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Continuity

Saturday, December 29th, 2007 – running time 26:32
If there's one thing that comic book fans know how to do it's argue about continuity. But just what is continuity? This week, iFanboy debates the pertinent questions: Is the obsession over continuity slowly strangling comic books to death? Or is continuity what makes comics fun in the first place?

Some comic book readers are avid continuity enthusiasts, some couldn't care less about it, and many are right in the middle of the issue. iFanboy falls pretty much along that spectrum as well so they felt it was a great time for a good ol' fashioned debate.

Come along and learn, together in horror with Ron, that Batman: Year One is no longer considered canon in the DC Universe. Can the world of comic books survive being torn asunder by this issue? Hurry up and start the episode - you never know when it's going to get ret-conned out of iFanboy continuity!

Be sure to head over to our forum or ifanboy.com to discuss this episode.

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Next: Custer

Highlights
Jodie Foster ( 22:57, 22:57 ) Jessica Alba ( 2:12, 2:12 ) Richard Reid ( 2:04, 2:04 ) Middle East ( 9:21, 11:59, 9:21, 11:59 ) Jodie Foster ( 22:57, 22:57 ) Jessica Alba ( 2:12, 2:12 ) Richard Reid ( 2:04, 2:04 ) Middle East ( 9:21, 11:59, 9:21, 11:59 )

Automatically Generated Transcript(may not be 100% accurate) ( more )

" ever run. Happy years. From my boy we're are you you know here gritty and it is here is that we always do we go down. An hour ago Danny Tom brought her domain name -- coupon code IP and 10% up or this. -- That's definitely a two week free trial that's pretty great. Intercourse. You can get yours T shirts. Enters he shares act genes not. More so GoDaddy first. You're not because she does act people. Happy. The chicken and we're talking about how. Nobody."

" Hey welcome to yet another episode in my family to accomplish discussion video show. This is generated from the let's let him win dot com -- and money is wrong. I'm Josh. -- This makes him a little -- sort of talk about it in particular yeah. We're talking about college. I didn't go running at top when I talk about it could create -- I thought I'd change yeah -- we're department issue. An issue that is what -- products it's like number twelve. Yes. Continuity number twelve has problems with commitment. If you if you read comics you know cut their mean to hear congress man -- what is continuity continuity is that he. Sort of the fabric of reality. -- It was the sequence of events we'll let the dead at the fabric of reality a lot of yeah yeah it's a CB events particularly in order up to a good start. It's going to be a putt on that -- that that basically make up but the reality certain book -- you. You know Richard Reid didn't and as a real world example con well this is what's -- yeah. Our life our real possibility that the dream had a Jessica Alba but not in -- that would. And Ronald LOK and I miss this is and car confidently dollars the only lesson you have to definitely not and cuts -- it's been -- So. Some continuity in -- it's become increasingly important I feel like. The Maurer the more you read a -- of the more people are obsessing over continuity editor of importance. Once or shunning it on the -- right and I think it's the sort of I feel like this accept that because -- feel it coming. Almost two ahead because we have the public to commit to public world as the -- It's important to know they got over this total dunce caps to people who really don't really care that much people who really upset about it and there are some in the middle but this mostly just to yeah."

" Most people there in the middle -- the about the vocal people -- moment we will receive public and in and in that probably helps explain why continuity is a topic in comic turn -- where it yet because because it -- like kind of says the fabric of reality. And what -- marvel and DC you've been doing since the 50s60s. Has created these. Comic universe is comic realities marvels a lot of credit with a mostly because the the example of all of the majority here is all of the Manhattan and it's the it's one shared stories from all of the stories are happening -- yet so so what so if if Spiderman. Is fighting green -- on the Brooklyn Bridge sensibly at the same time fantastic -- arguing over who did the dishes -- Clinton and the -- building unknown what's gone either that things but that captain America is driving to his apartment in Brooklyn he might drive by Spiderman fighting green -- concern shared universe. So hot what that gets complicated is that you got that broken down into 22 page comic books come out locally and so what's happening in this comic. Might be reference or referred to in this -- and as long as they all come out in order you can follow the continuity but every element because we're human. Things have conflicts."

" I have a whole problem one of about forty years about stories but. For me there isn't just like you like -- it is a huge trailer behind it just full of stuff and it's impossibly high. Because the because I've been reading comics since the early eighties -- banquet -- every week since early ninety's. And it's -- in the last five years where I felt like. People are are are really -- over. Going crazy about conservation is an it's almost the poets talk about complications more than talk about story themselves. You know I mean it and I think that's that's bad -- habitat than because if you -- what -- so over the minutia of things. Making sense together. Then you're going so inside the book so insular in the world that you missing the point yeah -- story for the promise to tell that story that's not to make sure everything lines up and wrote the which isn't which isn't possible I thought. We have I think we've got three almost mystic capture -- very much lonely he -- he's got edited excerpts have no."

" That I needed I loved I loved that idea of -- CNN's Josh -- particularly observant and allow it and let's Carson that he who could lead. I would say you have you this story above the kind of importance and I would say we all also appreciated. No idea I definitely do all I --"

" To -- we all we have weekly and we do argue over edit and it's fun to talk about but I think yet I think we also that in the days. They doubted they'd probably not fair. I think must -- that -- about it with him."

" Yes I think that is. -- can go either way and I think the one thing I'm learning recently is that. On it depends on where you're coming from and when your reading the story. Ominous is maybe something that we can get into but I was recently reading Tom -- Treat extras right and Robinson right which stand which on their own and they were published almost ten years ago they started ten years from now. And I'm in the middle of the fifth or sixth trade and there's a reference to something else that's an event that was going on in DC. Elvis and all the people in the book lost their powers for no reason and it it's the end of this big story that been going on. And at the time I'm chairman of the -- we nailed that now what was that propels this it was like seeing Genesis one so it depends now. One recent war. We were all like visits -- doesn't make sense we're reading you know might even Jim Newman and things like that that affects higher reading announce that the premier depends and you almost to make a choice I think."

