" No. Episodes of system has brought didn't -- godaddy.com. In music and Netflix. That is easy to share stands for -- right when -- an album the other is on the show their static they don't change. But how do you display so biggest campaign. Hang on a wall or put on a pedestal or something changes over time -- the architecture and city and graffiti on the walls of that city. Better yet how do you make it available online for anyone to explore. We're gonna show you how to -- an interactive online archaeological harkat on today's episode of system. -- give -- are taking street level photos for Google maps a lot of folks commented on acted as an is that digital archives cities communities and neighborhoods. -- would be able to go back and -- street store signs in the city itself changed over time at least if somebody archive older images. But you don't -- resources and does million dollar company like Google to create a digital archive places buildings and streets. Today's guest is create an extraordinary site recording the life graffiti on the walls New York City Los Angeles. And -- very -- San Francisco and easier to give us a behind the scenes look at how he pulled it all together."

" Well the -- So are we are really your last name out of this is just like your secret identity gonna just check and click that it. So you actually. You you have a graffiti archaeology project yes this is like the least maybe not the least but probably on the list of permanent artsy enemy which it -- an animal stuff for the -- like a bunch of food in a box and sealed it -- the Guggenheim people I mean this stuff beneath it comes goes -- a lot of people realize just exactly how extraordinary graffiti can be. Sure yeah. I mean it's amazing it's a very ephemeral art form you know you've got people going out practicing -- day and night for weeks weeks and weeks sometimes at great personal risk usually okay Ferrari of the -- remember legendary game yet. Yeah I mean you know there's legal work is illegal work but those people out there -- all -- time. And you know beer. Creating the skin of our city you know they're they're giving us something and it's an alternative to all the billboards out there. -- do it for free. And it's something that's really word document I thought and -- listening -- what was the moment we're doing you know like take pictures of office. Right right I mean. So I grew up in Brooklyn. And I used to take a way to school every day -- and would see all this -- on the trains and actually that had. No effect on me whatsoever I thought. And it wasn't until it started moving to some other cities that had a lot less graffiti that I started to realize. How much I missed. There's this kind of constant innovation that's going on in the world of graffiti people are. Working on their letters and people working on hand styles and people working under colors and of these artists we're developing. Their skills over a career that might last three years certainly last ten or twenty years now you're trying to. Create records. I mean -- an interest I was interested in the way things changed and I just wanted to you understand it. You know because it's it's hard to get a grip on when -- you see is a moment at a time you know where we we don't. We don't perceived changes that macro scale you know you can't just look at wall and notice. How it's been for the tiny stars but most of system would put things together yeah exactly it's like their bodies are not really designed -- or visual system is designed to. To process change on that scale but if you can collapse that down to minutes or seconds then suddenly you start to notice it. One of the things it motivated me to -- it."

" Do you this project was just curiosity that I didn't really understand why these things are changing in this particular way. It's not only tasks and I'm going on I don't I didn't grow up with a castrate him had I been -- I was very -- an observer and -- have -- a -- camera. But you know as opposed to these people who are living this this sculpture every day. So. But I was interested in how it. How it works on microscopic scale -- what are the patterns that emerge you know. Every every individual person with a campaign. Has his own agenda but what happens when they're all working on a wall together what are the what are the patterns. And there are patterns one of the things that that happens very frequently is. Somebody painted over somebody painted over the Giuliani yet. Get -- over the little reprieve there again dissipated over often enough wish. Works in times square and generally not anywhere else yeah I think it worked on the even over very very often right it does work to paint it over. Every day -- you know that's a lot of money that's lot of pain to spend on. What exactly I'm not sure but this is the spot that gets painted over maybe once every six months -- so and what happens here is interesting. People come out and start tagging you know and you know these are just little. Little tags and some of them. I mean suburban killer. And that is but you know not not anybody's keeper. Expert. And people start putting through always you know these little outlines of film. Simple fast easy to you and eventually. And more elaborate studies -- it starts showing up hand. You know people get a sense that. You know my PC -- here it has been painted over while you know or their pages note -- that familiar with -- interestingly elaborate stuff like this this is taken hours of summit. I have many hours you know. And you know eventually it just keeps on that. That the more elaborate and beautiful work keeps on yeah it created until the back. You know similar racket throwing it but it comes back and so there's this kind of constant progression. Towards more and more elaborate work if you leave it alone if you don't paint over you know and Astaro they threat -- there you know. We're going back to January 2008. And sometimes. You get this natural forward progression. Other times not bombs here's a case we have some people attempting some pretty nice pieces. But. -- Someone comes along and what he wants to do his own. That's right now so he's just gonna paint big fast throw these and just clean it you know. 2007 his mind practices. And you know. That's his her auditory and that's that's as for pocket and he you know he he can he can do that. And but lo and behold it starts a little bit of -- battle you know someone disagrees and that is not hours. And he says yeah actually it is pickup second does the entire wall you know. And this process keeps on going people come across -- out someone else throes of another piece. And you know until it keeps on coming quarter gets in well you know until people give up and say okay all right it's yours all yours and eventually. Because it comes back as there's actually no -- So there is a little bit of this territorial you know action going on. And you know that's another interesting pattern that sometimes it's all about. The art and sometimes it's really about the territory sometimes not saying -- this is my wall you know and he campaigned here even if what you -- is -- Then -- than -- I think if you still can happen will it mean."

" It at some point you post is what had -- let's say it enough for how long. It's been up since he doesn't -- so six -- to say if I have artists come you overtime to talk what was going on I mean everybody you know stumbled across Peter yeah yeah yeah for the camera advocates create a wall it's -- I can -- situation that would be unpleasant. You know -- it was very it was very awkward at first because I didn't know anything about the scene and you know anything about the culture of super curious. And I guess there's a movie cop but you know -- the of the Flickr part of that well but you never know that I am not a confidence so that if you know and so these these guys in order to -- do they have to be very circumspect a couple of -- from -- exactly like cops those you know except that they want people would gather they dropped -- can get -- yeah exactly. -- it is it's a very diverse. -- group of people they look like everything and everybody you know -- but. You know for for my part I basically just show up and tell when I'm trying to do and you know give them my card for the site and about half the time they heard of it and they say oh yeah great take pictures and other times they say well that sounds adjusting -- go ahead and take pictures and maybe like. 10% of people who -- for whatever reason they're very comfortable with the idea they say. I really would rather not and I just respect you know wait wait till they're done comeback campaign and take pictures very cool."

