Battlestar Galactica full of Idiots and Hypocrisy?

[lupin]

Ok, I just started watching this show a couple days ago, and I find myself laughing about 5 times an episode because of how idiotic the characters are and the hypocrisy of the Cylons and their religious views. And, it seems thats what draws me to it. I was just wondering if the characters are suppose to be viewed that way or Im just not connecting to the people like im suppose to

[tavella]

Ok, I just started watching this show a couple days ago, and I find myself laughing about 5 times an episode because of how idiotic the characters are and the hypocrisy of the Cylons and their religious views. And, it seems thats what draws me to it. I was just wondering if the characters are suppose to be viewed that way or Im just not connecting to the people like im suppose to

BSG has quite a bit of idiot plotting, yes. Especially surrounding Baltar. It's one of the reasons I bailed out on it.

[ryudo]

I liked the show at first but quickly grew bored of it.

Then someone got me interested in firefly...now that show rocks.

And i really enjoyed the last few seasons of Stargate SG1 and Atlantis.

[masherscf]

The wacky craziness will continue. I doubt anyone one "quit watching" is qualified to judge it. TV shows are seldom at their best in the beginning.

[tokenuser]

Where you been Lupin???

Damn I've missed the "everything in the world sucks" reviews :)

Its a TV show, and unlike a 30 minute sitcom, the episodes tell an arcing storyline where the plot and the character develop over time. The Miniseries set the scene, the first 4-5 episodes of season 1 started to establish the characters ... and then the pace picks right up.

Push through the pain of the first couple of episodes. As you approach the final couple of shows in season 1, you will be hooked.

[ryudo]

I watched the first two seasons then quit.

[magunwarrior]

The first couple episodes are a bit odd, as they are for nearly every show.

Remember a little show called Heroes? I thought the first episodes of that sucked major ass, but it got really really good later on.

[lupin]

No no no. Im not saying it sucks. Im saying, it looks to me like just a buffet of todays societies problems. Distrust, poor decision making, tons of hindsight but no foresight. Im just asking, am I being too cynical or is that the point. Is the point that even with less then 50,000 humans left, we cant rally and still just exhibit our same flaws. Im saying, I laugh, because of the overall stupidity of their actions. But im asking is that what its suppose to be. A show about the depravity of us all. The fact that no matter what when or well we will always go back to our "same old shit". Im just wondering it it was written like this or its just me.

And with the Cylons, I think I see them how they are meant to be seen. On the face spewing their hypocritical religious BS, then under the surface, it all being a overdeveloped scam to get to their overlying agenda. Im not criticizing the show... yet. In fact, if the way Im seeing it ends up being how it was meant to be, Im praising the show from the highest mountain tops. I just want to know if I liked it in the same way I loved Dead Like Me:

I loved Dead Like Me because it was the epitome of everything "emo", these characters whining about their lives and jobs, while they saw tons of death and murder. Just that whole "My life is so much worse, GOSH!" attitude. And to this day I still dont know if that was the point of that show or if the writers where just truly emo.

And regardless of if Im right or wrong, I dont think Id say it sucks ass. The quality of it is top notch, just if Im wrong, it just isnt as great as I thought it would of been.

Oh, and Firefly sucks, give me a break people. I swear to god Josh Whedon must of made some deals with the Devil because it seems everyone was brain washed into thinking Buffy and Firefly are good shows, when they arent, they suck. Sure, each might of given interesting insight to the human mind, but if everything else sucks about it, it sucks. Want a great show that makes you think? Try Paranoia Agent.

[masherscf]

I watched the first two seasons then quit.

I stopped watching "Friends" at just about the beginning of the second season. I just could give a shit about Ross and Rachael. I figured that whiny bastage didn't really deserve her loveliness. I never looked back.

[magunwarrior]

Firefly sucks

I don't think we can be friends anymore.

[lupin]

I don't think we can be friends anymore.

Thats fine, I dont need anymore friends anyway, I counted you among the many anyway, not the few. :P jk

[tokenuser]

Oh, and Firefly sucks, give me a break people.If you didn't like Firefly thats your call, but if you only saw it on TV, in the order the episodes aired free to air, then you are missing out. Fox screwed the pooch when they aired Firefly.

Do yourself a favour and grab the DVD set, and watch the episodes in the order in which they were intended. DO NOT go in thinking it will be a Star Trek replacement - humanity in the Firefly universe is not that nice. Space is a new frontier, and Whedon's treatment of it as a western genre was a great call. As we reach for the stars we are going to have to fall back on pioneering construction, transportation, and lifestyle to tame the new frontiers. Firefly captured that beautifully.

BUT if you don't like it, thats too bad. You miss the glory that is:

http://images.allmoviephoto.com/2005_Serenity/2005_serenity_001.jpg

Jewel Staite (second from left) and Summer Glau (far right) ... and some other people noone really cared about anyway.