" I think that's a really good point where where is your -- focused on one title one story you're looking at the quality of the -- but if you're. Reading a line of comics like many diehard fans are often do you looking at multiple comments listened and when they do crossover some things and at a time into each other. You can do anything but the context of the."

" I don't listen to the Big Ten years god really he's not he can't read and -- and -- those --"

" So like the mid eighties at sea towards -- sudden there's a point where everybody left and went to battle worlds and then they came back. The next month. -- look at me for what you're talking about it and then. But see yours went on for a whole year and so it was kind of like they're referencing something happened in a series that had him come out yet so -- companies and entire head Koptev was like right I don't know I don't."

" About the kid I would go to the -- sort of just pick a revolution but it's been my readers take a -- enjoy it and I feel like. They probably couldn't do that amounts of -- everything's hesitate to one big events I don't know and couldn't do that didn't want to know how it all fits together why's this happening lair where."

" does it the most those CD of all comic book readers are although the ones who are left now it's again. It's like evolution isn't yet as. Weeded out of them it's casual it's funny because the things the one I remember first reading comic books. Our member for whatever reason had a paper bags full of a vendors comics from new late seventies the early eighties. And I'd love our map quest and they were in the -- members -- day. They were just I'd pick it up in the middle of the story I'm sure I didn't have a complete run and then have them but I would read it and I still like hit. Om and and the asterisk switched our it's our -- ironic but I love that then I love to be. That they'd like look at what's this is that's how I found other books back then and now. Well they didn't -- these people maybe that's because common for sixty cents that is post rebuts two whatever but like."

" Let me like there's things like marlin addresses the force of the belittle them are reading I was reading recently reading the nova essentials. And in one of the issues it it says -- looks -- 64 flies by and it's like to see -- or go to go to a ventures number you know like. It was Little League almost like a cross promotion kinda thing. And as and that idea of them you know he's facing universe but when -- time to events and I think that happens more often now because we get -- club kind of like example the marvel universe."

" From somebody looking at that universe right now the whole menus kind of thing -- just because of late this is dead ones -- like that."

" You've got might -- ventures going here again Newman is known here you've got everything else kind of happy you know cruel blow holes were -- that someone like me I want to know. Where did the sequence of events did it. Because because of me is world raw -- happening before after the all trying to battle monuments."

" But the zone covering your reading -- offenders and you. Do you need to know let's enjoy the story."

" No I don't know I'm -- knowledge you don't need to know looking good story I I've I've matured enough to his soldiers or not worry about it but when I set."

" Pack -- as a marvel zombie -- as a fan of the universe I stepped back and look okay out I have Middle East peace is on the table for some reason there's something and needed me and it could be a disorder."

" Makes me want to X sequence and so I understand the big picture on how the sort of lays out front and I think -- and time is something that is concrete like this happens from one into this happens -- two to three. On this date whenever. Now when you take an in terms of cup of of continuity when you talk of accomplishing got turned back concrete thing into something abstract and the problem is then you go back you look at it you're trying to mix -- the concrete about it. And like those it doesn't seem to fit together and it's ultimately unsatisfying. It -- but it but it happens in movies as well in Munich is safe and movies where there's a timeline of some especially movies appointment on the connected few to seriously think that US okay this pointless things is -- it exactly and that's and then it goes yeah."

" Ultimately drives you crazy the."

" The problem that is is is. Time of comics is not saying what right one issue of about -- doesn't take place of eminent power and -- not expensive places you can't experts over the course of the week."

" And that's the abstract you and you gotta wrap that around but but for me is an excellent handling I understand that slash X-Men what's Lotta substance and right now we just taken for five years to come he's going to be that we can -- it in terms of the continuity. But -- inside com what's going on now and with -- other kind of events I want to know okay. Does this happen before and after what happened is such an excellent because that influences the big picture of what the characters' motivations of what the characters are doing wrath but announcement about what I was saying earlier in terms of star man that does it really. That's the question in everything. Is -- reconstruction hardcover. Criteria and -- the recovery at all if if I'm a writer and I want to make stories that stand the test of time what if I'm on right you know Dark Knight returns -- want to write to green lantern green -- saga and I don't think I want to so -- think about what people are gonna say that we can comes out. I want people to be able to keep reading it forever and I you know what I don't want to throw them out of it and so that's making me come -- on the side of you know but to people tell the stories and continuity is good to an extent but don't let that push. What you're doing don't tell you store."

" Hi my increasingly an act of this theory while back but increasingly feel more stuff formula and that this will be but -- like -- He does you have to make -- continuity yes I think -- You can't ever economic sense you can decide for yourself what you want to believe happened where I hate. But to anyone is one -- that wrestlers ever written and it was ripped. It was taken out it was removed continuity with zero or it's no longer so much time to smell especially since -- numbers the -- yes and no longer this all but eventually Golden's gonna go back to zero well it is the Middle East right now they're trying to bring back -- things that we forgot about these of the aliens in what event that nobody likes -- about that proposal yeah. For DC enough for me for me that's still bent its first year I think you have to decide. Like the story that we're definitely."

" And it's interesting because because there's often there's office of things like there's some stories like marvel marvelous -- line now are all stories that are out of continuity. But I did -- those are correctly a morsel suffered this is -- but he's in annihilation. Going on right now because the then those stories are out of continuity and it ridiculous -- B yeah did you pick -- right is that they're taking the taking Carriker they're writing a single there was this -- part and the way to look at is that I actually compared to two TV was his movies. Where TV TV shows tend to be episodic you know you watch ER Grey's Anatomy whatever shows you watch you know my name is our options are hospital -- yeah yeah. This processor even the -- in the office of the Chicago hope and you know those tape it is those -- on. Usually every week or every couple weeks when -- on strike but out there on every week and they refer back to things happen and each each week propels the greater story follower. Whereas a movie is you've got to find a better time Mamas and the series looks are some -- got a two hours where this continuity within those two hours but it begins and --"

" Six. It into the show's content areas north prosecuted because right -- the problems in there and physically keep it all together."