" The -- won't affect one of our sponsors go to daddy dot cannot be transferring them any good any personal or six dollars 99 said. Get a free one year extension -- your digital pricing go to these icons transferring easier offers -- investors including hosting by site builder completely you know totally that's control and quite a bit want cordless six dollars and 99 cents and first Canadian viewers godaddy.com recently started registering dot CA domain names so you. For in the great white Norton really -- you are in lock. Even better we got a code for its a fact discount SYS six 66. We'll save additional 1% on any twelve to 24 months hosting plan some restrictions do apply please see the site for details. Newspaper systems support us by supporting them and -- your -- and it -- yeah."

" So have you Leo how did you organize all this. -- certain walls to pick certain places are -- and to what was next I mean I started very organically I just would go to places where I saw things look at you in the -- take pictures and or retirement kind of developed into you know routine. Mom I go out religiously every weekend again you know if I'm on vacation like -- this week I'll go out during the week to -- couple other spots and you know you just noticed which places get more activity -- other places and so I have my weekly spots I have a monthly bought some money. Sponsored go to every year every six months or so and just try to capture whatever -- you. And that's just the part of it that's just me going around you know with the camera but. There are currently as a collaboration you have you know people that are out there are taking -- is like an army of other photographers out there that are there they're working on I mean there's something like. Fifty or sixty photographers that it contributed to the site. So far but there are literally hundreds more actually thousands more that are members of our Flickr group Condit that. That. I basically set up to allow people to contribute to the site. And on that has basically blown the whole world open to the project because. You know. Originally all I was able to do is document what I can document myself. But what I have now is to have. 460 photographers in London who happen to stop by. This skate park right on the south bank of -- right and some of them are into graffiti and come back and take pictures again and again some we're tourists. You know who actually weren't even taking pictures the graffiti they're taking pictures as a kid and gimmicks like it was doing the trick threat -- on the wall behind it. I can use that photo and that captures a moment in time that nobody else captured. And I enabled -- to all those photos together. And get this really rich -- time lapse that progressing sometimes day by day changing because this is -- where people can everyday. And now we have sort of content through you're you know sort of created this is. This archive this this new do your archaeology on the site you've got Ares -- got a huge Harvard you know effort in mostly in some cases through anonymous people who you know. Bob in London you know you're you're putting you know huge what you're either -- together. How -- together especially when you have a project it's going across in some cases probably decades that you could do this for fifteen years will because the way to project started. All happens is completely unorganized unplanned collection of photos you know obviously if you were going to. Deliberately start doing this he would you know make a mark on the ground and put your tripod there and take a photo from exactly the same spot every time. But because those working from other people's photos as well they're not gonna be part of that agenda you know so I have developed technique that would work with any photo taken under any lighting conditions from any angle. I would be able to correct war the perspective changes and the lighting changes and unique experience seamless. I'm I can do a demo that I'd like to do that's how you really complicated."

" Yes of this is this is the website this is graffiti archaeology. Mom and what you see here is that we've got a list of walls down side. With the locations and each location might have a number walls and you can see if you can. You can count the number of layers each one. So what we're looking at here is a place called the under croft which is okay. Skate park in London on the south bank of the tends. That I've never been team. But thankfully. Hundreds of other people half and they happen to be there with their pictures and so I've got on this wall. 32 layers. Imagery dating back to you -- 2006 so the sort of you we have a big picture of the graffiti in in the timeline across the bottom so you can literally follows the progress -- all exactly so you can come down here you know click on a moment in time. He sees little arrows. He's arrow keys and go backward and forward through time like this and so you you cattle these little moments here's like a moment where these guys were painting. And close up of these guys painting they -- stretched out. Because the photo was shot from an angle. And I stretched out photos to use to fit it in place who scored well so there's no work in progress in here a day later shot by another person entirely. Is finished work. And you can just toggle back and forth compare so big party orange lines are there is basically a photo. Have you sort of before you apply the perspective changed we have orange lines are basically to show. I want the whole process to be really transparent right you know I didn't want to try to hide. You know what's going on behind the curtain you know and so orange outlines show you the outline of the original photo port you know it may have been cropped just sitting on the screen. But that outline actually tells you something about perspective. From which the photo was taken. And you know it's like like to think that is something that -- so it's square it was dead on as it angles of the left there off to the right exactly exactly here's one that you know here's one that was. Shot from below. You know looking out at this little. Detail you can see there's actually quite a lot of detail here you know this is is is crafted by hand they'll. Certainly orange France yet. The I mean this is you know this is amazing you've got a navigator which is sort of which later of this year and he believes -- these -- actually 24 underneath the pictures yeah. -- these are these what these are 2400 pixels why that's Amber's her yet again well mean if you you know critical critical to shrink it down to about that they -- it's like -- if you -- at this point though you know its its they are there extra large images. It's actually one of things like to do to improve the site in future is now finally uses highly. Type assistance that you can get infinite detail instead of being limited to 11 high res image that takes a long time to download but you know that's future work. So --"

" Talk about the work how you put together did you -- yourself. I don't the iPod interface with the help of my friend Eric road back from stealing design. Tom Cruise you know what flash wizard and fantastic designer really brilliant guy and you know we just let it or your project it was your projects it totally was. And we -- we would. You know. When I brought Eric. -- on the project. I had gotten to a point with flash where -- reached the limit of my ability right now I come from a coding background -- comfortable with writing code but flash -- it didn't flash that are really code -- exactly matches its own special -- it's a very special thing that he knows that interface you know inside and out he's he's moved on since then that. But at the time he was really. You know in the classroom he adds that he said you know what you really need -- Pre voters that do things like this so that when -- when he images are loading out DC this. The page is filling up with imagery and stuff like that and does so you know we were able to design this together. And you know design the interface together and -- so both contributed to it. -- business resulting splash because you had access to an expert to use flash because it was us and everybody was using it was the only thing at the time this is 2000 Q it was the only thing that's hot Ajax -- JavaScript is a weird thing it's it's -- recorder right right. Complicated website at that point to the visually -- community graphically but certainly not quite in this planet right right exactly and you know we. What what we both wanted from the experience was that it it has to be fluid had to be immediate had to be -- it had to be transparent you know that's. Yeah yeah. I wanted people to really look at this stuff since and and feel like they're there for the wall and not be. Encumbered by a whole lot of complicated interface stuff right click to move closer and yet don't people just use you know. You know just grab things and drag them and stuff like that and it's very organic experience natural foods that supplied through this yet again that's a lot of that is a lot of that is -- as well he's he likes to make things flow so it helps to have a friend its expert in flash."

