Electing an atheist president?

[zeo]

Originally Posted by phatlip

I brought up the NY topic because it's relevant to the argument I made regarding the United States being intolerant. It was an example.

In that we disagree.

Originally Posted by phatlip

Your point?

That those who don't agree with you aren't all white, religious, fear mongers.

Originally Posted by phatlip

Ethnic group- pertaining to or characteristic of a people, esp. a group (ethnic group) sharing a common and distinctive culture, religion, language, or the like.

You're wrong.

Nope, correct, you tried to imply it as being a people. A religion is not an Ethnic group! Anyone can become a Muslim without having any common culture, common heritage, language, or race.

Originally Posted by phatlip

Also, how am I blaming victims. For once, you could you back what you say?

I did back it up, you just don't want to accept it. You're blaming Americans for the association created by the terrorists. It wasn't New Yorker's who wanted to name the Mosque Cordoba, a name associated by Muslims with conquest. It wasn't New Yorkers who made controversial statements that brought up many of these questions. It wasn't New Yorkers who refused to answer questions of funding, which brought up even more questions. It wasn't New Yorkers who want the Mosque to symbolize a victory against us.

There are lots of factors you just refuse to accept because you want to blame us for the association. It has even been pointed out that there wasn't immediate opposition to the Mosque until questionable details arose. Even now when most just want a compromise you only want to blame America. Sorry but that's all on you.

Btw, congratulations for again taking this off topic.

[tokenuser]

Originally Posted by zeo

It wasn't New Yorker's who wanted to name the Mosque Cordoba, a name associated by Muslims with conquest. It wasn't New Yorkers who made controversial statements that brought up many of these questions. It wasn't New Yorkers who refused to answer questions of funding, which brought up even more questions. It wasn't New Yorkers who want the Mosque to symbolize a victory against us.

Umm. Actually, I think they WERE New Yorkers, who happened to be Muslim. And the only people holding the Mosque up as being a symbol of Victory are the one who are opposing it.

Before returning to our regularly schedule debate on electing an atheist president ...

If Ground Zero is to be treated as sanctified ground (ie a burial ground), then why are the christians not up in arms (alms?) about rebuilding the trade centre there??

Think about it ...

Originally Posted by Matthew 21:12

And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,

Back to an atheist president ... who cares. Separation of church and state.

And please please please ditch the "one nation under God" crap.

[zeo]

Originally Posted by tokenuser

Umm. Actually, I think they WERE New Yorkers, who happened to be Muslim.

Not what I meant and you know that! The New Yorkers you're blaming for the Association aren't the ones who created it.

Originally Posted by tokenuser

And the only people holding the Mosque up as being a symbol of Victory are the one who are opposing it.

No, the terrorists are. Another example of you refusing to see any factors but what you think it should be.

Originally Posted by tokenuser

If Ground Zero is to be treated as sanctified ground (ie a burial ground), then why are the christians not up in arms (alms?) about rebuilding the trade centre there??

Because it's rebuilding what was there before and symbolizes a defiance against the terrorists.

Originally Posted by tokenuser

Think about it ...

Yes, think about it!

Originally Posted by tokenuser

Back to an atheist president ... who cares. Separation of church and state.

And please please please ditch the "one nation under God" crap.

Well, obviously you care otherwise you wouldn't be involved in this discussion. Being cynical is still holding a belief and the Topic is more just a question on whether it's possible and I think it's pretty clear that it is possible, just not easy.

[phatlip]

Originally Posted by zeo

In that we disagree.

Disagree? WTF are you talking about? There's nothing to disagree with here. It's a fact that I brought up NY to support my argument that the US is intolerant. You're being idiotic.

Originally Posted by zeo

That those who don't agree with you aren't all white, religious, fear mongers.

Never said that. Whats your point?

Originally Posted by zeo

A religion is not an Ethnic group! Anyone can become a Muslim without having any common culture, common heritage, language, or race.

Did you NOT see the definition I posted which explained a religion can be an ethnic group. Again, you're being completely idiotic. You're attempting to dispute an irrefutable fact. That's cute. FAIL.


Everyone should just ignore Zeo at this point. There's no point in discussing anything with him. Back to the atheist president.

[zeo]

Originally Posted by phatlip

Disagree? WTF are you talking about? There's nothing to disagree with here. It's a fact that I brought up NY to support my argument that the US is intolerant. You're being idiotic.

No you're being belligerent. You think all people are being intolerant but that's your opinion and not a fact.

Originally Posted by phatlip

Never said that. Whats your point?

It's part of the implication, don't pretend it isn't. You tried to lump me with everyone.

Originally Posted by phatlip

Did you NOT see the definition I posted which explained a religion can be an ethnic group. Again, you're being completely idiotic. You're attempting to dispute an irrefutable fact. That's cute. FAIL.

No, your interpretation is FAIL. My stance is to point out the mistake in your use of the term. Generically, yes, but Islam, like Christianity, doesn't all fall into the exact same interpretation for all. And ethnicity doesn't just always include one factor. Don't try to pretend your intent isn't to try to portray any and all who disagree on this issue are doing so solely based on your contention on the idea of lumping all together. You said it many times that's your conclusion and your use of ethnic clearly tries to portray all of Islam as being the same people, which they are not. You're too caught up with your own bias to discern the difference between an association of a common religion and a association linked to all people.

Just like you tried to associate all opponents with the nutty Priest who wants to burn the Qur'an. You don't realize you're imposing reverse discrimination.

The fact is the majority of Americans are not attacking the whole of Islam or associating the whole with the acts of individuals, we're dealing with individuals who have made questionable comments and choices.

This intended Mosque doesn't represent all Muslims!

Originally Posted by phatlip

Everyone should just ignore Zeo at this point. There's no point in discussing anything with him. Back to the atheist president.

You're the one bringing it up. So it's you everyone should ignore, with your hateful rhetoric and insistence on viewing America cynically.

[bobv13]

There are many people on both sides of the isle who vote on one issue, take "choice" or "gun legalization". Today there may be more people who would not vote for an atheist than who would not vote a non-christian/jew. But as far as saying Americans in general are too intolerant is BS. I ask, have you forgotten Obama? You don't need to be a weather man to know which way the wind blows.

[bobv13]

Originally Posted by phatlip

Everyone should just ignore Zeo at this point. There's no point in discussing anything with him. Back to the atheist president.

There we have it. The "All Tolerant One" has spoken. (as long as those ideas put forth fit his liberal agenda)

[phatlip]

Originally Posted by bobv13

I ask, have you forgotten Obama? You don't need to be a weather man to know which way the wind blows.

Forgot what about Obama? Forgot about the ridiculous rise in hate groups after he was elected? Stupid barometer.

Originally Posted by bobv13

There we have it. The "All Tolerant One" has spoken. (as long as those ideas put forth fit his liberal agenda)

That has absolutely nothing to do with tolerance. At all. But hey, it sounded good! Maybe you could put that on a bumper sticker. I'm sure its in line with your other political views.

[originalglitch]

Originally Posted by bobv13

There we have it. The "All Tolerant One" has spoken. (as long as those ideas put forth fit his liberal agenda)

Because as we all know, using facts and logic instead of made up sources and whining is completely a liberal thing.

[masherscf]

This will never happen. In a country where more that 50% of all elected officials will not openly admit they believe in evolution, being openly atheist is a political death sentence.