" I think you could hidden in the -- PPI. Continuity continuity editor like in a movie though there are really concerned minutia it's about like what shoes they had on everywhere the hours please write anything that's what continuity in movies its comedy means in that sense when you take a camera you go from here it's over there that it looks the same and it doesn't GR the reader an. And I think that that really when you talk about. Continuity comics I think. They need to conscientiously send it doesn't jar the reader yet and all -- them that -- but I'm not worried about whether or not you know whether -- costumes Britain one panel thumbnail the panel right. And I think it's derive more probably movies -- there were and what can we kind of just me at a news conference is right -- network has had. Hand but the thing is that you've got to be able to tell a sequence of things where we're."

" A character might not know something and then they find out something in and in two other characters might be talking about my character in the knowledge of that character doesn't know what the talk but is important at that point."

" And it you putting the C if you take them into moving from the scene within they know about what's happening -- continuity also to expand on that when you talk about cotton if you got a book you got a title wears like see Spiderman three titles yet. -- letter -- had a -- next -- right and they had to -- look at what he did have four of each book keeping everything."

" Get a last look at what's going on right now is that you know. And vendors and vendors -- that is in this whole scroll invasion story line and we found out that. Possibly Buchholz is what is the squirrel was scroll we don't know how long was handled within. And in world war Hulk Hulk kicks flexible class and when that came out you didn't really understand why. Because what will -- be more powerful men hold the ball -- and then we find that he was -- that's probably why does SKF but we don't know that because I don't really know -- in the continuity and you know like I. How does how does that story includes illustrate a copy it from me but because I think -- it was a scroll -- that haven't really didn't do a little crazy but that's the thing and that anybody doubts as to whether or join the single story or your -- need the deep -- pull back 10000 foot view of the collection of success."

" The other thing that's happening now that I don't think happened in standing next time is that there's there's events now we're all the books have to push towards a point where they'll have to meet the same place they've started completely different disparate places and have people doing it through completely different method but. When it comes a point -- civil wars but start you ball going to be here yeah that's that's rough on a writer."

" Here's -- the summit politician. -- Internet. Library. Yeah I blame you there. Major fall I love and -- actually -- because now you've got his where we're just we're fueling the kind of thrown out on the not a place now where you can dissect it yet -- the -- you the letter I don't atop the -- dog don't discount the letter pages meant a lot in the sixties and the people argue over that all the time at all like what. Nothing in the Internet is that letters pages times 100 times ultimately in the -- I think you need a model it choose -- they put their label and a -- when it looks like. Only they were very frank about what true but it didn't get to choose good -- read a put. That box I don't go to Internet and accepted. And I think it's bad thing that's packets now since your comical but elegant in Britain the and it's that he definitely look at go back that he -- he do that yet and that's what did you do -- therefore. You can focus a little."

" Loss. On TV. That is sort of been successful without the Internet. A really good question I had let the lawsuit -- Lavinia but I still think people will be talking about because that's pleasant time discipline that's where things in the continuity and all of a sudden has lost is is pretty much accomplished on TV. If you look at the with a story structures are suffering that felonies and the thing is the right and I think the Internet if you look at the -- losses this -- because there people who on their argue over once the pack in the."

" Like I think -- come out now don't all get this did you would have I you know all the hugs me and my friends who watch that's all ought to talk to about now I can't. But you think it would blame the Internet do you think they're making enough private play with fat fingered the Internet is fueling the consequences of a minute of the traders reacting to do reactions on some tuna products Marlins down and I thought if -- vomit comet crater where tomorrow I don't read message -- that's what -- what about the DC. Event in the early nineties and got leaked to the Millen wants Armitage who doesn't want there. -- change that was pre Internet those free Internet and so I mean Ed and I. It is that makes it easier to to dissect constitute -- battles I said before we we all like to do that Smith. It's just a -- I don't mean it's why you worry you word the because I've. It is getting worse people spend more time talking about what what does make sense -- supposed to -- and enjoy the top -- it'll. What is it what's more important is more important economic -- DC just did. They want it took all their -- world stuff that disparate things that weren't in a continuity and they when he tied in into one big continuity now ask her career high. I would think that to themselves I mean like they want everything to be -- I don't think it really aren't there's -- doing -- and and and they and they take all right now. And that the deal yeah I don't know that I've stared down Philadelphia again and -- voice but. Rodham appoint its review just become more about it at the end the final crisis like -- shuts down once we're done. It was finally -- and it's over a really woods is that it and it just -- movies a one point run this has become more important to freeze. Do you really weird the look both -- warm court that it makes all of access roads porcelain that's good story. Well I think -- I think it's tough for me because I'm in a position where I need to get over my my desire you relish that idea but I not a good thing is to me. It is I would give it may be. A third of my time. A third of my times that wondering how these amazing you can come up the number. -- And the other remaining teeth -- you know another third is enjoying the story -- third asleep in. -- if you do these days nightmare creators and then to say you know it's hard to deal with a hamstring of continuity -- settled -- the until the -- what's the all right Carol what. -- excellent book the last two years. Unless -- is an assignment and."

" How it's apples and got no continuity whatsoever that it can no no we're going to know almost -- at almost almost none of its seats but I can see where it stitched into the excellent continent it is technically before yes exactly that -- decided that."

" It doesn't concern itself with that was half. Happen is that what what what who I who -- things that what the events that happened and it's not since then and only three years have no ramifications in new maximum number 24 and X factor number twelve and."

