Beechan rock, but real teenagers aren't so noble.
But in truth, I guess that if there ever was a realistic teen bok, that it'd be boring, teenagers today aren't too exciting, from my perspective we're either pretty normal, or so screwed up its sad.
BTW: I HATE EMO's!!!!!!!!!!
Yes, but if you had the super powers....
Yes, but if you had the super powers....
you probably wouldn't be emo
EDIT: they used to just be called jerkoffs