View Full Version : Getting to Know the Creators: Frank Cho
iSteve
04-18-2007, 11:51 PM
In honor of The Mighty Avengers #2...
http://www.basementcomics.com/images/Franko.jpg
From Wikipedia article on Frank Cho (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_cho):
Frank Cho, born Duk Hyun Cho, is an American comic strip creator, writer and illustrator. The second of three children, Cho was born in Seoul, Korea in 1971, but moved to the United States at the age of six and grew up in Beltsville, Maryland. He attended Prince George's Community College, before transferring to the University of Maryland School of Nursing, ultimately graduating with a B.S. in Nursing in 1996.
Cho received no formal training as an artist. He got his start writing and drawing a cartoon strip called University2 for The Diamondback, the student newspaper at the University of Maryland, College Park. After graduation, Cho adapted elements of this work for use in a professionally syndicated strip, Liberty Meadows. He grew tired of newspaper censorship, and ultimately converted Liberty Meadows to a monthly publication.
Cho has also drawn a wide variety of other professional material, including a new version of Shanna the She-Devil in 2005 for Marvel Comics. His Shanna series was originally meant to feature "mature" artwork including nude drawings of the heroine, but Marvel later decided to have Cho censor his already completed pages for the first five issues, and the 7-issue series did not feature nudity. However, Marvel plans to release in 2007 a hardcover collection, which will contain the uncensored artwork.
Frank Cho has recently drawn two issues of "The New Avengers" for Marvel comics. These issues include trademark Cho-isms; the character of Wolverine is depicted wearing a t-shirt that bears the logo "Beltsville", and many Liberty Meadows characters make cameo appearances.
His artistic style is generally detailed and realistic, but he frequently makes use of absurd or anachronistic elements in his work, such as dinosaurs, pin-up girls, and Pogo-style anthropomorphic animals. He also enjoys breaking the fourth wall, frequently inserting himself into his work in the guise of a talking chimpanzee, and on several occasions he has drawn strips that feature his characters interacting with other popular syndicated features (for example, a character stuck in a pipe being ejected into a nearby panel apparently taken from Blondie). The Liberty Meadows denizens have found also themselves sharing their strip with Calvin & Hobbes, Li'l Abner, Hagar the Horrible, Dilbert, and Cathy, among others.
As of 2007, Cho lives in Columbia, Maryland with his wife Cari and two children. He is currently the permanent artist on Marvel Comics' flagship Mighty Avengers, sharing a "by" credit with Brian Bendis, rather than simply a pencils/inks credit.
1) Frank Cho Website (http://www.apesandbabes.com/)
2) Frank Cho's Liberty Meadows (http://www.libertymeadows.com/)
3) Newsarama Article - MAN TO MAN WITH FRANK CHO (http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/MightyAvengers/Cho_01.html)
4) Newsarama Article - MAN TO MAN WITH FRANK CHO, 2 (http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/MightyAvengers/Cho_02.html)
5) Frank Cho interviewed on Fanboy Radio #74
http://www.libertymeadows.com/images/MBsatueANI.gif
mikegraham6
04-18-2007, 11:55 PM
In honor of The Mighty Avengers #2...
http://www.basementcomics.com/images/Franko.jpg
That pic seems to be the most appropriate one possible of Frank Cho, it explains everything:D
iSteve
04-18-2007, 11:59 PM
That pic seems to be the most appropriate one possible of Frank Cho, it explains everything:D
It seems to suit him.
labor_days
04-19-2007, 12:02 AM
It's called "research", guys. Jeeze.
mikegraham6
04-19-2007, 12:04 AM
Do you think she is his Muse?
iSteve
04-19-2007, 12:06 AM
Do you think she is his Muse?
Sure... let's call her a muse... at $500 an hour...
alexg
04-19-2007, 01:14 AM
Cho is a hero to us most self taught artists out there. I do think it's interesting that he studied medicine--he definitely knows his anatomy.
It seems to suit him.
did you mean it or they?
Sure... let's call her a muse... at $500 an hour...
it's not nice to call people bead-headed hoes steve
labor_days
04-19-2007, 01:24 AM
Sure... let's call her a muse... at $500 an hour...
Hey, muses' gotta eat too. Way to be insensitive, Steve. :rolleyes:
labor_days
04-19-2007, 01:25 AM
what do they eat?
Cocaine.
...10...
labor_days
04-19-2007, 01:28 AM
I dated girls like that. Expensive.
