Discovering New Characters

[paper]

I wanted to set up a thread where we could talk about the characters we've always wanted to know more about. Wikipedia is the obvious starting point to learn about a character, but that information is often pretty objective. Sometimes there are hidden gems, stories about the character known only by the true comic fans. Let's pool our knowledge.

I'll start the ball rolling:

I'd like to learn more about Zatanna and Hawkman.

Where should I look?

EDIT: Referencing Wikipedia or any other resource is fine. But the goal is to narrow it down so that only the best comics are being recommended.

[iSteve]

You mean I have to contribute to this thread without referencing Wikipedia??? Oh man!

[paper]

You can reference anything, including Wikipedia. I guess the idea is just to narrow it down a bit. If Wiki offers the first appearance of, say, Zatanna, is that worth reading?

If a character's history--across many books--can be compared to an ongoing series, what's the best jumping-on point? What's the best arc?

If someone wanted to start reading Batman comics, I probably wouldn't suggest going all the way back to those early Detective Comics. I'd probably suggest Batman: Year One, the animated series, and some of the more recent arcs (comparatively; not Hush).

[fred]

I've always wanted to know more about Hermaphrohawk. What does everyone know about shim/it?

[paper]

For the definitive origin of Hermaphrohawk, check out the Undroppables thread (http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3554&page=2&highlight=hermaphrohawk). The term itself was coined by Darron after a *correction to a previous post by iSteve, but the character was popularized by Fred (known rabble-rouser). The character is still at large.


*iSteve's original post suggested that Hawkman changed genders and took on the mantle of Hawkgirl during the One Year Later event. His correction--that Hawkman had merely left the series to be replaced by Hawkgirl--opened a proverbial can of worms, inviting blatant questions of Hawkman's sexual identity, and the concept of transgender metamorphosis to the forefront of Rev3 discussion.

[fred]

thanks paper - awesome explanation

I smell wiki stub

[jerome]

the Zatanna miniseries in Grant Morrison's Seven Soldiers is the best material i've read where she's featured prominently. Her sections were also drawn by Ryan Sook, of X-Factor fame.

[iSteve]

the Zatanna miniseries in Grant Morrison's Seven Soldiers is the best material i've read where she's featured prominently. Her sections were also drawn by Ryan Sook, of X-Factor fame.

I second that. Zatanna's portion of Seven Soldiers is the best of that series.

[iSteve]

For the definitive origin of Hermaphrohawk, check out the Undroppables thread (http://www.revision3.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3554&page=2&highlight=hermaphrohawk). The term itself was coined by Darron after a *correction to a previous post by iSteve, but the character was popularized by Fred (known rabble-rouser). The character is still at large.


*iSteve's original post suggested that Hawkman changed genders and took on the mantle of Hawkgirl during the One Year Later event. His correction--that Hawkman had merely left the series to be replaced by Hawkgirl--opened a proverbial can of worms, inviting blatant questions of Hawkman's sexual identity, and the concept of transgender metamorphosis to the forefront of Rev3 discussion.

Very nice summary, Paper. You made sense of the nonsensical.

[fred]

now now now
let's all be sensitive to the transgendered comic book characters

[iSteve]

now now now
let's all be sensitive to the transgendered comic book characters

That's our Fred - sticking up for oppressed sexual minorities.

[paper]

Cool. I'm gonna look around for those Seven Soldiers issues. Thanks, guys.

The only trade I could find was JLA: Zatanna's Search. I'd read some poor reviews. Can anyone vouch for it?

Any takers on Hawkman? I'm curious about the Geoff Johns run. The first six issues are collected in a book called 'Endless Flight.'

[Mikegraham6]

Cool. I'm gonna look around for those Seven Soldiers issues. Thanks, guys.

The only trade I could find was JLA: Zatanna's Search. I'd read some poor reviews. Can anyone vouch for it?