" Yeah yeah yeah. The thing about debate what response to those systems eat music that Kopp assistant part of it used -- Click loyalists some of my favorite songs to check out the music that complex systems give a listen to do you want every month this month. -- mix -- all countries up from one -- record Bobby -- junior thinking that nothing out of Austin and not just as -- hotel California it really goes great with Bob idiots to don't give a crap about it if you like what you're here. That you go to the site was made it his music is offering free songs to system viewers from it. Is it -- back complex system to sign up for free trial it's great because there MP3 format which means. It went into your iPod you zoom in pretty much any computer you own the last ten years and there's no -- the only songs for -- degree in music he was a favorite -- tacky music that complex system. And it's always support systems for supporting our sponsors this."

" So your Photoshop work here and -- do some pretty I mean I've I've never changed the perspective of yeah people dramatic it's easy the time consuming. And as are all good things -- job. Yeah so I would love it if there was a way to automate some of the things that we do here but. I can show you what I do you use -- the other photos that's a little different from trying to turn you know Photoshop like this in the something that looks like you've shot at all right side so. Yeah one of the problems with. Automatic stitching is that it doesn't really understand none of them automatic stitching tools out there understand what -- supposed to look like. Can help. Answering services like spider is like spot there with a touch screen and get this kind of wiggly things and -- and if you well yeah exactly so so -- you know what I needed for small one."

" I started doing this those algorithms didn't exist they had been developed yet. And but so this is that this is a wall just as an example these are these are few layers. You can see the layers changing here that happens your flash program accessing the layers are you basically. Create a JPEG for every evolution of the -- I created JPEG for every. Layer and and a creative set of vector outlines that are imported and it's like chocolate. And that that's you know process that I kind of semi automated with scripts and stuff so it takes some of the TV and out of that. But -- the core it is these Photoshop files that just have these different layers and you can see here is clear I've put the --"

" On it in my very meticulous way. So that you can sort them by date. Com so what I'm gonna do you hear the demo for you is I'm going to add a new layer to this. So let's hope and."

" This image. Which was shot. Few weeks after these -- what you'll notice is this is a terrible picture. Right I take full responsibility for that. It was the wrong time and data be shooting here you know its back -- on everything has to do because we've got the skylight on it terrible right. Also a shot at with this -- angle you can super wide angle lens -- ten millimeter lens. And as lovely as that is it actually puts some distortion -- image he got barrel distortion. We have to fix all that. So on the I've got sons of foolish right -- there forget it yeah it actually it actually is this is it does not call higher -- that. That's alas is no more. Because the city decided to reclaim it friendly graffiti vandals you know put. What are you gonna do you know things change so yeah."

" So I'm actually build --"

" And actually built up some some actions that automate some of this process of action for those of us -- familiar and actually fill in Photoshop. An action is basically just a shortcut to automate things you have to do repeatedly -- you can take a whole bunch of repetitive tasks and collapse them into one button you know. So this is a -- lens correction action that I created. Dad I happen to know. Succeeds it correcting the that the barrel distortion for this particular lens this particular. Focal thankful and then -- quarters if you -- exactly so I mean it's very subtle. But it'll make a big difference if you you you won't be able to flatten out wall without this so. I just hit. After twelve here. And okay so you can see before and after. And this line that's the top edge of this -- straight up straight for the benefit and it was not before. Com and this isn't something again that you just kind of develop and I four after looking at these pictures over and over again. And trying and failing to flatten the wall and -- I'll ask. Barrel distortion so music similar realize that -- sort of a whole group of settings for the -- is exactly. So there's want action now another thing I might do here is. Try to color correct. On the wall and Amber's gonna do really simple color correction here so first all -- out the area where the wall is during roughly. -- and then I'm going to better. Selection area. And maybe twenty pixels of other and that's just to soften that edge so you don't get a real obvious. Line along the line between the corporate it's like yeah. Hi and that region and then I can do levels. Here's wheels to say quick to register. And just -- right now have that makes it pretty huge difference yeah. It and bring it again a little bit and we're certainly get some -- looks pretty decent. And -- some color correction needs to happen here we doing this are you thinking of like what you saw versus what the camera soft. Yeah on the mobile computing that's. And I'm thinking of what color right -- wall to actually be right you know I'm noticing that the highlights here look kind of bluish. And I know that they were really -- you know I know that this wall is actually kind of a cream color it's not great so I'm just gonna correct for all that. And so just you know put a little yellow in there put a little red in there are starting to warm ups for you can more natural. -- read into the highlights picking -- how much we'll -- highlights. You know and now we're starting to roughly get into the zone of how it actually looks just like okay it was silver paint you know white -- an orange and blue and black and orange. So now we've got that and I know I can either take the entire picture. And just grab the whole thing that I think this could grab a segment over here. To make life a little bit easier so let's just grab this part the interesting part. Because I happen noted this hyper throat who is actually only thing that's new. So let me just grab that. Itself. And copy. And here comes the fun part. Zoom in here. A little bit. We paste. But my got a huge picture. So let's just first. -- think a little transparent. And in this is the part where it actually gets. Interest and we'll do it control -- to transform. Apple T whatever you call on the Mac. And then you can hold down shift and keep the proportions correct. And did it wearing protective wall yeah. And you know Photoshop actually Photoshop CS three does have some pretty nifty automated things that let you. Align layers based on content. They only work when most of the content is Hussein and her analysts changed and I I have actually used it successfully. To do some of these layers but I don't think -- work for this one because most of the content is different kind. So but did you have that as an option as well if you if this processing is able to labor intensive so they realize you're sort of took the right. On this thing in Seattle that the little miss -- were narrower -- exactly so now we've got a decent perspective it's all this has been just straight up scaling for the image. -- So do --"