As if regular girls aren't expensive enough. How insensitive of coke whores!
steve-m-
04-19-2007, 01:32 AM
I live in Beltsville. Cho is a pervert and overrated. His website makes me embarassed to be a comic fan. His Mighty Avengers today was awful. All of the girls in it were exactly the same. Same face, same big boobs. If I didn't know he was too unreliable to be on any one title for long, I would drop Mighty Avengers.
wow - that's exactly the opposite of how I feel. Cool
kwok_talk
04-19-2007, 01:53 AM
I live in Beltsville. Cho is a pervert and overrated. His website makes me embarassed to be a comic fan. His Mighty Avengers today was awful. All of the girls in it were exactly the same. Same face, same big boobs. If I didn't know he was too unreliable to be on any one title for long, I would drop Mighty Avengers.
I think I'm more on your side. I thought the same things when I read MA today. It was like "sexy ultron" was written just b/c he could boobify things.
labor_days
04-19-2007, 01:55 AM
I would agree with everything negative you dudes are saying about Cho, IF he didn't draw such pretty pictures. Damn, these eyes of mine!
lindseyd
04-19-2007, 02:21 AM
I.... oh man. Cho is so good. I think he gets categorized as a T & A artist, and people often forget he's very good at drawing other things too. Not that the T & A thing isn't his fault, but damn he does draw some fine women.
I think probably the only way I could dislike Cho was if he teamed up with ... oh I don't know maybe Frank Miller and drew some really senseless, misogynistic shit.
Then again, that still hasn't tainted Jim Lee for most people.
paper
04-19-2007, 02:25 AM
I like Cho. I don't think the anatomy comes across as absurd. It's T&A, sure. But it's what those characters would look like in those costumes.
mikegraham6
04-19-2007, 02:39 AM
I like Cho. I don't think the anatomy comes across as absurd. It's T&A, sure. But it's what those characters would look like in those costumes.
and if they had butt and boob implants;)
paper
04-19-2007, 02:44 AM
CHO - Both very reasonable investments.
his women are at least realistically proportioned
I point to Michael Turner as the counterpoint
labor_days
04-19-2007, 02:47 AM
I could do with a little less cheese-cake from Cho but such is the nature of this comic book thing. I love Cho's beautiful lines and shapes. Very pleasing to the eye. And hey, I like the way he draws men just as much as the women. Ares is badass.
steve-m-
04-19-2007, 02:50 AM
I can't think of any natural woman in the world who looks like a Cho woman. I agree with Kwok, the whole femaie Ultron story seems to play to his strengths in the extreme--to the point of taking away form the story.
Mentioning implants, I think the point where I had had enough of Cho was when he stuck in the implant shot in the Spider-Woman gets her power back arc. The whole thing was stupid and juvenile and he was all over the internet talking about how cool it was.
I know several women/comic fans who have told me they feel degraded by his art and completely taken out of the story--today's Mighty Avengers being a perfect example.
paper
04-19-2007, 02:51 AM
Ares is badass.
"I like Thor better."
beat.
"HURRAAAGHHH!!!!!!!"
labor_days
04-19-2007, 02:53 AM
Cho's women are more degrading than Turner's flat out deformed women?
Someone please, post the Power Girl pic. I haven't the strength after having the wind knocked out of me so.
Cho's women are more degrading than Turner's flat out deformed women?
Someone please, post the Power Girl pic. I haven't the strength after having the wind knocked out of me so.
quick with a joke and a light of your smoke - it's fred with jla #10
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/fredhosley/JLA10Turnerteaser.jpg
by the way, women can actually physically look like cho women
power girl would snap upon standing if she ever managed to spend long enough chained up in turner's basement to get that skinny
mikegraham6
04-19-2007, 02:57 AM
you love bringing that pic out dont you?;)
I do so love to flash
um it
mikegraham6
04-19-2007, 03:01 AM
Mentioning implants, I think the point where I had had enough of Cho was when he stuck in the implant shot in the Spider-Woman gets her power back arc. The whole thing was stupid and juvenile and he was all over the internet talking about how cool it was.
What's this about??? i don't remember this....:(
kwok_talk
04-19-2007, 03:02 AM
I would agree with the point that Cho's women are more "realistic" than, say, Turner's, but I think he does more of the voluptuous exaggeration vs. a lot of the slim waif (but still big boobed) look that others do. Two sides of a coin, perhaps? I just thought it was really exaggerated with the whole female Ultron deal. And I found myself not liking the MA art too much this issue in general.
