" War. Today's episode system is sponsored by go to daddy. Netflix. And it turns out. Quite a bit from the way digital camera lenses collapse to putting communications and telescopes satellites in this space. This is origami in the 21 century coming up on today's system. There's a laser described reverse side of what we're not gonna be making any project cases here are not going to be cutting in a plastic we're gonna be talking about. Folding paper. Why you care well because it's actually the cutting edge of engineering right now whether we're talking about space where the air bags in your car let's think most talked to proper line. But origami an -- marching quite happily the 21 century. To. Did you find you've you've you've."

" You translating or on the problems in the map did you find any applicable fields. To the dead -- do -- well and or that they still alive which yes we're still alive because some of them half. That applies to origami is actually very recent -- touches on a lot of different fields in math. Graph theory group theory lots of countering some intrigue that even. Things you learn in high school are applicable to origami but one of the fields that has had the biggest impact. On origami is a relatively young field called computational geometry. As fields only about thirty years old so and it's the studying. Specifically. Algorithms and data structures. How you do things with the computer. And it's. How a lot of effect on what's possible in Oregon. When I wrote my program that design or program called Treo maker one of the key steps. Was figuring out. Optimal arrangement. Of hacking. Circles into a square box the packaging problem. And that problem turned out to be of the type whose mathematical name is nonlinear constrained optimization. And not only how that already been solved and I could use the solution that was out there in the literature. But it is a problem that is the subject of continuous study and so as the computational geometry there is find. Better ways of solving that constrained optimization I can make use of their results and improve. My origami is musings that it's so with tree maker mean do you manner in other -- there's a -- walking on here. Show over there you actually. You know do you design -- that phone tree maker will be primarily -- I primarily use it for insects not so for things that are kind of stick like. On so you know insects or. Use it for birds if you imagine a bird is a stick figure sticks for wings. Legs -- Anything that you can be represented moralists a stick figure. I can -- tree maker to design. And in fact -- the mathematical name for the stick figure that contains no loops is tree. And that's where an -- maker Cisco -- does this is -- a decision tree here but if you the you know it's a graph theory tree. So if you can draw a stick figure of the subject. Then tree maker takes that's it you're you're actually draw on the computer screens -- it takes that's it in here. Figures out. What are -- circles that represent and stick figure fine is the solution packing and then finds the creases. That will fold the square. Into that exact stick figure. So -- in this giant sort of mathematical formula which represents the series of falls on a sheet of paper to create something like this does -- you two the seeking new directions when you end up with Libya is. I never see and anyone who uses cream maker never sees the giant mathematical formula there is a mathematical formula buried. Inside the program and it's it's enormously complex any. Given model involves the solution maybe a hundred or 200 equations but the beauty as we don't seem -- All we need to see is the actual pattern holds. And and there are you can look at here's all the clues there this is a valley -- that way as a mountain forty here goes this way. And so you can take that holding pattern. And just work from the holding pattern. And almost magically. It works out to give you all the parts that you need. To me the subject whether it's something representational. Line beetle. Or something more abstract. Like the pattern for flattening an -- So when your time about it is is that -- pattern that comes and that's that would. -- origami some mean things always been when you when you're researching ways that decrease pattern in the order increase patterns. Always seem to come up is these decrease pattern itself the order of the folds -- the primary part of the problem. -- pattern isn't the order in fact it's almost an Independent part the -- pattern is a map of all the folds. And then a distinct question is what quarter do you make. Those holds it how would you number those produces 16. And one of the big huge surprises that came about when people started designing models by creating -- patterns. Was the realization. That sometimes. You can't break it down into a distinct order that the only way. To make this origami model was to bring all the creases together wants really -- the situation first arrived people thought. You're gonna designers are just ladies -- fairly easily -- come up with a folding sequence. But then when we started looking at the problem mathematically we realized. That. When you go directly to decrease pattern it often turns out that all increases their inner related in such a way. That you can't separate. This is a legitimate use -- term you're reducing complexity. A well I can you relate if if the -- is -- the other thing I can think of place where that might be an advantage if you trying to. Constrained to the you talked about it let us like a giant for no plans for the war. And -- it would seem like constraining it or having to have it all work at the same time would prevent maybe one part for hanging off on the wrong direction or that's absolutely right. In scientific applications that property of having all the creases in a related that the whole thing moves as one. Is a plus because if you making an antenna you want it to move it very controlled way. If if it has multiple degrees of freedom it could happen that as one part unfolds it -- means another part. And it actually happened about twenty years ago with Galileo spacecraft. Loops and that that the main antenna got snagged him and couldn't open. And cripple the mission. So you want everything to open together in close up to him. And that's the property. That that is often the case in the -- patterns as -- it's. But in representational -- people would like to do it one that the time is or -- it is very sort of it's Japanese in the process step by step it's -- everything's kind of the key ceremony and it's easy. I don't look at so much ceremonial it's just easier if you can go one fold than the next and the other. He's gonna try to -- seven things at once and you know. When one of the popping coming folders in America brilliant MIT grad student and Bryan Chan. Has coined the term three step model. For these complex -- this model takes only three steps step one pre craters. That takes about ten dollars to step to collapse. That's the one step that brings all these hundreds and old together -- And then step three shape which does the kind of final refined. And turns it so he says it's only three steps but in fact that second step is where hundreds of increases come together once that's really hard takes hours."