" You -- these different options when you're doing transform and one of them is distort. And distort -- we just lets you drag around all the corners. And it will keep it a perspective transformation. And what's actually about there's an interest in math going on here under the hood but. It's a weird property of geometry. A perspective geometry. That if you take a picture of wall in perspective -- and then you take that picture and distorted using the same kind of perspective transformed you can actually get back to the exact. -- Linear proportions of wall so that's what I'm doing here and Photoshop is basically makes it easy to do you. Pencils and mean. And this is where you start doing the little matching game. Making sure that every little detail lines up. As exactly as he can. I prefer a typical show two when they're creating a layer particular side healthy baby pictures you history towards -- maybe like 1015 minutes per later. You know -- photo -- you know. Depending on how good or bad your original photos were -- this is particularly bad one because the color was so far off. You know if I shot this on a bright sunny day with. The sun hitting the wall in the front. You know than it might take less time to do that kind of few steps. So. -- got a pretty good match. Not a perfect match but much better. We just hit return. And it would bring you pass you back up."

" And there it is -- just toggle on and off. And you know. It's not exact there's little bit of distortion happening nature you know in this area that area but it basically receive the twist on one of the operates its -- the -- right and there's a reason for that reason why this is happening is that actually this walls and flat. Funny it's a piece of metal it's gotten slightly bent out you know there's a junkyard on the other side of the people being heavy equipment against it. And lo and behold the wall isn't perfectly flat compared. So you can go in and he's the war you know to correct for this little -- little because this is -- good enough to give you the basic idea. And what I would do after this is I would maybe do one more color correction pastor bring the color more perfectly in line with the you know the background and ninety little. Human saturation. Paths. Just bring up the saturation a bit. There we go that pink that wizard peace over here is -- get a little closer. And other little tricks -- might just. Select some regions and better than. You know by a lot like hundred pixels. So got a nice -- region here that they can use to. Above the levels just a little bit more. So that that -- that's because of that edge is is clean you know I think this is pretty pretty standard. Stuff but for -- this Photoshop yeah yeah yeah yeah I don't know for sure because they've just been I've been using Photoshop since. Workshop one. I circular opera version to compete. Yes so now you can see and starting to get that -- to look a little bit cleaner have to crops of this. Little detailed it. You know -- to -- what's not perfect but it's getting pretty close so they just do that for a little while and eventually got a nice seamlessly."

" The layers it's saved the file and output JPEG there exactly point six step back. You know. You've got some calling records and besides they want to create a site access yet -- unity Tuesday stamps from you know 1900 did you know today. How how the idea growing on my backyard all over the past twenty years. How you're having you know if you if you are familiar with flash -- if it it is it's 2008 that you've got to let advances have been made the right Internet zip code coding wise right right -- flash believe something else -- tools that it's easier to -- well you know. The manual manipulation part that I'm doing here that's probably not gonna change that much you know but. They're certainly other pictures pictures. -- yeah yes and you know there are. You know you can certainly try doing some Ajax type of stuff you know. But sound if you can get the images. Registered so that they were all in the same space like this. You can just out of the mall and chauvinist slide show friends you know and you you want happy the fancy stuff like the ability to zoom in and all that -- might be a potential tool flicker is it is a tool that actually seen some people -- great success there's one. Person in our Flickr group who. You. Has walked by the same house in Berkeley for every day for the past. Five years or so has been to steadily documented and photos that and and I think. What what that person does is just stand in the same place at the conference that takes a lot of -- my grandchildren because the -- Apple exactly exactly and so they're able to really you know crop it just just so but then you can look at slide show in just. You know paged through it and you get a lot of that seem. Experience -- without you doing this in maintenance company that. Of course the other thing you can do is send -- your photos and I'll be very very happy to put them up on the site because I'm I'm really interested in. The way any kind of artwork is changing on the time -- over time. What they've been document things are small graffiti for the most part because. That's a subculture where change is so much a part of but there's you know stand souls and stickers and we pace and three dimensional art and all kinds of other stuff going on and then there are things that aren't even our -- at all that are just changing in the city billboards and you know plants growing -- cracks appearing in the concrete and -- kind of stuff. And you know I personally -- interest in all that. -- be very happy if there's anybody out there that wants to do this you know. Is that this is shareware and well yeah yeah and eventually you know. It's pretty cool stuff going on out there you know the University of Washington where -- used to. Study. There is. Team led by Nellis neatly who's doing. This thing called photos and and or it's I think Microsoft called for us and them. Under -- photo tourism. And it's a an automated way of stitching together huge numbers of photos into actual three dimensional view of the world. If something like that it existed when I started this project I never would've done it this way. They don't solve all the problems. You know inherent in -- in this here because. They don't really have a solution war what happens when the color of the walls changing every picture -- ten minutes. But you did correct it through before you do you know -- you know something that I hope -- work with a team like that to be able to kind of expand their technique to be able to use on the stuff you know. Which I think it's actually very close so. Cancer is an amazing thank you -- natural history this has -- clicks."

" It's time now for a Netflix monster movie pick of the week this week it's the warriors released in 1979. It's become a cult classic of the three decades since its release starts out on the street gang unit he gathered to discuss the CI troops but it quickly take a turn for the worse and we follow one specific and the warriors. As they're chased by rival gangs and cops. Slowly travelling to their home turf on Coney Island if you haven't seen the movie you're missing out -- great piece of cinematic history and a great look. Well and in New York City that doesn't exist -- of paper and a few Netflix -- And you don't like Netflix has something like a 100000 other titles you can check out including Blu-ray titles you're probably not gonna find your local video store and reportage of things that are most -- happen in a single business day it's getting the other ways is forty. Plans start at the flat monthly fee of four dollars 99 cents -- your system viewers who got the hook up for it. Can you get a free trial by signing up today at www. Netflix dot com slash system well thank Kathy Curtis is coming on the show walking us through an amazing -- in an amazing project you know a little more -- site check it out -- dot org TR AF ARC dot war. Some else you might want to check out. What courses or programs here illusion of three ethnic food movies pop culture in the latest -- everything after suicide GPS has an all you can check out an Epic Fu. Dot com until next time I'm Patrick Norton and you've been watching system."

" Yeah yeah."