I haven't gotten to MA yet. working on it. Cho's women are beautiful and voluptious.
kwok_talk
04-19-2007, 03:25 AM
I'd be curious to hear any of our female forum members on this issue.
To your credit, Cho lovers, I do appreciate that his voluptuous women are proportional hip-wise and such. They're just curvy all over and not unproportional like that Turner-Power Girl.
I just read it. My regard for Cho is higher than it previously was.
itsbecca
04-19-2007, 03:55 AM
Hmmm. Well I'm the wrong person to ask in the "Are you pissed because they all have big boobs?" area... because honestly? They all have big boobs. Maybe I should be pissed, but I'm so desensitized. Especially since comics is hardly the only medium highlighting giant boobs.
I like his big hips and thighs, I like his strong arms. His waists are thin, but not unrealistically thin (ie - the woman have room for ribcages and necessary organs). The only complaint is the overly bulbous round breasts, instead of a more natural shape (again... not limited to Cho) and he places his tits to high on the breast (can I say that?)
I'm glad you feel that way too. I feel like my affection for Cho's style comes not only from the beauty of the drawings but also that they feature women that aren't going to die of hunger anytime soon. Ribs aren't hot - get that shit straight turner
kwok_talk
04-19-2007, 04:17 AM
Is seeing ribs that much of a concern with Turner? I think there was quite enough silicon to prevent any sight of ribs. :eek:
paper
04-19-2007, 04:21 AM
That's not silicon. It's power.
kwok_talk
04-19-2007, 04:22 AM
Let's just say then, a lot of POWER was about ready to fall out of her torn uniform in WWIII. (Did anyone notice the one frame that was just a boob shot?)
paper
04-19-2007, 04:28 AM
The one with We3 style snapshots of the various JSA members? Yeah. It stopped me in my tracks as well. But I mean, if you're gonna recognize any fraction of her...
kwok_talk
04-19-2007, 04:29 AM
I think that's the one. It was one of those moments, where you kind of feel bad that you recognize the character just from a shot of her chest.
re: turner ribs and silicone
My comment about ribs doesn't apply as much to Turner as it does to society in general. It should but it doesn't. The reason that it doesn't is that he draws these skeletal women who also happen to have enormous breasts. this is an even more unreasonable standard of beauty than we're normally force-fed.
Cho's women are curvy and voluptious. Their breasts may be a bit too perfect but their largeness is more realistic when you compare them to the size of the woman that they're placed on. This is not to call them chunky, heavy, thick, oversized, or any other derisive adjective that one might use to describe a reasonably-sized woman. It's only to say that they are beautiful and curvy and the world would be lucky to have a concept of beauty more in line with this.
We live in a country where women that wear a size 4 are all too often referred to as something other than thin. Turner's drawings don't help. Is it his fault? No, but shit like that isn't part of the solution. So give generously to the Fred fund and burn a Barbie for me.
edit: haggard bags of skin encasing 90 pounds of silicone are not hot
marshallg
04-19-2007, 04:39 AM
In my opinion Cho's overrated, nothing special, and the boobified ultron bordered ridiculous.
labor_days
04-19-2007, 04:41 AM
Let's just say then, a lot of POWER was about ready to fall out of her torn uniform in WWIII. (Did anyone notice the one frame that was just a boob shot?)
Visual assistance.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/173/464735015_819c410f2f_o.png
alexg
04-19-2007, 04:49 AM
If I remember right, I think Wonder Woman's first appearence in this week's JLA was nothing but a boob shot. Was it me or was that book extra disjointed?!
acomicbookgirl
04-19-2007, 04:55 AM
If I remember right, I think Wonder Woman's first appearence in this week's JLA was nothing but a boob shot. Was it me or was that book extra disjointed?!
*looking at JLA again* :confused: she was in the last issue from what I remember.. It threw me off a bit..
she's been in the book but her first appearance in this issue and one of only 3 I think was indeed a boob-only shot
acomicbookgirl
04-19-2007, 05:15 AM
she's been in the book but her first appearance in this issue and one of only 3 I think was indeed a boob-only shot
I'm looking but i'm not seeing it.. :confused: oh well...
lindseyd
04-19-2007, 05:25 AM
I'd be curious to hear any of our female forum members on this issue.