Any takers on Hawkman? I'm curious about the Geoff Johns run. The first six issues are collected in a book called 'Endless Flight.'

i always heard that hawkman has one of the most convoluted and complex origins in all of comics, but apparently Johns made sense of it in JSA: Return of Hawkman (haven't read it though, so don't quote me on that)

[ConorKilpatrick]

Zatanna had a pretty prominant role in Identity Crisis and the crossover issues in JLA that were referenced in another thread. I've always liked her. I'm not sure why. I like the idea of a stage magician who is also a bemused (but kickass) superhero. She's also a force to be reckoned with in Justice League Heroes (http://justiceleagueheroes.warnerbros.com/).

Hawkman... Hawkman is tough. He's the poster child for F-ed up continuity. The solo book that Geoff Johns wrote a while back was pretty good.

[ConorKilpatrick]

Any takers on Hawkman? I'm curious about the Geoff Johns run. The first six issues are collected in a book called 'Endless Flight.'

Yeah, that's the one. Johns did a pretty good job of cleaning up what was thought to be an uncleanable mess.

Hawkman was also very funny in the appearances he made in Giffen/DeMatteis' Justice League (but then, who wasn't?). Alas, those books aren't really collected.

[fred]

That's our Fred - sticking up for oppressed sexual minorities.

I always do

[paper]

Zatanna had a pretty prominant role in Identity Crisis and the crossover issues in JLA that were referenced in another thread. I've always liked her. I'm not sure why. I like the idea of a stage magician who is also a bemused (but kickass) superhero. She's also a force to be reckoned with in Justice League Heroes (http://justiceleagueheroes.warnerbros.com/).

Hawkman... Hawkman is tough. He's the poster child for F-ed up continuity. The solo book that Geoff Johns wrote a while back was pretty good.

Thanks, Conor. I'm gonna try and track down those JLA crossover issues.

[ConorKilpatrick]

Thanks, Conor. I'm gonna try and track down those JLA crossover issues.

I also endorse the Zatanna Seven Soldiers mini-series. That was indeed the best of the lot.

[paper]

Alright, thanks for the suggestions, guys. I'm going to present two new characters, but if anyone wants to throw out futher Zatanna or Hawkman recommendations, go right ahead. They'd be most appreciated. Or, feel free to ask about characters you're interested in learning more about.

As for now, how about Dr. Fate or Two-Face?

[ConorKilpatrick]

... or Two-Face?

Rucka's run on Detective Comics. There was a fantastic arc involving Two-face and Montoya.

[Mikegraham6]

i know absolutely nothing about Dr. fate and its a good thing you brought him up because he seems to have a cult following.
as for two face, the most recent good two face story was face to face, batman's One Year Later story

[ConorKilpatrick]

As for now, how about Dr. Fate ...?

Which Dr. Fate - Kent Nelson or Hector Hall?

[Mikegraham6]

correct me if im wrong but aren't the Hall family tied in with Neil Gaiman's Sandman? everytime i hear that named im reminded of that book for some reason, but i just can't be bothered to pull out my whole sandman collection

[ConorKilpatrick]

correct me if im wrong but aren't the Hall family tied in with Neil Gaiman's Sandman? everytime i hear that named im reminded of that book for some reason, but i just can't be bothered to pull out my whole sandman collection

Hector Hall is the son of Carter Hall, AKA Hawkman.

[paper]

Whichever Dr. Fate is more interesting. I know next to nothing about either. But I liked the Dr. Fate portrayed in JLU: The Animated Series.

[CAM!]

THere's also a pretty good Zatanna One shot Prestige Format that Paul Dini wrote a couple years back. It's worth checking out.

[paper]

Looks like Zatanna is featuring prominently in a 2 part Dini Detective Comics arc in June.

I keep trying to drop this book too...

[Jo-RelRollins]

From what i've heard Kent Nelson's grandson is gonna be the new Dr Fate. So he might be the most interesting,alongnwith Nabu(the proprietor of the Fate powers).

[paper]

DC's website claims that Dr. Fate #1 came out last week. What's the deal with that? Did I miss it?