" No. Episodes of system has brought didn't -- godaddy.com. In music and Netflix. That is easy to share stands for -- right when -- an album the other is on the show their static they don't change. But how do you display so biggest campaign. Hang on a wall or put on a pedestal or something changes over time -- the architecture and city and graffiti on the walls of that city. Better yet how do you make it available online for anyone to explore. We're gonna show you how to -- an interactive online archaeological harkat on today's episode of system. -- give -- are taking street level photos for Google maps a lot of folks commented on acted as an is that digital archives cities communities and neighborhoods. -- would be able to go back and -- street store signs in the city itself changed over time at least if somebody archive older images. But you don't -- resources and does million dollar company like Google to create a digital archive places buildings and streets. Today's guest is create an extraordinary site recording the life graffiti on the walls New York City Los Angeles. And -- very -- San Francisco and easier to give us a behind the scenes look at how he pulled it all together."

" Well the -- So are we are really your last name out of this is just like your secret identity gonna just check and click that it. So you actually. You you have a graffiti archaeology project yes this is like the least maybe not the least but probably on the list of permanent artsy enemy which it -- an animal stuff for the -- like a bunch of food in a box and sealed it -- the Guggenheim people I mean this stuff beneath it comes goes -- a lot of people realize just exactly how extraordinary graffiti can be. Sure yeah. I mean it's amazing it's a very ephemeral art form you know you've got people going out practicing -- day and night for weeks weeks and weeks sometimes at great personal risk usually okay Ferrari of the -- remember legendary game yet. Yeah I mean you know there's legal work is illegal work but those people out there -- all -- time. And you know beer. Creating the skin of our city you know they're they're giving us something and it's an alternative to all the billboards out there. -- do it for free. And it's something that's really word document I thought and -- listening -- what was the moment we're doing you know like take pictures of office. Right right I mean. So I grew up in Brooklyn. And I used to take a way to school every day -- and would see all this -- on the trains and actually that had. No effect on me whatsoever I thought. And it wasn't until it started moving to some other cities that had a lot less graffiti that I started to realize. How much I missed. There's this kind of constant innovation that's going on in the world of graffiti people are. Working on their letters and people working on hand styles and people working under colors and of these artists we're developing. Their skills over a career that might last three years certainly last ten or twenty years now you're trying to. Create records. I mean -- an interest I was interested in the way things changed and I just wanted to you understand it. You know because it's it's hard to get a grip on when -- you see is a moment at a time you know where we we don't. We don't perceived changes that macro scale you know you can't just look at wall and notice. How it's been for the tiny stars but most of system would put things together yeah exactly it's like their bodies are not really designed -- or visual system is designed to. To process change on that scale but if you can collapse that down to minutes or seconds then suddenly you start to notice it. One of the things it motivated me to -- it."

" Do you this project was just curiosity that I didn't really understand why these things are changing in this particular way. It's not only tasks and I'm going on I don't I didn't grow up with a castrate him had I been -- I was very -- an observer and -- have -- a -- camera. But you know as opposed to these people who are living this this sculpture every day. So. But I was interested in how it. How it works on microscopic scale -- what are the patterns that emerge you know. Every every individual person with a campaign. Has his own agenda but what happens when they're all working on a wall together what are the what are the patterns. And there are patterns one of the things that that happens very frequently is. Somebody painted over somebody painted over the Giuliani yet. Get -- over the little reprieve there again dissipated over often enough wish. Works in times square and generally not anywhere else yeah I think it worked on the even over very very often right it does work to paint it over. Every day -- you know that's a lot of money that's lot of pain to spend on. What exactly I'm not sure but this is the spot that gets painted over maybe once every six months -- so and what happens here is interesting. People come out and start tagging you know and you know these are just little. Little tags and some of them. I mean suburban killer. And that is but you know not not anybody's keeper. Expert. And people start putting through always you know these little outlines of film. Simple fast easy to you and eventually. And more elaborate studies -- it starts showing up hand. You know people get a sense that. You know my PC -- here it has been painted over while you know or their pages note -- that familiar with -- interestingly elaborate stuff like this this is taken hours of summit. I have many hours you know. And you know eventually it just keeps on that. That the more elaborate and beautiful work keeps on yeah it created until the back. You know similar racket throwing it but it comes back and so there's this kind of constant progression. Towards more and more elaborate work if you leave it alone if you don't paint over you know and Astaro they threat -- there you know. We're going back to January 2008. And sometimes. You get this natural forward progression. Other times not bombs here's a case we have some people attempting some pretty nice pieces. But. -- Someone comes along and what he wants to do his own. That's right now so he's just gonna paint big fast throw these and just clean it you know. 2007 his mind practices. And you know. That's his her auditory and that's that's as for pocket and he you know he he can he can do that. And but lo and behold it starts a little bit of -- battle you know someone disagrees and that is not hours. And he says yeah actually it is pickup second does the entire wall you know. And this process keeps on going people come across -- out someone else throes of another piece. And you know until it keeps on coming quarter gets in well you know until people give up and say okay all right it's yours all yours and eventually. Because it comes back as there's actually no -- So there is a little bit of this territorial you know action going on. And you know that's another interesting pattern that sometimes it's all about. The art and sometimes it's really about the territory sometimes not saying -- this is my wall you know and he campaigned here even if what you -- is -- Then -- than -- I think if you still can happen will it mean."

" It at some point you post is what had -- let's say it enough for how long. It's been up since he doesn't -- so six -- to say if I have artists come you overtime to talk what was going on I mean everybody you know stumbled across Peter yeah yeah yeah for the camera advocates create a wall it's -- I can -- situation that would be unpleasant. You know -- it was very it was very awkward at first because I didn't know anything about the scene and you know anything about the culture of super curious. And I guess there's a movie cop but you know -- the of the Flickr part of that well but you never know that I am not a confidence so that if you know and so these these guys in order to -- do they have to be very circumspect a couple of -- from -- exactly like cops those you know except that they want people would gather they dropped -- can get -- yeah exactly. -- it is it's a very diverse. -- group of people they look like everything and everybody you know -- but. You know for for my part I basically just show up and tell when I'm trying to do and you know give them my card for the site and about half the time they heard of it and they say oh yeah great take pictures and other times they say well that sounds adjusting -- go ahead and take pictures and maybe like. 10% of people who -- for whatever reason they're very comfortable with the idea they say. I really would rather not and I just respect you know wait wait till they're done comeback campaign and take pictures very cool."