To your credit, Cho lovers, I do appreciate that his voluptuous women are proportional hip-wise and such. They're just curvy all over and not unproportional like that Turner-Power Girl.
I already weighed in on this, and I believe we had the Cho vs. Turner talk in a thread not too long ago as well. Cho doesn't bother me because it seems like he has some knowledge of what actual women look like (aside from the occasional Perfectly Round Boob) as opposed to Turner who either has zilch, or has supressed all of it. It would be nice to see women in comics dressed more reasonably, and less gratuitous tits and ass shots, but at least somewhat realistically proportioned women is something.
It is also nice to see a lot of you guys chiming in on this issue; on the topic of misogyny in comics, I think a lot of the trouble for women is wondering whether men notice it / are bothered by it. It is awesome to hear men openly vocalizing their desire for better stories and art instead of sexily posed bad girls, especially in an industry where it seems this is only being acknowledged slowly and recently.
itsbecca
04-19-2007, 05:31 AM
Visual assistance.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/173/464735015_819c410f2f_o.png
Ugh. Horrific, and not just from the objectification standpoint. Where are the boobs coming from on the body? They're like giant circles. What is the bizarre gap between them? Don't get me started on the cape.
itsbecca
04-19-2007, 05:36 AM
It is also nice to see a lot of you guys chiming in on this issue; on the topic of misogyny in comics, I think a lot of the trouble for women is wondering whether men notice it / are bothered by it. It is awesome to hear men openly vocalizing their desire for better stories and art instead of sexily posed bad girls, especially in an industry where it seems this is only being acknowledged slowly and recently.
I have to echo this as well. Makes it feel like less of a boys club.
labor_days
04-19-2007, 05:42 AM
If I remember right, I think Wonder Woman's first appearence in this week's JLA was nothing but a boob shot. Well, sorta (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/167/464776806_ef2ea7fdaf_o.png). To be fair you saw Batman mid-chest as well. I didn't think it was gratuitous or meant to call attention to her chest. In the distance Power Girl and Mr. Terrific are walking in. It's a matter of perspective in the panel.
(I love the JSA and the Legion so I'm excited about this JLA/JSA crossover.)
Where are the boobs coming from on the body?The source of Power Girl's breasts are as mysterious as her origin.
conorkilpatrick
04-19-2007, 06:36 AM
I know several women/comic fans who have told me they feel degraded by his art and completely taken out of the story--today's Mighty Avengers being a perfect example.
And yet there are several female comic readers I know of - LindseyD being one, my girlfriend being another - who LOVE Cho. Different strokes and all that.
EDIT to add that the art in Justice League of America #8 was way more offensive that Cho's art in Mighty Avengers #2. Way, way more. I"m thinking specifically of the way Power Girl is contorted around on the group splash page so that she can show us her cleavage while she faces the other direction to talk to Batman.
lindseyd
04-19-2007, 07:08 AM
EDIT to add that the art in Justice League of America #8 was way more offensive that Cho's art in Mighty Avengers #2. Way, way more. I"m thinking specifically of the way Power Girl is contorted around on the group splash page so that she can show us her cleavage while she faces the other direction to talk to Batman.
I really really dislike Benes. His women are overripe and his men are over muscular. It takes a lot to make Roy Harper unattractive, but Benes does it every time. Not to mention the gratuitousness of some of his BOP images. If only Pete Woods were on this book... oh Pete Woods <3
labor_days
04-19-2007, 07:19 AM
EDIT to add that the art in Justice League of America #8 was way more offensive that Cho's art in Mighty Avengers #2. Way, way more. I"m thinking specifically of the way Power Girl is contorted around on the group splash page so that she can show us her cleavage while she faces the other direction to talk to Batman.
When they're all around the table? Yeah. That was terrible (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/214/464834166_745d0f45e5_o.png) and completely ruined the scene for me.
conorkilpatrick
04-19-2007, 07:21 AM
I really really dislike Benes. His women are overripe and his men are over muscular. It takes a lot to make Roy Harper unattractive, but Benes does it every time. Not to mention the gratuitousness of some of his BOP images. If only Pete Woods were on this book... oh Pete Woods <3
It was actually Shane Davis and not Ed Benes this time.
conorkilpatrick
04-19-2007, 07:21 AM
When they're all around the table? Yeah. That was terrible (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/214/464834166_745d0f45e5_o.png) and completely ruined the scene for me.