[lupin]

Blah blah blah sorry thats all I read. I have both technical issues with the show (A spaceship that can maneuver like that within an atmosphere? Sorry, my suspension of disbelief is gone) and the Genre mash up was horrible. And, I watched the pilot and it sucked. So hard. Ive said this 3 times now to 3 different people, if I see a horse and a spaceship next to each other, there better damn well be a rift in time somewhere, or a TARDIS involved.

But please, can we get back on topic. Back to this:


No no no. Im not saying it sucks. Im saying, it looks to me like just a buffet of todays societies problems. Distrust, poor decision making, tons of hindsight but no foresight. Im just asking, am I being too cynical or is that the point. Is the point that even with less then 50,000 humans left, we cant rally and still just exhibit our same flaws. Im saying, I laugh, because of the overall stupidity of their actions. But im asking is that what its suppose to be. A show about the depravity of us all. The fact that no matter what when or well we will always go back to our "same old shit". Im just wondering it it was written like this or its just me.

And with the Cylons, I think I see them how they are meant to be seen. On the face spewing their hypocritical religious BS, then under the surface, it all being a overdeveloped scam to get to their overlying agenda. Im not criticizing the show... yet. In fact, if the way Im seeing it ends up being how it was meant to be, Im praising the show from the highest mountain tops.

[magunwarrior]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v619/magunwarrior/Photo71.jpg

I'm going to go watch firefly just to spite you.

[lupin]

Ah well, I guess my question to you in the podcast thread about 1up.com being juvenile has already been answered. And please, maybe, idk stick on topic. If you want to bash me about firefly feel free to call and do so:

602 663 7573

Just, keep it out of this topic ok?

[magunwarrior]

Well technically I am a juvenile Lupin ;)

[lupin]

I guess the whole time I watch it I keep thinking about that line from The Hollow Men, by T.S. Eliot (heard it first on Doctor Who im not some literati)

This is how the world ends; not with a bang but a whimper

Cause even without an direct cylon threat, they continue to destroy themselves out of pettiness.

[ariastar]

You have to stick with BSG for several episodes. You can't just jump in somewhere and expect to understand it, nor watch just a couple episodes and think you have the entire series understood. The characters are extremely complex. They change, main characters die. The Cylons and humans do have a different belief system. For one, the people believe in several gods while the Cylons have one. This is a recurring theme, and the Cylons' beliefs are why they do what they do.

The third season started to drag at points, and had a few episodes that never should have been made (*cough*Black Market*cough*), but otherwise....

If you want to judge the entire series off of a few episodes, watch the Pegasus arc. It's heavy. Very.

[lupin]

Ive already watched Miniseries Season 1 and am on the 8th episode of Season 2. I started on Monday. I take my TV Shows by storm.

[lupin]

Never really got an answer, and dont really wont this topic to die without one.

[tokenuser]

Ive already watched Miniseries Season 1 and am on the 8th episode of Season 2. I started on Monday. I take my TV Shows by storm.Thats a lot of time invested for a show you don't seem to like.

[magunwarrior]

Quite a long time indeed, If you don't like it by now I don't think you're going to.

[lupin]

Thats a lot of time invested for a show you don't seem to like.

Jesus ****ing christ, I swear to ****ing god if this were a conversation Id swear you people where deaf. But its not, its reading, so what, blind then? Must be because this is the 3rd time I said I like the show, but Im not sure if the reason I like it is how its suppose to be viewed. How many more times do I need to say it? Im trying to figure out if Im "getting" the show, or if its like an old show thats so bad its good to me. Yet, none of you can seem to comprehend this.

/head explodes

[tokenuser]

Getting kinda defensive for a show you obviously don't like.

[lupin]

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[lupin]

You know, it'd be really nice to actually carry on a discussion about the whole reason I made this topic. But hey whatever floats yalls blind/deaf boats.

[ryudo]

Thats fine, I dont need anymore friends anyway, I counted you among the many anyway, not the few. :P jk

I never liked Buffy or Angel but Firefly accomplished more to me in 14 episodes than most shows do in a full run and no way in hell did it suck ..it was a breath of fresh air from most TV shows drab same cookie cutter crap and reminded me a lot of some anime.

[lupin]

You know, it'd be really nice to actually carry on a discussion about the whole reason I made this topic. But hey whatever floats yalls blind/deaf boats.

You know your right me. Lets do have a dialog about that.

[ryudo]

People need to learn how to seperate their taste from something that was poorly made..you Lupin are one of those people ..in fact you are the staple for that..if you don't like something (which is about everything every made seems like) you go on and on how it "sucks".