" are currently right now the thing is this is something that the prestige creator. Is brought. And now when you have job Sweden they say to him. To write a book yet and do what you want and we'll make your own rules will sorted out later. Which you know for me ultimately is going to land you better stories that are going to stand the test of time longer that you can. Used to get more people and you know they want -- thing is they want to you're gonna hate him they wanna they wanted to make trade paperbacks and stories that extent of their own that they can use -- to give to people around does that happen. But the same time that I -- but that's been in particular -- and often get beat up for their continuity for their -- because he's crazy but could. I did eat I eat enough rest food and I loved it's like Riley because I go to -- yeah. But how did the books well Emily looks have been as good I don't but I don't blame continuity for that I would sort of people you put some possible for years but this summertime the affected by the six of the continental but I. As in more recently we're coming upon and an -- assaults is insane and I believe that the the the Peter -- an X factor in Brubaker an uncanny. Are doing it in a way that it's Rebecca out of here very mediocre and I disagree I thought it was good. Now Peter David book is not operate does seem to be tied -- it is decided that since he's he's -- written well yeah it's from a one of her I don't need to consider it. It is that you can use continuity to overshadow. -- You hit a critical notable because of bad done that while the country's original and heads or tails of it you're just not good you know like maybe you knew the this -- it's three -- photographers maybe they're just minister soundly restaurants you've got stuck and they do things in our country routed through well well did this other thing just well. -- Who does not -- Peter Davies asserted today that I think Geoff -- those -- Johns is like Johnson he's less of bonds of could of continuity mark way to think does them. You know like mark where it's almost too good yes I got. Mark wait mark -- could be sick or two guys who to meet. They're too tight end to what happened before and I don't want that he's eligible -- Jeff Johnson and -- said that this -- a certain -- to -- and it in this current sense of both. Writing modern stories that you -- different sort of standpoint and -- scratching my -- and -- actually also I didn't -- Brubaker. His books are very historically tied in a way it actually so far back that we didn't remember way to forget that those daredevil the daredevil happier captain America this guy and have -- SO YYU. We're -- of the continuity they're not comment there. -- counter to a McConnell there has -- sub class -- And concentration. I was. The final alone Vito and -- I think I think this is the."

" I think he's that he should."

" I'm not gotten more from -- people all over the podium at citizens that ultimately people to forget or things of this can just take it to suddenly -- I've learned to chill -- program as -- that the -- from the from the convention panel who was like mad about the -- Oliver -- Yes I mean like there's that kind of fan base this where there."

" But the thing is they're going to be crazy about something else but in in phantom is a weird thing Jodie Foster letter -- he's gotten the."

" Eight people are gonna freak out more."

" You focus your lands and you tightly focused and the horrors of people to come into is complete. I think as your collect."

" Think you know -- I think he's what he's saying is in order to grow the fan base that though the readership of comic books you've got to get away from -- a little bit or at least make it at a crumble. Yeah if you keep if you keep your guys freaked out over the stuff you're never gonna duplicated other -- I I do I do your that I don't think the publisher she should cap had to go to the crazies on the Internet of which we are of you know like. Via the reactionary the reaction is never good when Vietnam be strategic he wanted to note that and I and again I think Geoff Johns Bennis do that well Venice is just like. We've heard among word balloon and in your -- is about that or he just like. Come down it's going to be okay like wait a year well some sort of also react before they maybe should have because that we're getting we're getting like -- story. Yet when what here's we'll start with four months -- sick we've digital story unfortunately I. I'd like that too. I'd like -- delay a lightning can be part of it this far and I think you're good at separating. This case it really it is all like yes. It's huge you enjoy the -- don't. Italy and you also want to be able to feel like I mean this actually comes from you want to feel like you know more than a creator. That's totally where it comes from they totally got that wrong that's not how is costumes in be and yet."

" I don't want to my heart's in my defense I've never bin like that I've never -- like -- that that how she the other right as opposed the left in the period ahead it. Some of those people might get on the but nobody more about -- how this fits in in the fabric of time when did you know like. At least playing time travel -- that -- that becomes a natural kind of thing like when okay so. You know Steve Rogers in the invaders are coming back from the forties the -- now. That happens after Steve Rogers died -- captain America play five and so like how. How you know because that affects the mood of the universe if you're just want to tell that story you're right it's a tricky tricky thing he just want prick that graphic novel oil trade paperback. And have these -- standing on your own. You can do that but I do you think you can do within the congress and huge universe not to open -- the continuity I believe it's possible. Someone and I think that the X-Men argument with continuity -- that is is just across the people use the -- bad quality. That's I think it's predict clause that it is not think I disagree I think bankers because they're quality."

" Now movies had no continuity may -- a lot more than the book submitted along. We'll have continuity to is that the last of the book that made a lot of movies it's the -- aliases is the topic you can go on about. For forget helper the especially when you have people on dime metric sides of the argument that they lie anyway so if you want to send in your own. Buckling female about this yeah. Fact that -- dot com. -- be competitive local Intel lapses and our continuity he calls -- 180 Campbell is a world where certain -- if -- street exit -- seven you tell us what we -- wrong."

" You that I am what I coveted -- of the show you go there general just talk about continuity. Because we do enjoy it and also -- at -- both forums there and there's lots. Of constituted chocolate on there."

" It's and the thing is coming into this fund and."

" We all important thing -- Superman's got a national continuity tune these fox."

" The big battle."

" ever run. Happy years. From my boy we're are you you know here gritty and it is here is that we always do we go down. An hour ago Danny Tom brought her domain name -- coupon code IP and 10% up or this. -- That's definitely a two week free trial that's pretty great. Intercourse. You can get yours T shirts. Enters he shares act genes not. More so GoDaddy first. You're not because she does act people. Happy. The chicken and we're talking about how. Nobody."

" Hey welcome to yet another episode in my family to accomplish discussion video show. This is generated from the let's let him win dot com -- and money is wrong. I'm Josh. -- This makes him a little -- sort of talk about it in particular yeah. We're talking about college. I didn't go running at top when I talk about it could create -- I thought I'd change yeah -- we're department issue. An issue that is what -- products it's like number twelve. Yes. Continuity number twelve has problems with commitment. If you if you read comics you know cut their mean to hear congress man -- what is continuity continuity is that he. Sort of the fabric of reality. -- It was the sequence of events we'll let the dead at the fabric of reality a lot of yeah yeah it's a CB events particularly in order up to a good start. It's going to be a putt on that -- that that basically make up but the reality certain book -- you. You know Richard Reid didn't and as a real world example con well this is what's -- yeah. Our life our real possibility that the dream had a Jessica Alba but not in -- that would. And Ronald LOK and I miss this is and car confidently dollars the only lesson you have to definitely not and cuts -- it's been -- So. Some continuity in -- it's become increasingly important I feel like. The Maurer the more you read a -- of the more people are obsessing over continuity editor of importance. Once or shunning it on the -- right and I think it's the sort of I feel like this accept that because -- feel it coming. Almost two ahead because we have the public to commit to public world as the -- It's important to know they got over this total dunce caps to people who really don't really care that much people who really upset about it and there are some in the middle but this mostly just to yeah."