Bingo. That was it.
comhcinc
04-19-2007, 07:27 AM
power girl- former stripper
as for mr cho (which sounds funny to me when i say it) i think it's his love and most importantly respect of women that you can really see in his art. he seems to be able to express that well. i think that's what separates him from so many others
lindseyd
04-19-2007, 11:22 AM
It was actually Shane Davis and not Ed Benes this time.
And that's what I get for not checking. Obviously that hawkgirl ass shot had me fooled; should have realized it wasn't gratuitous enough for Benes.
steve-m-
04-19-2007, 02:59 PM
power girl- former stripper
as for mr cho (which sounds funny to me when i say it) i think it's his love and most importantly respect of women that you can really see in his art. he seems to be able to express that well. i think that's what separates him from so many others
I think it would be hard to prove this statement if you have ever seen his website. His sketches of woman usually involve them being savaged in some way while naked. Don't even get me started on the discussion there--it basically revolves around a bunch of guys posting pictures off of porn sites. In no way can he be said to be showing respect to women. And I think it is a big issue as a person with a sister, a mother, a wife, and a daughter--and two sons. I love comics and I have encouraged them to read them, but many a good story I keep from them because I don't want them to think about women as 'boobs and ass'. Don't get me worng, sex is great, the female form is great, but I would find a comic full of guys with their schlongs bulging out equally stupid. I realize this is just my opinion.
As for the Spiderwoman thing, in the issue where it shows Hydra giving her powers back she is in surgery. As she lies on the table, there are two silicon implants behind her with a razor. Cho has made several comments on the internet confirming that these were implants and that he thought it was hilarious. Bendis mentions that he snuck that in without his knowledge on one edition of the 'Bendis Tapes'. Cho found it hilarious and I found it ridiculous and detracting form the story. Again, just my opinion, but I don't like his art. I don't like M. Turner's either.
conorkilpatrick
04-19-2007, 08:27 PM
Don't even get me started on the discussion there--it basically revolves around a bunch of guys posting pictures off of porn sites.
Um... what?
labor_days
04-19-2007, 08:33 PM
Um... what?
Cho's site has a section devoted to fan art (http://www.libertymeadows.com/brandydraw.htm). I assumed that was what Steve M. was referring to.
conorkilpatrick
04-19-2007, 08:37 PM
Cho's site has a section devoted to fan art (http://www.libertymeadows.com/brandydraw.htm). I assumed that was what Steve M. was referring to.
Ah ha. I read what he wrote as "don't get me started on the discussion here..." I am stoopid.
drwally
04-19-2007, 09:15 PM
I think judging an artist by juvenile behavior of people on the internet would mean to damn just about everybody, as juvenile crap behavior on the internet is everywhere and pretty bad, although people posting probably only represent a small fraction of the total number viewing. I think creators may encourage some silly behavior to drum up interest in publicizing themselves, but I still refuse to judge their work based on that.
I judge their work based on their work.
So here is the page in question from New Avengers:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/175/465389149_33795237fa_o.jpg
Put in context, this is hardly an endorsement for breast enhancements. That Cho and Bendis addressed this very well known aspect of Cho's work, in this way, actually shows a bit of guts, and yes, self referential black humor. Again, anybody who thinks this entire sequence in New Avengers, when Jessica get's her powers back, is some kind of endorsement for breast implants has perhaps not read the actual book. I think the whole Jessica Drew story really hits you over the head with the "You pay for looks, celebrity, and power with a pretty big chunk of your soul." Again, not exactly a ringing endorsement for breast enlargement.
And yes, my avatar now is a Frank Cho drawing of Nick Fury, looking damn handsome, DAMN handsome, with an expression not typical of the character, that comes just two pages after the above page. David Finch (who did previous NA art) is a pretty good artist, but I think all his men's faces look like the same guy. I don't much like the giant rippled muscle thing either, and I think Cho strikes a nice balance.
I think colorist Jason Keith also deserves some credit, because in the pre CW stuff I've seen, he completely steered away from the "oil paint tool" that every other colorist seemed to be in love with, and layed down some really nice, soft colors (water color?) that were a welcome relief to go with Cho's style.
Just my two cents worth.
bill_clinton
04-19-2007, 09:16 PM
Frank Cho is a national treasure. It's true - I got Congress to declare him one. I've got the paper right here. I'll go figure out how to work this darn scanner.
drwally
04-19-2007, 09:48 PM
Frank Cho is a national treasure. It's true - I got Congress to declare him one. I've got the paper right here. I'll go figure out how to work this darn scanner.