" The -- won't affect one of our sponsors go to daddy dot cannot be transferring them any good any personal or six dollars 99 said. Get a free one year extension -- your digital pricing go to these icons transferring easier offers -- investors including hosting by site builder completely you know totally that's control and quite a bit want cordless six dollars and 99 cents and first Canadian viewers godaddy.com recently started registering dot CA domain names so you. For in the great white Norton really -- you are in lock. Even better we got a code for its a fact discount SYS six 66. We'll save additional 1% on any twelve to 24 months hosting plan some restrictions do apply please see the site for details. Newspaper systems support us by supporting them and -- your -- and it -- yeah."

" So have you Leo how did you organize all this. -- certain walls to pick certain places are -- and to what was next I mean I started very organically I just would go to places where I saw things look at you in the -- take pictures and or retirement kind of developed into you know routine. Mom I go out religiously every weekend again you know if I'm on vacation like -- this week I'll go out during the week to -- couple other spots and you know you just noticed which places get more activity -- other places and so I have my weekly spots I have a monthly bought some money. Sponsored go to every year every six months or so and just try to capture whatever -- you. And that's just the part of it that's just me going around you know with the camera but. There are currently as a collaboration you have you know people that are out there are taking -- is like an army of other photographers out there that are there they're working on I mean there's something like. Fifty or sixty photographers that it contributed to the site. So far but there are literally hundreds more actually thousands more that are members of our Flickr group Condit that. That. I basically set up to allow people to contribute to the site. And on that has basically blown the whole world open to the project because. You know. Originally all I was able to do is document what I can document myself. But what I have now is to have. 460 photographers in London who happen to stop by. This skate park right on the south bank of -- right and some of them are into graffiti and come back and take pictures again and again some we're tourists. You know who actually weren't even taking pictures the graffiti they're taking pictures as a kid and gimmicks like it was doing the trick threat -- on the wall behind it. I can use that photo and that captures a moment in time that nobody else captured. And I enabled -- to all those photos together. And get this really rich -- time lapse that progressing sometimes day by day changing because this is -- where people can everyday. And now we have sort of content through you're you know sort of created this is. This archive this this new do your archaeology on the site you've got Ares -- got a huge Harvard you know effort in mostly in some cases through anonymous people who you know. Bob in London you know you're you're putting you know huge what you're either -- together. How -- together especially when you have a project it's going across in some cases probably decades that you could do this for fifteen years will because the way to project started. All happens is completely unorganized unplanned collection of photos you know obviously if you were going to. Deliberately start doing this he would you know make a mark on the ground and put your tripod there and take a photo from exactly the same spot every time. But because those working from other people's photos as well they're not gonna be part of that agenda you know so I have developed technique that would work with any photo taken under any lighting conditions from any angle. I would be able to correct war the perspective changes and the lighting changes and unique experience seamless. I'm I can do a demo that I'd like to do that's how you really complicated."

" Yes of this is this is the website this is graffiti archaeology. Mom and what you see here is that we've got a list of walls down side. With the locations and each location might have a number walls and you can see if you can. You can count the number of layers each one. So what we're looking at here is a place called the under croft which is okay. Skate park in London on the south bank of the tends. That I've never been team. But thankfully. Hundreds of other people half and they happen to be there with their pictures and so I've got on this wall. 32 layers. Imagery dating back to you -- 2006 so the sort of you we have a big picture of the graffiti in in the timeline across the bottom so you can literally follows the progress -- all exactly so you can come down here you know click on a moment in time. He sees little arrows. He's arrow keys and go backward and forward through time like this and so you you cattle these little moments here's like a moment where these guys were painting. And close up of these guys painting they -- stretched out. Because the photo was shot from an angle. And I stretched out photos to use to fit it in place who scored well so there's no work in progress in here a day later shot by another person entirely. Is finished work. And you can just toggle back and forth compare so big party orange lines are there is basically a photo. Have you sort of before you apply the perspective changed we have orange lines are basically to show. I want the whole process to be really transparent right you know I didn't want to try to hide. You know what's going on behind the curtain you know and so orange outlines show you the outline of the original photo port you know it may have been cropped just sitting on the screen. But that outline actually tells you something about perspective. From which the photo was taken. And you know it's like like to think that is something that -- so it's square it was dead on as it angles of the left there off to the right exactly exactly here's one that you know here's one that was. Shot from below. You know looking out at this little. Detail you can see there's actually quite a lot of detail here you know this is is is crafted by hand they'll. Certainly orange France yet. The I mean this is you know this is amazing you've got a navigator which is sort of which later of this year and he believes -- these -- actually 24 underneath the pictures yeah. -- these are these what these are 2400 pixels why that's Amber's her yet again well mean if you you know critical critical to shrink it down to about that they -- it's like -- if you -- at this point though you know its its they are there extra large images. It's actually one of things like to do to improve the site in future is now finally uses highly. Type assistance that you can get infinite detail instead of being limited to 11 high res image that takes a long time to download but you know that's future work. So --"

" Talk about the work how you put together did you -- yourself. I don't the iPod interface with the help of my friend Eric road back from stealing design. Tom Cruise you know what flash wizard and fantastic designer really brilliant guy and you know we just let it or your project it was your projects it totally was. And we -- we would. You know. When I brought Eric. -- on the project. I had gotten to a point with flash where -- reached the limit of my ability right now I come from a coding background -- comfortable with writing code but flash -- it didn't flash that are really code -- exactly matches its own special -- it's a very special thing that he knows that interface you know inside and out he's he's moved on since then that. But at the time he was really. You know in the classroom he adds that he said you know what you really need -- Pre voters that do things like this so that when -- when he images are loading out DC this. The page is filling up with imagery and stuff like that and does so you know we were able to design this together. And you know design the interface together and -- so both contributed to it. -- business resulting splash because you had access to an expert to use flash because it was us and everybody was using it was the only thing at the time this is 2000 Q it was the only thing that's hot Ajax -- JavaScript is a weird thing it's it's -- recorder right right. Complicated website at that point to the visually -- community graphically but certainly not quite in this planet right right exactly and you know we. What what we both wanted from the experience was that it it has to be fluid had to be immediate had to be -- it had to be transparent you know that's. Yeah yeah. I wanted people to really look at this stuff since and and feel like they're there for the wall and not be. Encumbered by a whole lot of complicated interface stuff right click to move closer and yet don't people just use you know. You know just grab things and drag them and stuff like that and it's very organic experience natural foods that supplied through this yet again that's a lot of that is a lot of that is -- as well he's he likes to make things flow so it helps to have a friend its expert in flash."