" Most people there in the middle -- the about the vocal people -- moment we will receive public and in and in that probably helps explain why continuity is a topic in comic turn -- where it yet because because it -- like kind of says the fabric of reality. And what -- marvel and DC you've been doing since the 50s60s. Has created these. Comic universe is comic realities marvels a lot of credit with a mostly because the the example of all of the majority here is all of the Manhattan and it's the it's one shared stories from all of the stories are happening -- yet so so what so if if Spiderman. Is fighting green -- on the Brooklyn Bridge sensibly at the same time fantastic -- arguing over who did the dishes -- Clinton and the -- building unknown what's gone either that things but that captain America is driving to his apartment in Brooklyn he might drive by Spiderman fighting green -- concern shared universe. So hot what that gets complicated is that you got that broken down into 22 page comic books come out locally and so what's happening in this comic. Might be reference or referred to in this -- and as long as they all come out in order you can follow the continuity but every element because we're human. Things have conflicts."

" I have a whole problem one of about forty years about stories but. For me there isn't just like you like -- it is a huge trailer behind it just full of stuff and it's impossibly high. Because the because I've been reading comics since the early eighties -- banquet -- every week since early ninety's. And it's -- in the last five years where I felt like. People are are are really -- over. Going crazy about conservation is an it's almost the poets talk about complications more than talk about story themselves. You know I mean it and I think that's that's bad -- habitat than because if you -- what -- so over the minutia of things. Making sense together. Then you're going so inside the book so insular in the world that you missing the point yeah -- story for the promise to tell that story that's not to make sure everything lines up and wrote the which isn't which isn't possible I thought. We have I think we've got three almost mystic capture -- very much lonely he -- he's got edited excerpts have no."

" That I needed I loved I loved that idea of -- CNN's Josh -- particularly observant and allow it and let's Carson that he who could lead. I would say you have you this story above the kind of importance and I would say we all also appreciated. No idea I definitely do all I --"

" To -- we all we have weekly and we do argue over edit and it's fun to talk about but I think yet I think we also that in the days. They doubted they'd probably not fair. I think must -- that -- about it with him."

" Yes I think that is. -- can go either way and I think the one thing I'm learning recently is that. On it depends on where you're coming from and when your reading the story. Ominous is maybe something that we can get into but I was recently reading Tom -- Treat extras right and Robinson right which stand which on their own and they were published almost ten years ago they started ten years from now. And I'm in the middle of the fifth or sixth trade and there's a reference to something else that's an event that was going on in DC. Elvis and all the people in the book lost their powers for no reason and it it's the end of this big story that been going on. And at the time I'm chairman of the -- we nailed that now what was that propels this it was like seeing Genesis one so it depends now. One recent war. We were all like visits -- doesn't make sense we're reading you know might even Jim Newman and things like that that affects higher reading announce that the premier depends and you almost to make a choice I think."

" I think that's a really good point where where is your -- focused on one title one story you're looking at the quality of the -- but if you're. Reading a line of comics like many diehard fans are often do you looking at multiple comments listened and when they do crossover some things and at a time into each other. You can do anything but the context of the."

" I don't listen to the Big Ten years god really he's not he can't read and -- and -- those --"

" So like the mid eighties at sea towards -- sudden there's a point where everybody left and went to battle worlds and then they came back. The next month. -- look at me for what you're talking about it and then. But see yours went on for a whole year and so it was kind of like they're referencing something happened in a series that had him come out yet so -- companies and entire head Koptev was like right I don't know I don't."

" About the kid I would go to the -- sort of just pick a revolution but it's been my readers take a -- enjoy it and I feel like. They probably couldn't do that amounts of -- everything's hesitate to one big events I don't know and couldn't do that didn't want to know how it all fits together why's this happening lair where."

" does it the most those CD of all comic book readers are although the ones who are left now it's again. It's like evolution isn't yet as. Weeded out of them it's casual it's funny because the things the one I remember first reading comic books. Our member for whatever reason had a paper bags full of a vendors comics from new late seventies the early eighties. And I'd love our map quest and they were in the -- members -- day. They were just I'd pick it up in the middle of the story I'm sure I didn't have a complete run and then have them but I would read it and I still like hit. Om and and the asterisk switched our it's our -- ironic but I love that then I love to be. That they'd like look at what's this is that's how I found other books back then and now. Well they didn't -- these people maybe that's because common for sixty cents that is post rebuts two whatever but like."

" Let me like there's things like marlin addresses the force of the belittle them are reading I was reading recently reading the nova essentials. And in one of the issues it it says -- looks -- 64 flies by and it's like to see -- or go to go to a ventures number you know like. It was Little League almost like a cross promotion kinda thing. And as and that idea of them you know he's facing universe but when -- time to events and I think that happens more often now because we get -- club kind of like example the marvel universe."

" From somebody looking at that universe right now the whole menus kind of thing -- just because of late this is dead ones -- like that."

" You've got might -- ventures going here again Newman is known here you've got everything else kind of happy you know cruel blow holes were -- that someone like me I want to know. Where did the sequence of events did it. Because because of me is world raw -- happening before after the all trying to battle monuments."

" But the zone covering your reading -- offenders and you. Do you need to know let's enjoy the story."

" No I don't know I'm -- knowledge you don't need to know looking good story I I've I've matured enough to his soldiers or not worry about it but when I set."

" Pack -- as a marvel zombie -- as a fan of the universe I stepped back and look okay out I have Middle East peace is on the table for some reason there's something and needed me and it could be a disorder."