Hey, just make sure colorist Jason Keith gets some kind of "honorable mention." I really can't stress enough how burned out I was with other artists working that "oil paint" tool to death, Frank D'Armata being one big example. Keith's style of coloring (soft water colors) was a breath of fresh air in Cho's issues. I think that made a huge difference in the way Cho's work looked. Inkers and colorists never get the respect they deserve, poor guys, and they are the ones that are probably usually the most pressed on deadlines when the penciller and writer is late.
bill_clinton
04-19-2007, 09:53 PM
you are also a fine american
comhcinc
04-19-2007, 09:57 PM
wow that whole clinton would almost have been funny 12 years ago
I think it started in the WWIII thread. It was actually kind of funny there
drwally
04-19-2007, 10:02 PM
I think it started in the WWIII thread. It was actually kind of funny there
Yeah, OK, explains much, thanks. I was a little lost there, wondering.
"Guess you had to be there..."
steve-m-
04-19-2007, 11:55 PM
Um... what?
What I was referring to, in addition to his art posted there, was the forum discussion, of which, he is an active participant.
Obviously, this is just my opinion, and I TOTALLY REALIZE THAT.
As a peace offering, come stay with me for a night and I will take you to the actual sites of Beltsville--Frank Cho style: his old high school, the USDA (from the t-shirts), his comic book store, the Diamondback Office where he got his start with Univ. Squared, etc. The shop where he got his porn--just kidding.:D
paper
04-19-2007, 11:57 PM
Is that like the Ghost and Lantern tour they do in Colonial Williamsburg?
drwally
04-20-2007, 12:45 AM
What I was referring to, in addition to his art posted there, was the forum discussion, of which, he is an active participant.
Obviously, this is just my opinion, and I TOTALLY REALIZE THAT.
As a peace offering, come stay with me for a night and I will take you to the actual sites of Beltsville--Frank Cho style: his old high school, the USDA (from the t-shirts), his comic book store, the Diamondback Office where he got his start with Univ. Squared, etc. The shop where he got his porn--just kidding.:D
Oh, the Frank Cho Boobie fixation thing is real. I was at work, there is this little guy that doesn't read "trades" he reads "graphic novels," loves Frank Cho, disdains superhero comics, is a tiny guy with a little squeeky voice but very nerdy in a super science geek intellect way, but when he said "Chos draws really big boobies" his face lit up like a twelve year old (squeeky voice and dopey smile and all). Though, on balace, every artist has their "personal fixations," but I haven't seen enough Frank Cho that convinces me he has any fixation more out of line than any other artist. I'm don't like any any artist that does the "male uber macho muscles that don't exist in human anatomy" thing, which we probably agree on, but so far what I've seen of Cho is less extreme that other artists. My jury is still out, but so far what I've seen I like. I think Lindsey's "Bubble Boobie" thing was pretty accurate and very on display. But then again, it was nice to see Fury in a trench coat, and done well and different than so many. So, on balance, not the "Art God," but pretty good.
It's just a fact -- superheros will always follow idealistic body forms with few precious exeptions, male and female included. And Cho's art is not really that different from many others in that regard. I think the Power Girl pictures, anorexia+giganto boobs, is far more insidious. And you know what? "The Gays" just love Birds of Prey. I'm like the only gay guy that listens to almost all male vocalists not female, so my opinion is clearly odd. And a curvacious Spider-Woman with an interesting story, character development, and personality is far more interesting than one more no personality white guy character with a steroid body.
kwok_talk
04-20-2007, 03:45 AM
It's just a fact -- superheros will always follow idealistic body forms with few precious exceptions, male and female included.
Great points, Wally. For whatever reason, I've been thinking a bit Cho issue a bit more today and I tangentially thought about the body expectation we have for our comic characters. Some of us like this or that artist b/c we feel like they're more realistic and such, but then this point you made seemed to click. In the context that they are superheroes, these men & women are generally going to have the most idealistic bodies we'd ever see. In a sense, you could say they are intentionally supposed to be unrealistic.