[iSteve]

DC's website claims that Dr. Fate #1 came out last week. What's the deal with that? Did I miss it?

It's not always correct. I don't see it on the Diamond list for this week either.

[Jo-RelRollins]

I must have too,i actualy wanted to jump on the Fate bandwagon.

[Jo-RelRollins]

I actually wanna know more about Mr. Terrific. I have always been a Marvel and DC fan,but not so much DC(i also like other companies too,but mainly those). And recently(over the last year),been getting into DC. Mr. Terrific intrigues me. Ever since JLU. I'm wondering if there are any trades or books that really give a big idea on who he is. I would like something indepth to get to know him as a character.

[ConorKilpatrick]

I actually wanna know more about Mr. Terrific. I have always been a Marvel and DC fan,but not so much DC(i also like other companies too,but mainly those). And recently(over the last year),been getting into DC. Mr. Terrific intrigues me. Ever since JLU. I'm wondering if there are any trades or books that really give a big idea on who he is. I would like something indepth to get to know him as a character.

I've really only read him in JSA and Checkmate. I recommend Geoff John's last JSA series for good Mr. Terrific stories.

[Six Gun]

I've really only read him in JSA and Checkmate. I recommend Geoff John's last JSA series for good Mr. Terrific stories.

His role in Checkmate looks to be growing.

[Jo-RelRollins]

Never read Checkmate,is it good? I'm actually confused on them,are they good or evil? What are they exactly?

[ConorKilpatrick]

Never read Checkmate,is it good? I'm actually confused on them,are they good or evil? What are they exactly?

We did a whole segment on how good Checkmate is a few shows ago.

Greg Rucka about Checkmate (vol. 2)

Rucka was quoted regarding the new series: "Take a big chunk of The OMAC Project, take the concept of "Who Watches the Watchmen?" and throw in some James Bond and you've got Checkmate." Rucka's stated plans in several interviews include depicting the repurposing of Checkmate as a United Nations-affiliated intelligence/intervention force with a specific purpose of maintaining "balance" between Earth's human and metahuman communities in the wake of events in The OMAC Project and Infinite Crisis.

[Jo-RelRollins]

is there a trade of the current runs u mentioned? i'd like to pick up some good Checkmate and JSA trades.

[paper]

Just the one trade of Checkmate (http://www.amazon.com/Checkmate-Kings-Game-Greg-Rucka/dp/1401212204/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/102-1428809-0488915?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1177381732&sr=8-1) so far.

[JGG0610]

Just the one trade of Checkmate (http://www.amazon.com/Checkmate-Kings-Game-Greg-Rucka/dp/1401212204/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/102-1428809-0488915?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1177381732&sr=8-1) so far.
I just finished reading this trade at lunch today and its fantastic. To say that's it's dense is an understatement but in this case it really works. Highly recommended.

[MastaP]

I actually wanna know more about Mr. Terrific. I have always been a Marvel and DC fan,but not so much DC(i also like other companies too,but mainly those). And recently(over the last year),been getting into DC. Mr. Terrific intrigues me. Ever since JLU. I'm wondering if there are any trades or books that really give a big idea on who he is. I would like something indepth to get to know him as a character.

The only other real appearences he's made outside JSA and Checkmate, is in the Old Spectre series where he premiered, it's a good series but other than creating him it doesn't do too much.

[paper]

This thread has really convinced me that I just need to track down the great collections of JLA and JSA. It would seem that everything I'm looking for is in those books. I love team books, so why not grab the best of the best? Up until now my only real association with these books has been the current runs of JSA and JLA, the animated JLU, and JLA Year One.

I think I'm going to spend the next few months reading a lot about Justice something-or-others of America.

[ConorKilpatrick]

This thread has really convinced me that I just need to track down the great collections of JLA and JSA. It would seem that everything I'm looking for is in those books. I love team books, so why not grab the best of the best? Up until now my only real association with these books has been the current runs of JSA and JLA, the animated JLU, and JLA Year One.