[lupin]

wtf? What the hell are you even talking about? I made one fleeting comment about it sucking which I still hold to be true, then I explained why it didnt sit well with me. I acknowledge the fact that many people seem to love it, but I think it was a poor idea. And I also think that somehow, even though it sucks, people where (I dont want to say brainwashed) but tricked into liking it. Im not saying everyone, there are of course the core who loved it from the beginning, but it seems like it was hyped up so much as this underground hit and people who attach themselves to it feel as if they are part of something special. This definitely isnt a new phenomenon, not to long ago it was old school gaming, then it was (and still sort of is) old sitcoms. Now it seems to be cult TV shows. I am drawn to them a lot of the time because typically, they are done. They have already run their course, and I enjoy watching a show back-to-back, I feel that way you get the best sense of it. Like Im doing now with BSG and have done before with Scrubs and Arrested Development and 24.

But, for the love of all things that are holy (which is nothing for me but whatever) lets get back to the topic on hand please.

[lupin]

I think I have identified one of the things that irks me if you will about the show. That is how it seamlessly moves back and forth between trying to apparently make references to our own society and then into a world that is unlike ours very Black and White. Im not sure if this is a bad thing or just a very clever tool. I think this manifest itself most notably with the Cylon that is Preggers Sharon, to me personally it seems Im confused as to rather I should be feeling sorrow and pity for her and discontentment toward those who see her as nothing more then a machine that is not human, a la Racism or distrust as most of the crew seems to be of her and all Cylons.

But, at the same time, I feel it could be said thats how the real world is. In most TV shows the story always clearly identifies the antagonist and protagonist. However, in real life, these things arent always pointed out, nor is there really a good or bad. And, it is nearly impossible to truly align yourself to someone or know their intentions, unless your personally know them. And of course we do not personally know these characters, and maybe thats what the show is trying to portray. A sort of Birds Eye View. Where as most seems have that constant monologue where everyone feels the need to say exactly what is on their minds, that is not prevalent here. Maybe Im handling this show with the proverbial "kids gloves". People have compared this show to West Wing in space, and while I feel I have watched some thought provoking shows and movies before, maybe I havent ever watched a show that not only provokes new thoughts, but does it through a story and set of characters that are more "realistic" then Im use to. Maybe, the show to me seems to be filled with Idiots and Hypocrites because I see most everyone as idiots and hypocrites. And, unlike most shows, the plots arent wrapped up nicely at the end and characters never really fix one flaw before another one is divulged and gets the "spotlight" shined on it.

[lupin]

Oh, also, with Firefly, I will say this:

The part at the end when the captain comes in from the deal and just shoots that guy as he is doing his "You shoot me she dies yatta yatta yatta" speech was great. Always, in my head, when I start to hear people saying that crap in shows I think they should always just shoot em mid-sentence and walk off. My complaints based on the pilot are still real, but maybe one day when there are no games I need to play or TV Shows for me to catch up on, I will download the entire series and watch them, so I can form a more thorough opinion/argument.

[ariastar]

wtf? What the hell are you even talking about? I made one fleeting comment about it sucking which I still hold to be true, then I explained why it didnt sit well with me. I acknowledge the fact that many people seem to love it, but I think it was a poor idea. And I also think that somehow, even though it sucks, people where (I dont want to say brainwashed) but tricked into liking it. Im not saying everyone, there are of course the core who loved it from the beginning, but it seems like it was hyped up so much as this underground hit and people who attach themselves to it feel as if they are part of something special. This definitely isnt a new phenomenon, not to long ago it was old school gaming, then it was (and still sort of is) old sitcoms. Now it seems to be cult TV shows. I am drawn to them a lot of the time because typically, they are done. They have already run their course, and I enjoy watching a show back-to-back, I feel that way you get the best sense of it. Like Im doing now with BSG and have done before with Scrubs and Arrested Development and 24.

But, for the love of all things that are holy (which is nothing for me but whatever) lets get back to the topic on hand please.

Tricked? What the hell? Hype gets people to watch a show in the first place, but can't make them like it.

[ariastar]

I think I have identified one of the things that irks me if you will about the show. That is how it seamlessly moves back and forth between trying to apparently make references to our own society and then into a world that is unlike ours very Black and White.

Some things become black and white when seen from the other guy's viewpoint, like the first episode of season 3 (the insurgents - BSG fans up to speed will know what I mean). Doesn't mean the show sucks.

[lupin]

irk = To be irritating, wearisome, or vexing to.

irk != suck

Maybe this is the communications break down, the fact that Im using words that are incorrectly defined by you guys. I think Ive made it clear about 4 or 5 times now that I like the show, Im just trying to express why I like it. To me its not enough to like or believe something, you have to be able to explain it.

Also, people can like something just because its hyped a certain way. If you think they cant then your a little naive. People have a yearning to identify themselves and thusly be included with all those who are identified in the same manner. If this show was hyped to lets say those who love the cult shows (idk what you would label that) in the right way, chances are they will pick up on it. Even if it is not a conscious decision, or a conscious realization of where they have pooled themselves. Even I succumb to this to an extent. If a show is talked about as revolutionary or breaking the mold, or a "thinkers show" I am drawn to it. This is not a bad thing at all, when it becomes a negative part of you is when/if you no longer rationale look at each "thing" on a case by case but instead just accept it as something you like because it has been classified as something within your niche.