" I mean basically soon. We forget there's a laser cutter behind me you use that for. Marking paper for scoring paper for cutting paper. And indeed on having a vision as. Zepa on the shelf there you know when you say pre -- talking about. All the radius is that remark on that in the very very very specific person those races and then. What happens next to me because if -- to nearly a division of sort of holding all of these creases get a close friends or somebody does nobody has in the hands. Danielle is now kind of thing to have you people want steps because it's located -- the -- than a full the other the other way than a full though on the -- but it's -- some of the objects are creating. It all kind of comes together war."

" It does and you very rapidly run out of fingers so when -- one of these these pots for example. I will after I get this chord pattern out of lasers -- first go through and and pinch each pulled individually Pinchot in the place and then unfold one at a time. Plugged in that every. Folds of the adage fool has a little bit of a memory. Of the direction that it's supposed ago. But then I try to bring them all together. And it's quite a challenge because there are many more creases and I -- fingers and so while sort of gathering wrapped my arms around it. Trying to pinch hit and try to get each pulled. Become a little bit further together. Com and be kind of struggling with this thing that's trying to unfold. And so forth. For you know maybe for half an hour. And I were good news clip paper clips -- strips of drafting table all sorts of things just just to constrain the Holden places that I can't reach. Until I get all the folds in place I -- it is great mental image of."

" 42 astronauts bringing around in giant for now lenses are folding and out but you can't really -- with extra astronauts for -- put these hinges or how they actually. You know you're gonna -- of his has the football fields and it may be a ten foot cylinder when he puts on there."

" Yet and it's gonna go -- unmanned. Spacecraft so you won't even have any astronauts to something like that -- to actual weight entirely on its own. And rely on a very small number of physical mechanisms and the little more telescope. Was able to make use spin stabilization -- would be spun at a fairly slow rate and do we get the centrifugal force would provide forced it open and out. But it's still needed the -- relations between decreases so that if one part of it was opening now all the other parts would know."

" And the same rates that would open up -- he -- very specific shape that will actually open up everything. You you could have like you know open up flap one than flap to a few minutes. -- centrifugal force is going to drive. Opening and it would essentially here that's exactly right. And in fact if you did have something that says open platform but two. 34 on up to a hundred you would need a separate actuators. For each of those openings and so that's a whole little mechanical assembly. It has the potential to fail and if anyone of them failed. It wouldn't work so for or you really want something itself working. So for origami engineering the brute force approach is -- have an -- everything in the elegant approach is to have everything itself actually myself. Single outside force exactly. I want to see me design something that's."