On a Cho note, I didn't know that the New Avengers/Jessica Drew thing was him and I really didn't think too much about it when I first read it. But I thought that art and your Fury avatar are good, so I wonder if it's the coloring that makes me not necessarily like the Mighty Avengers art as much.
six-gun
04-20-2007, 02:45 PM
And yet there are several female comic readers I know of - LindseyD being one, my girlfriend being another - who LOVE Cho. Different strokes and all that.
EDIT to add that the art in Justice League of America #8 was way more offensive that Cho's art in Mighty Avengers #2. Way, way more. I"m thinking specifically of the way Power Girl is contorted around on the group splash page so that she can show us her cleavage while she faces the other direction to talk to Batman.
I think that the last page with Power Girl and Black Canary was the most offensive portrayal in the book.
drwally
04-20-2007, 04:18 PM
I think that the last page with Power Girl and Black Canary was the most offensive portrayal in the book.
I think where it gets really offensive is when a really badly written book is filled with T&A which basically says to the reader - "This is what we think of you. We just flash some T&A and you're happy, as a good story is not what we think you want."
That's offensive to any intelligent reader, male or female. I don't mind a little sexy stuff, but hey, gimme an engaging story beyond that!
I say draw me if you want to add some sexy to your book
drwally
04-20-2007, 04:26 PM
I say draw me if you want to add some sexy to your book
Doin' it with the Iron Man Boobie Ultron Suit?
(Sorry, had to go there)
Doin' it with the Iron Man Boobie Ultron Suit?
(Sorry, had to go there)
mayhap young man mayhap
drwally
04-20-2007, 06:20 PM
Actually my taste in "sexy" is so mundane it consistently appalls my San Francisco friends. See discussion and weekend threads.
mikegraham6
04-20-2007, 10:58 PM
excluding the smoking bodies, Cho draws some extremely beautiful women. All the women in that issue were gorgeous, except, surprisingly, Ms Marvel. but even if you look at the panels there's a lot of detail there, he's a great artist. My one problem? He kept putting those confient smoke clouds in front of the Ultron nipple region in some panels when in others, he clearly shows her having metal covering that area.... wierd, distracting but not a big deal...
jgg0610
04-21-2007, 04:58 AM
I think judging an artist by juvenile behavior of people on the internet would mean to damn just about everybody, as juvenile crap behavior on the internet is everywhere and pretty bad, although people posting probably only represent a small fraction of the total number viewing. I think creators may encourage some silly behavior to drum up interest in publicizing themselves, but I still refuse to judge their work based on that.
I judge their work based on their work.
So here is the page in question from New Avengers:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/175/465389149_33795237fa_o.jpg
Put in context, this is hardly an endorsement for breast enhancements. That Cho and Bendis addressed this very well known aspect of Cho's work, in this way, actually shows a bit of guts, and yes, self referential black humor. Again, anybody who thinks this entire sequence in New Avengers, when Jessica get's her powers back, is some kind of endorsement for breast implants has perhaps not read the actual book. I think the whole Jessica Drew story really hits you over the head with the "You pay for looks, celebrity, and power with a pretty big chunk of your soul." Again, not exactly a ringing endorsement for breast enlargement.
And yes, my avatar now is a Frank Cho drawing of Nick Fury, looking damn handsome, DAMN handsome, with an expression not typical of the character, that comes just two pages after the above page. David Finch (who did previous NA art) is a pretty good artist, but I think all his men's faces look like the same guy. I don't much like the giant rippled muscle thing either, and I think Cho strikes a nice balance.
I think colorist Jason Keith also deserves some credit, because in the pre CW stuff I've seen, he completely steered away from the "oil paint tool" that every other colorist seemed to be in love with, and layed down some really nice, soft colors (water color?) that were a welcome relief to go with Cho's style.
Just my two cents worth.
Out of curiosity, what issue of NA is this from? I don't recall having read this before.
labor_days
04-21-2007, 05:04 AM
I think that was during the Spider-Woman arc, 14-16 or there about.
keithm
04-21-2007, 05:10 AM
I hate being the voice of dissent, but Cho's arc doesn't really work for me. Everything he draws is just too lumpy. And no, I'm not referring to the lady lumps. You can really see it in his Iron Man. Tony's armor looks fat and stubby. Also, he draw women's hair horribly. It looks chuncky and lacks any sense of fluidity.
It doesn't really play into how I feel about his art, but I can't stand how he comes off in interviews. Like, it's one thing to be the guy who draws big boobs, but he makes a point of commenting how it's like "his thing." I don't know, it just comes off as really immature to me.