I think I'm going to spend the next few months reading a lot about Justice something-or-others of America.

The Grant Morrison JLA trades! The ones that acomicbookgirl bought from Kal! Get those!

[fred]

they are good. I'm by no means a DC guy and I liked them a lot

[DarrOn]

Yea, I have three of Morrison's JLA trades and they're ALL fantastic. Some crazy-ass storylines, man.

MAH-GEDD-DON!

[paper]

Just sayin'. Whoever gets to ACBG's mailbox first....


The Morrison JLA books are tops on my list. I'm gonna try and get one tomorrow at the shop.

[acomicbookgirl]

Just sayin'. Whoever gets to ACBG's mailbox first....


The Morrison JLA books are tops on my list. I'm gonna try and get one tomorrow at the shop.



I asked for those fairly.. Not my fault you weren't around when I asked for it. I knen I should've opened my mouth but I figured it was ok since everyone else was saying something of what they got.. :( :confused:

Stealing them from my mailbox? You conscience not mine...

[paper]

I asked for those fairly.. Not my fault you weren't around when I asked for it. I knen I should've opened my mouth but I figured it was ok since everyone else was saying something of what they got.. :( :confused:

Stealing them from my mailbox? You conscience not mine...

Just kidding around. I know you love the Morrison. Glad they're going to a good home. :D

I'm debating this. Do I start the Morrison JLA or the Goyer/Johns JSA? I'm actually leaning towards the JSA just based on the reviews I've read.

[ConorKilpatrick]

Just kidding around. I know you love the Morrison. Glad they're going to a good home. :D

I'm debating this. Do I start the Morrison JLA or the Goyer/Johns JSA? I'm actually leaning towards the JSA just based on the reviews I've read.

I have two schools of thought on this.

1. Morrison's JLA is the better of the two books, but

2. Johns' JSA might help you enjoy the current series EVEN MORE, so...

Up to you.

http://www.thesuperheroquiz.com/villain/pics/two-face.jpg

[paper]

The coin lands on its edge.

I'll either alternate between the two, or I'll get one of each whenever I decide to get two trades.

[Mikegraham6]

anyone know the best place to start on those JSA trades? i looked them up on Amazon and there seems to be a lot of them

[DrWally]

anyone know the best place to start on those JSA trades? i looked them up on Amazon and there seems to be a lot of them

Bingo, Mike, you hit the problem right on the nose -- TONS of JSA out there by Johns. That man is certainly prolific. The question then becomes -- do you go all the way back to the beginning of the JSA revival, and start from there, or is there a later point in the trades to jump on?

Since there seems to be much interest in characters with lots of history (Hawkman, Dr. Fate, the entire JSA) I would strongly suggest the podcast The Golden Age of Comics by Bill Jourdain, where he focuses on the Golden Age origins of one character each podcast. He hasn't done many episodes recently, but just go to his page, browse through his archives, pick the one you are interested in (the recent Hawkman was good, as was his one on Dr. Fate, Plastic Man was pretty entertaining) and have a listen. I think people can get all caught up with Hector and Carter and Kent and Whoever, but in my experience, the most sucessful reboots have had a good grasp on the origins, basics, and foundations of the character. A "new take" usually does not "take" unless it's firmly rooted in what made the character so great in the first place. I think Johns understands that, even though he takes the old characters in new directions. Jordain is fun to listen to - best story telling voice ever. Like sitting by a fire with hot cocoa:
http://goldenagecomics.blogspot.com/

And I think I would do this on the JLA vs. JSA thing -- go for the new series, as it's by all accounts the best so far, and then go for Morrison's JLA, as I would like to read some JLA but not much good seems to be out there. I also have not dipped into Morrison much yet. But that's just me.

AND whatever happened to the Red Ghost, the one with the monkeys when the FF first met the Watcher? Get's my vote as best Cold War era villain. Whatever happened to him? Anybody know? Everything is better with monkeys.