" Yeah yeah yeah. The thing about debate what response to those systems eat music that Kopp assistant part of it used -- Click loyalists some of my favorite songs to check out the music that complex systems give a listen to do you want every month this month. -- mix -- all countries up from one -- record Bobby -- junior thinking that nothing out of Austin and not just as -- hotel California it really goes great with Bob idiots to don't give a crap about it if you like what you're here. That you go to the site was made it his music is offering free songs to system viewers from it. Is it -- back complex system to sign up for free trial it's great because there MP3 format which means. It went into your iPod you zoom in pretty much any computer you own the last ten years and there's no -- the only songs for -- degree in music he was a favorite -- tacky music that complex system. And it's always support systems for supporting our sponsors this."

" So your Photoshop work here and -- do some pretty I mean I've I've never changed the perspective of yeah people dramatic it's easy the time consuming. And as are all good things -- job. Yeah so I would love it if there was a way to automate some of the things that we do here but. I can show you what I do you use -- the other photos that's a little different from trying to turn you know Photoshop like this in the something that looks like you've shot at all right side so. Yeah one of the problems with. Automatic stitching is that it doesn't really understand none of them automatic stitching tools out there understand what -- supposed to look like. Can help. Answering services like spider is like spot there with a touch screen and get this kind of wiggly things and -- and if you well yeah exactly so so -- you know what I needed for small one."

" I started doing this those algorithms didn't exist they had been developed yet. And but so this is that this is a wall just as an example these are these are few layers. You can see the layers changing here that happens your flash program accessing the layers are you basically. Create a JPEG for every evolution of the -- I created JPEG for every. Layer and and a creative set of vector outlines that are imported and it's like chocolate. And that that's you know process that I kind of semi automated with scripts and stuff so it takes some of the TV and out of that. But -- the core it is these Photoshop files that just have these different layers and you can see here is clear I've put the --"

" On it in my very meticulous way. So that you can sort them by date. Com so what I'm gonna do you hear the demo for you is I'm going to add a new layer to this. So let's hope and."

" This image. Which was shot. Few weeks after these -- what you'll notice is this is a terrible picture. Right I take full responsibility for that. It was the wrong time and data be shooting here you know its back -- on everything has to do because we've got the skylight on it terrible right. Also a shot at with this -- angle you can super wide angle lens -- ten millimeter lens. And as lovely as that is it actually puts some distortion -- image he got barrel distortion. We have to fix all that. So on the I've got sons of foolish right -- there forget it yeah it actually it actually is this is it does not call higher -- that. That's alas is no more. Because the city decided to reclaim it friendly graffiti vandals you know put. What are you gonna do you know things change so yeah."

" So I'm actually build --"

" And actually built up some some actions that automate some of this process of action for those of us -- familiar and actually fill in Photoshop. An action is basically just a shortcut to automate things you have to do repeatedly -- you can take a whole bunch of repetitive tasks and collapse them into one button you know. So this is a -- lens correction action that I created. Dad I happen to know. Succeeds it correcting the that the barrel distortion for this particular lens this particular. Focal thankful and then -- quarters if you -- exactly so I mean it's very subtle. But it'll make a big difference if you you you won't be able to flatten out wall without this so. I just hit. After twelve here. And okay so you can see before and after. And this line that's the top edge of this -- straight up straight for the benefit and it was not before. Com and this isn't something again that you just kind of develop and I four after looking at these pictures over and over again. And trying and failing to flatten the wall and -- I'll ask. Barrel distortion so music similar realize that -- sort of a whole group of settings for the -- is exactly. So there's want action now another thing I might do here is. Try to color correct. On the wall and Amber's gonna do really simple color correction here so first all -- out the area where the wall is during roughly. -- and then I'm going to better. Selection area. And maybe twenty pixels of other and that's just to soften that edge so you don't get a real obvious. Line along the line between the corporate it's like yeah. Hi and that region and then I can do levels. Here's wheels to say quick to register. And just -- right now have that makes it pretty huge difference yeah. It and bring it again a little bit and we're certainly get some -- looks pretty decent. And -- some color correction needs to happen here we doing this are you thinking of like what you saw versus what the camera soft. Yeah on the mobile computing that's. And I'm thinking of what color right -- wall to actually be right you know I'm noticing that the highlights here look kind of bluish. And I know that they were really -- you know I know that this wall is actually kind of a cream color it's not great so I'm just gonna correct for all that. And so just you know put a little yellow in there put a little red in there are starting to warm ups for you can more natural. -- read into the highlights picking -- how much we'll -- highlights. You know and now we're starting to roughly get into the zone of how it actually looks just like okay it was silver paint you know white -- an orange and blue and black and orange. So now we've got that and I know I can either take the entire picture. And just grab the whole thing that I think this could grab a segment over here. To make life a little bit easier so let's just grab this part the interesting part. Because I happen noted this hyper throat who is actually only thing that's new. So let me just grab that. Itself. And copy. And here comes the fun part. Zoom in here. A little bit. We paste. But my got a huge picture. So let's just first. -- think a little transparent. And in this is the part where it actually gets. Interest and we'll do it control -- to transform. Apple T whatever you call on the Mac. And then you can hold down shift and keep the proportions correct. And did it wearing protective wall yeah. And you know Photoshop actually Photoshop CS three does have some pretty nifty automated things that let you. Align layers based on content. They only work when most of the content is Hussein and her analysts changed and I I have actually used it successfully. To do some of these layers but I don't think -- work for this one because most of the content is different kind. So but did you have that as an option as well if you if this processing is able to labor intensive so they realize you're sort of took the right. On this thing in Seattle that the little miss -- were narrower -- exactly so now we've got a decent perspective it's all this has been just straight up scaling for the image. -- So do --"