" Makes me want to X sequence and so I understand the big picture on how the sort of lays out front and I think -- and time is something that is concrete like this happens from one into this happens -- two to three. On this date whenever. Now when you take an in terms of cup of of continuity when you talk of accomplishing got turned back concrete thing into something abstract and the problem is then you go back you look at it you're trying to mix -- the concrete about it. And like those it doesn't seem to fit together and it's ultimately unsatisfying. It -- but it but it happens in movies as well in Munich is safe and movies where there's a timeline of some especially movies appointment on the connected few to seriously think that US okay this pointless things is -- it exactly and that's and then it goes yeah."

" Ultimately drives you crazy the."

" The problem that is is is. Time of comics is not saying what right one issue of about -- doesn't take place of eminent power and -- not expensive places you can't experts over the course of the week."

" And that's the abstract you and you gotta wrap that around but but for me is an excellent handling I understand that slash X-Men what's Lotta substance and right now we just taken for five years to come he's going to be that we can -- it in terms of the continuity. But -- inside com what's going on now and with -- other kind of events I want to know okay. Does this happen before and after what happened is such an excellent because that influences the big picture of what the characters' motivations of what the characters are doing wrath but announcement about what I was saying earlier in terms of star man that does it really. That's the question in everything. Is -- reconstruction hardcover. Criteria and -- the recovery at all if if I'm a writer and I want to make stories that stand the test of time what if I'm on right you know Dark Knight returns -- want to write to green lantern green -- saga and I don't think I want to so -- think about what people are gonna say that we can comes out. I want people to be able to keep reading it forever and I you know what I don't want to throw them out of it and so that's making me come -- on the side of you know but to people tell the stories and continuity is good to an extent but don't let that push. What you're doing don't tell you store."

" Hi my increasingly an act of this theory while back but increasingly feel more stuff formula and that this will be but -- like -- He does you have to make -- continuity yes I think -- You can't ever economic sense you can decide for yourself what you want to believe happened where I hate. But to anyone is one -- that wrestlers ever written and it was ripped. It was taken out it was removed continuity with zero or it's no longer so much time to smell especially since -- numbers the -- yes and no longer this all but eventually Golden's gonna go back to zero well it is the Middle East right now they're trying to bring back -- things that we forgot about these of the aliens in what event that nobody likes -- about that proposal yeah. For DC enough for me for me that's still bent its first year I think you have to decide. Like the story that we're definitely."

" And it's interesting because because there's often there's office of things like there's some stories like marvel marvelous -- line now are all stories that are out of continuity. But I did -- those are correctly a morsel suffered this is -- but he's in annihilation. Going on right now because the then those stories are out of continuity and it ridiculous -- B yeah did you pick -- right is that they're taking the taking Carriker they're writing a single there was this -- part and the way to look at is that I actually compared to two TV was his movies. Where TV TV shows tend to be episodic you know you watch ER Grey's Anatomy whatever shows you watch you know my name is our options are hospital -- yeah yeah. This processor even the -- in the office of the Chicago hope and you know those tape it is those -- on. Usually every week or every couple weeks when -- on strike but out there on every week and they refer back to things happen and each each week propels the greater story follower. Whereas a movie is you've got to find a better time Mamas and the series looks are some -- got a two hours where this continuity within those two hours but it begins and --"

" Six. It into the show's content areas north prosecuted because right -- the problems in there and physically keep it all together."

" I think you could hidden in the -- PPI. Continuity continuity editor like in a movie though there are really concerned minutia it's about like what shoes they had on everywhere the hours please write anything that's what continuity in movies its comedy means in that sense when you take a camera you go from here it's over there that it looks the same and it doesn't GR the reader an. And I think that that really when you talk about. Continuity comics I think. They need to conscientiously send it doesn't jar the reader yet and all -- them that -- but I'm not worried about whether or not you know whether -- costumes Britain one panel thumbnail the panel right. And I think it's derive more probably movies -- there were and what can we kind of just me at a news conference is right -- network has had. Hand but the thing is that you've got to be able to tell a sequence of things where we're."

" A character might not know something and then they find out something in and in two other characters might be talking about my character in the knowledge of that character doesn't know what the talk but is important at that point."

" And it you putting the C if you take them into moving from the scene within they know about what's happening -- continuity also to expand on that when you talk about cotton if you got a book you got a title wears like see Spiderman three titles yet. -- letter -- had a -- next -- right and they had to -- look at what he did have four of each book keeping everything."

" Get a last look at what's going on right now is that you know. And vendors and vendors -- that is in this whole scroll invasion story line and we found out that. Possibly Buchholz is what is the squirrel was scroll we don't know how long was handled within. And in world war Hulk Hulk kicks flexible class and when that came out you didn't really understand why. Because what will -- be more powerful men hold the ball -- and then we find that he was -- that's probably why does SKF but we don't know that because I don't really know -- in the continuity and you know like I. How does how does that story includes illustrate a copy it from me but because I think -- it was a scroll -- that haven't really didn't do a little crazy but that's the thing and that anybody doubts as to whether or join the single story or your -- need the deep -- pull back 10000 foot view of the collection of success."

" The other thing that's happening now that I don't think happened in standing next time is that there's there's events now we're all the books have to push towards a point where they'll have to meet the same place they've started completely different disparate places and have people doing it through completely different method but. When it comes a point -- civil wars but start you ball going to be here yeah that's that's rough on a writer."

" Here's -- the summit politician. -- Internet. Library. Yeah I blame you there. Major fall I love and -- actually -- because now you've got his where we're just we're fueling the kind of thrown out on the not a place now where you can dissect it yet -- the -- you the letter I don't atop the -- dog don't discount the letter pages meant a lot in the sixties and the people argue over that all the time at all like what. Nothing in the Internet is that letters pages times 100 times ultimately in the -- I think you need a model it choose -- they put their label and a -- when it looks like. Only they were very frank about what true but it didn't get to choose good -- read a put. That box I don't go to Internet and accepted. And I think it's bad thing that's packets now since your comical but elegant in Britain the and it's that he definitely look at go back that he -- he do that yet and that's what did you do -- therefore. You can focus a little."