" You -- these different options when you're doing transform and one of them is distort. And distort -- we just lets you drag around all the corners. And it will keep it a perspective transformation. And what's actually about there's an interest in math going on here under the hood but. It's a weird property of geometry. A perspective geometry. That if you take a picture of wall in perspective -- and then you take that picture and distorted using the same kind of perspective transformed you can actually get back to the exact. -- Linear proportions of wall so that's what I'm doing here and Photoshop is basically makes it easy to do you. Pencils and mean. And this is where you start doing the little matching game. Making sure that every little detail lines up. As exactly as he can. I prefer a typical show two when they're creating a layer particular side healthy baby pictures you history towards -- maybe like 1015 minutes per later. You know -- photo -- you know. Depending on how good or bad your original photos were -- this is particularly bad one because the color was so far off. You know if I shot this on a bright sunny day with. The sun hitting the wall in the front. You know than it might take less time to do that kind of few steps. So. -- got a pretty good match. Not a perfect match but much better. We just hit return. And it would bring you pass you back up."

" And there it is -- just toggle on and off. And you know. It's not exact there's little bit of distortion happening nature you know in this area that area but it basically receive the twist on one of the operates its -- the -- right and there's a reason for that reason why this is happening is that actually this walls and flat. Funny it's a piece of metal it's gotten slightly bent out you know there's a junkyard on the other side of the people being heavy equipment against it. And lo and behold the wall isn't perfectly flat compared. So you can go in and he's the war you know to correct for this little -- little because this is -- good enough to give you the basic idea. And what I would do after this is I would maybe do one more color correction pastor bring the color more perfectly in line with the you know the background and ninety little. Human saturation. Paths. Just bring up the saturation a bit. There we go that pink that wizard peace over here is -- get a little closer. And other little tricks -- might just. Select some regions and better than. You know by a lot like hundred pixels. So got a nice -- region here that they can use to. Above the levels just a little bit more. So that that -- that's because of that edge is is clean you know I think this is pretty pretty standard. Stuff but for -- this Photoshop yeah yeah yeah yeah I don't know for sure because they've just been I've been using Photoshop since. Workshop one. I circular opera version to compete. Yes so now you can see and starting to get that -- to look a little bit cleaner have to crops of this. Little detailed it. You know -- to -- what's not perfect but it's getting pretty close so they just do that for a little while and eventually got a nice seamlessly."

" The layers it's saved the file and output JPEG there exactly point six step back. You know. You've got some calling records and besides they want to create a site access yet -- unity Tuesday stamps from you know 1900 did you know today. How how the idea growing on my backyard all over the past twenty years. How you're having you know if you if you are familiar with flash -- if it it is it's 2008 that you've got to let advances have been made the right Internet zip code coding wise right right -- flash believe something else -- tools that it's easier to -- well you know. The manual manipulation part that I'm doing here that's probably not gonna change that much you know but. They're certainly other pictures pictures. -- yeah yes and you know there are. You know you can certainly try doing some Ajax type of stuff you know. But sound if you can get the images. Registered so that they were all in the same space like this. You can just out of the mall and chauvinist slide show friends you know and you you want happy the fancy stuff like the ability to zoom in and all that -- might be a potential tool flicker is it is a tool that actually seen some people -- great success there's one. Person in our Flickr group who. You. Has walked by the same house in Berkeley for every day for the past. Five years or so has been to steadily documented and photos that and and I think. What what that person does is just stand in the same place at the conference that takes a lot of -- my grandchildren because the -- Apple exactly exactly and so they're able to really you know crop it just just so but then you can look at slide show in just. You know paged through it and you get a lot of that seem. Experience -- without you doing this in maintenance company that. Of course the other thing you can do is send -- your photos and I'll be very very happy to put them up on the site because I'm I'm really interested in. The way any kind of artwork is changing on the time -- over time. What they've been document things are small graffiti for the most part because. That's a subculture where change is so much a part of but there's you know stand souls and stickers and we pace and three dimensional art and all kinds of other stuff going on and then there are things that aren't even our -- at all that are just changing in the city billboards and you know plants growing -- cracks appearing in the concrete and -- kind of stuff. And you know I personally -- interest in all that. -- be very happy if there's anybody out there that wants to do this you know. Is that this is shareware and well yeah yeah and eventually you know. It's pretty cool stuff going on out there you know the University of Washington where -- used to. Study. There is. Team led by Nellis neatly who's doing. This thing called photos and and or it's I think Microsoft called for us and them. Under -- photo tourism. And it's a an automated way of stitching together huge numbers of photos into actual three dimensional view of the world. If something like that it existed when I started this project I never would've done it this way. They don't solve all the problems. You know inherent in -- in this here because. They don't really have a solution war what happens when the color of the walls changing every picture -- ten minutes. But you did correct it through before you do you know -- you know something that I hope -- work with a team like that to be able to kind of expand their technique to be able to use on the stuff you know. Which I think it's actually very close so. Cancer is an amazing thank you -- natural history this has -- clicks."

" It's time now for a Netflix monster movie pick of the week this week it's the warriors released in 1979. It's become a cult classic of the three decades since its release starts out on the street gang unit he gathered to discuss the CI troops but it quickly take a turn for the worse and we follow one specific and the warriors. As they're chased by rival gangs and cops. Slowly travelling to their home turf on Coney Island if you haven't seen the movie you're missing out -- great piece of cinematic history and a great look. Well and in New York City that doesn't exist -- of paper and a few Netflix -- And you don't like Netflix has something like a 100000 other titles you can check out including Blu-ray titles you're probably not gonna find your local video store and reportage of things that are most -- happen in a single business day it's getting the other ways is forty. Plans start at the flat monthly fee of four dollars 99 cents -- your system viewers who got the hook up for it. Can you get a free trial by signing up today at www. Netflix dot com slash system well thank Kathy Curtis is coming on the show walking us through an amazing -- in an amazing project you know a little more -- site check it out -- dot org TR AF ARC dot war. Some else you might want to check out. What courses or programs here illusion of three ethnic food movies pop culture in the latest -- everything after suicide GPS has an all you can check out an Epic Fu. Dot com until next time I'm Patrick Norton and you've been watching system."

" Yeah yeah."