" Loss. On TV. That is sort of been successful without the Internet. A really good question I had let the lawsuit -- Lavinia but I still think people will be talking about because that's pleasant time discipline that's where things in the continuity and all of a sudden has lost is is pretty much accomplished on TV. If you look at the with a story structures are suffering that felonies and the thing is the right and I think the Internet if you look at the -- losses this -- because there people who on their argue over once the pack in the."

" Like I think -- come out now don't all get this did you would have I you know all the hugs me and my friends who watch that's all ought to talk to about now I can't. But you think it would blame the Internet do you think they're making enough private play with fat fingered the Internet is fueling the consequences of a minute of the traders reacting to do reactions on some tuna products Marlins down and I thought if -- vomit comet crater where tomorrow I don't read message -- that's what -- what about the DC. Event in the early nineties and got leaked to the Millen wants Armitage who doesn't want there. -- change that was pre Internet those free Internet and so I mean Ed and I. It is that makes it easier to to dissect constitute -- battles I said before we we all like to do that Smith. It's just a -- I don't mean it's why you worry you word the because I've. It is getting worse people spend more time talking about what what does make sense -- supposed to -- and enjoy the top -- it'll. What is it what's more important is more important economic -- DC just did. They want it took all their -- world stuff that disparate things that weren't in a continuity and they when he tied in into one big continuity now ask her career high. I would think that to themselves I mean like they want everything to be -- I don't think it really aren't there's -- doing -- and and and they and they take all right now. And that the deal yeah I don't know that I've stared down Philadelphia again and -- voice but. Rodham appoint its review just become more about it at the end the final crisis like -- shuts down once we're done. It was finally -- and it's over a really woods is that it and it just -- movies a one point run this has become more important to freeze. Do you really weird the look both -- warm court that it makes all of access roads porcelain that's good story. Well I think -- I think it's tough for me because I'm in a position where I need to get over my my desire you relish that idea but I not a good thing is to me. It is I would give it may be. A third of my time. A third of my times that wondering how these amazing you can come up the number. -- And the other remaining teeth -- you know another third is enjoying the story -- third asleep in. -- if you do these days nightmare creators and then to say you know it's hard to deal with a hamstring of continuity -- settled -- the until the -- what's the all right Carol what. -- excellent book the last two years. Unless -- is an assignment and."

" How it's apples and got no continuity whatsoever that it can no no we're going to know almost -- at almost almost none of its seats but I can see where it stitched into the excellent continent it is technically before yes exactly that -- decided that."

" It doesn't concern itself with that was half. Happen is that what what what who I who -- things that what the events that happened and it's not since then and only three years have no ramifications in new maximum number 24 and X factor number twelve and."

" are currently right now the thing is this is something that the prestige creator. Is brought. And now when you have job Sweden they say to him. To write a book yet and do what you want and we'll make your own rules will sorted out later. Which you know for me ultimately is going to land you better stories that are going to stand the test of time longer that you can. Used to get more people and you know they want -- thing is they want to you're gonna hate him they wanna they wanted to make trade paperbacks and stories that extent of their own that they can use -- to give to people around does that happen. But the same time that I -- but that's been in particular -- and often get beat up for their continuity for their -- because he's crazy but could. I did eat I eat enough rest food and I loved it's like Riley because I go to -- yeah. But how did the books well Emily looks have been as good I don't but I don't blame continuity for that I would sort of people you put some possible for years but this summertime the affected by the six of the continental but I. As in more recently we're coming upon and an -- assaults is insane and I believe that the the the Peter -- an X factor in Brubaker an uncanny. Are doing it in a way that it's Rebecca out of here very mediocre and I disagree I thought it was good. Now Peter David book is not operate does seem to be tied -- it is decided that since he's he's -- written well yeah it's from a one of her I don't need to consider it. It is that you can use continuity to overshadow. -- You hit a critical notable because of bad done that while the country's original and heads or tails of it you're just not good you know like maybe you knew the this -- it's three -- photographers maybe they're just minister soundly restaurants you've got stuck and they do things in our country routed through well well did this other thing just well. -- Who does not -- Peter Davies asserted today that I think Geoff -- those -- Johns is like Johnson he's less of bonds of could of continuity mark way to think does them. You know like mark where it's almost too good yes I got. Mark wait mark -- could be sick or two guys who to meet. They're too tight end to what happened before and I don't want that he's eligible -- Jeff Johnson and -- said that this -- a certain -- to -- and it in this current sense of both. Writing modern stories that you -- different sort of standpoint and -- scratching my -- and -- actually also I didn't -- Brubaker. His books are very historically tied in a way it actually so far back that we didn't remember way to forget that those daredevil the daredevil happier captain America this guy and have -- SO YYU. We're -- of the continuity they're not comment there. -- counter to a McConnell there has -- sub class -- And concentration. I was. The final alone Vito and -- I think I think this is the."

" I think he's that he should."

" I'm not gotten more from -- people all over the podium at citizens that ultimately people to forget or things of this can just take it to suddenly -- I've learned to chill -- program as -- that the -- from the from the convention panel who was like mad about the -- Oliver -- Yes I mean like there's that kind of fan base this where there."

" But the thing is they're going to be crazy about something else but in in phantom is a weird thing Jodie Foster letter -- he's gotten the."

" Eight people are gonna freak out more."

" You focus your lands and you tightly focused and the horrors of people to come into is complete. I think as your collect."

" Think you know -- I think he's what he's saying is in order to grow the fan base that though the readership of comic books you've got to get away from -- a little bit or at least make it at a crumble. Yeah if you keep if you keep your guys freaked out over the stuff you're never gonna duplicated other -- I I do I do your that I don't think the publisher she should cap had to go to the crazies on the Internet of which we are of you know like. Via the reactionary the reaction is never good when Vietnam be strategic he wanted to note that and I and again I think Geoff Johns Bennis do that well Venice is just like. We've heard among word balloon and in your -- is about that or he just like. Come down it's going to be okay like wait a year well some sort of also react before they maybe should have because that we're getting we're getting like -- story. Yet when what here's we'll start with four months -- sick we've digital story unfortunately I. I'd like that too. I'd like -- delay a lightning can be part of it this far and I think you're good at separating. This case it really it is all like yes. It's huge you enjoy the -- don't. Italy and you also want to be able to feel like I mean this actually comes from you want to feel like you know more than a creator. That's totally where it comes from they totally got that wrong that's not how is costumes in be and yet."

" I don't want to my heart's in my defense I've never bin like that I've never -- like -- that that how she the other right as opposed the left in the period ahead it. Some of those people might get on the but nobody more about -- how this fits in in the fabric of time when did you know like. At least playing time travel -- that -- that becomes a natural kind of thing like when okay so. You know Steve Rogers in the invaders are coming back from the forties the -- now. That happens after Steve Rogers died -- captain America play five and so like how. How you know because that affects the mood of the universe if you're just want to tell that story you're right it's a tricky tricky thing he just want prick that graphic novel oil trade paperback. And have these -- standing on your own. You can do that but I do you think you can do within the congress and huge universe not to open -- the continuity I believe it's possible. Someone and I think that the X-Men argument with continuity -- that is is just across the people use the -- bad quality. That's I think it's predict clause that it is not think I disagree I think bankers because they're quality."

" Now movies had no continuity may -- a lot more than the book submitted along. We'll have continuity to is that the last of the book that made a lot of movies it's the -- aliases is the topic you can go on about. For forget helper the especially when you have people on dime metric sides of the argument that they lie anyway so if you want to send in your own. Buckling female about this yeah. Fact that -- dot com. -- be competitive local Intel lapses and our continuity he calls -- 180 Campbell is a world where certain -- if -- street exit -- seven you tell us what we -- wrong."

" You that I am what I coveted -- of the show you go there general just talk about continuity. Because we do enjoy it and also -- at -- both forums there and there's lots. Of constituted chocolate on there."

" It's and the thing is coming into this fund and."

" We all important thing -- Superman's got a national continuity tune these fox."

" The big battle."

JAFlanagan

Started discussion: December 29, 2007 @ 11:13am GMT

Episode #50 - "Continuity"



Running Time: 00:26:32

If there's one thing that comic book fans know how to do it's argue about continuity. But just what is continuity? This week, iFanboy debates the pertinent questions: Is the obsession over continuity slowly strangling comic books to death? Or is continuity what makes comics fun in the first place?

Click here for download info and show notes!

Six Gun
about 1 year ago
this ought to be a great show
paper
about 1 year ago
I wouldn't even know where to start on a discussion like this. Looking forward to checking it out!
Tad
about 1 year ago
Conor, could you please adjust the order of these posts? Six Gun and paper are stating that they are looking FORWARD to the episode yet clearly Josh's post establishes that the episode has already been posted.

I also hope that this thread is allowed to flourish on its own and not crossover with the damn Brand New Day Spiderman thread. That will lead to a merged thread which will mean people have to scroll back to the beginning if they're to have any sense of order. Besides, I give it a month tops before the Spidey thread will reboot under another topic.
Luthor
about 1 year ago
In reply to Tad:
That will lead to a merged thread which will mean people have to scroll back to the beginning if they're to have any sense of order.


No worries of that happening. Connor will just retcon it out of existence.


Great show guys. Continuity discussion could be confusing and you guys nailed the issues involved, both pro and con, very well.
s1lentslayer
about 1 year ago
Speaking of continuity, can someone explain to me the differences in the multiple Spider-Man and X-Men books? Are they all happening at the same time?
itsbecca
about 1 year ago
I had to literally just pause for a full minute so I could get over laughing at the intro sight gag without missing the rest of the podcast. Brilliant.
itsbecca
about 1 year ago
Okiiiie done. My two cents. First, I loooove this kind of show, by the way. It's absolutely fascinating and fills that little hole in my life where I wish friends who I could talk to about comics were. But as to the topic at hand.

Little known fact (unless you have a good memory, because I have mentioned it), until about a year ago the only comics I read were trades and graphic novels. Lot of indie books, lot of self contained stories, and maybe the biggest example of me "following" a title was American Splendor. I'd clean out the area libraries and mill around book stores, so that kind of selection. I can remember different times of my life venturing into the comic book store and having no idea what to do, so I'd just browse and leave. That's kind of a whole other issue all together, but it's related in the fact that with the way a lot of stores are run a new reader is already feeling overwhelmed. So publishers are already at a disadvantage.

Long story short I eventually kicked my ass in there and picked up an issue of Detective Comics. I devoured the animated series since I was young, so I looked at the selection in his little area... pretty cover. Lets get that one. It was great. One and done. I knew the characters, it flooded me with happy nostalgic feelings and I was set to go back for more.

Other series that got me up on Saturday mornings? X-men. So next visit I go over to the X's. Uhhhhh.... slightly more difficult choice. I eventually picked up Ultimate X-men, New X-men and Astonishing X-men. That was a "This is alright"... a "who the hell are these people?"... and a "what is going on? why does he look that? who the hell is that? WHERE ARE THEY?"

Now that time has passed and homework has been done I buy 6-10 books a week. An alarming amount are in the Batman family and you know how many X-men books? One. I love those characters and I tried, but it just came to a point where I stopped caring. X-men is a project for me some day when I'm bored and have a little to much cash falling out of my pockets.

So that's where the head of a new reader is at continuity wise. That said, I think I agree with Ron. I don't think new readers need to be coddled, but there's are books I can step into on a new arc and get a feel for the characters and put the background of the story together as I go along. It doesn't have to be all one-shots; each story doesn't have to be entirely self-contained. It just has to be good, engaging writing and well crafted character development. Make me care and then we'll work out the rest later. I think it is hugely, if not solely, dependent on the creators.
Six Gun
about 1 year ago
In reply to Tad:
Conor, could you please adjust the order of these posts? Six Gun and paper are stating that they are looking FORWARD to the episode yet clearly Josh's post establishes that the episode has already been posted.


It had been posted but we're just expressing our excitement for the shows as they download.
rrichards
about 1 year ago
In reply to Six Gun:
It had been posted but we're just expressing our excitement for the shows as they download.


Aww Six Gun....
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