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" As -- earlier you make it's on the -- stick for your life you're gonna break it down into a bunch of different supplies reach. Arm leg head on whether. So the challenge is how to get a bunch of flaps. From a single sheet of paper. And I want to show what it takes -- starting simple let's start with if I want to make just a single flap -- of paper seismic how to do that square. What way is I just make this -- over -- for the half. Folded in half again. If that's narrower. Pulled it again and say okay that's too. That's my lap and I want it as long as my finger -- that's the boundaries. Of so now I've made one like this is this paper is flap and all this is leftover. No question is how much paper went into the plot what part of the square -- The final folders. You can see. Here this is the boundary of the plot so everything inside the boundary McCain -- and a quarter circle. Everything outside left over. It's -- instead of starting from the corner. If I did the same thing from the edge. Went through the same procedures. -- the single flap. There's my flat same size and links and -- here's my boundary. And unfolded. Now how much paper. When I think that's significantly -- of sound but it's a half circle Brett and -- really it's the circle is pulling from the and you can do probably take my word for that the question of from the middle of the -- you know I can trust him so. Flaps no matter where plot comes from and it uses part of a circle. In fact you can even say it it always takes a whole circle but that's circle can overlap the paper so here's the full circle. There's a full circle in the middle circle so I can make any -- from a circular region paper. How I make multiple spots. He has multiple circles so. That's how I can design we're gonna shake if this is my square and let's say I wanted to make. A human being. Five flaps two legs two arms and head. I don't need five circles. And -- there's a body so that needs to be a gap between the arms and head. And legs so he needed gap between the -- circles -- circles so I can solve that. By finding an arrangement of circles. --"

" me."

" It's I'm just drawing it sloppily here. But let's say he's in my circles. Well I've got -- circles for legs. To circles for arms head and I body in between. Now. And then life wherever circles touch it turns out. There are out there creases in between. So now if if I. Instead of drawing these roughly if I drew them very precisely how accomplice and so forth I could draw this pattern and that would give me the arrangement not just of circles. But this skeleton of the overall Kris because I know the typical head comes from here. Tip of the arms come from there the typically it's come from there so like either very carefully get out my circle template and draw this or. I can use computer program to do much faster. And that's the -- right now."

" So I wrote this computer program called Treo maker that that solves this problem. And here's the windows this is a square of paper and let's say I want to make that human being launched from -- holds that here."

" So the years ahead there's two arms. There's. The body. And others. Lex. And so here so here's head arms body legs and it's already thrown circles -- to represent each plot but there's a little tiny circles. Full length of a flop as only the size of the circle so. Only a tiny amount of paper is going into each leg arm head it's not being used very efficiently. I should be able to make those circles much larger which could make the -- much larger. And tree maker lets me do that automatically -- of the steps. Is what's called scale everything. Basically it says make it as large as possible. And so that's what it's done so now this arrangements pretty close to what I injured his head arms. Here's a gap here for the body and for the Olympics. And once you have that circle arrangement. All the -- union are already mathematically determined we just need to. To plop them in according to some rules that we worked out and tree maker has those rules built. Again it's -- can help to build decreased pattern. And that's what it does near the red lines of blue lines are. Our our before the lines on which we fold. And now there's -- this is very cluttered because I've got here original stick figure behind its all stretched out I've got these circles. My got some lines that. Really don't mean anything with -- just break it up and appalling violence but if we say take away everything and just leave the fold lines. We can do that. And different view witches. Creases Q and those are the actual full lines -- print this out. I could fold on these lines. The salt mines around folds the dashed lines are valid holds and that will give me. Client side to change I've seen it five flat shape. This to stick figure than I originally started. And if I want to. Not actually print this out but I want to figure out where these lines go on some -- machine taken ownership of origami paper. And -- I can also. Get the coordinates of all these points. And take a chain and then go measure okay I come over one unit and point 83 units that's where this and point is. And find increases."

" Put those traces on the paper."

" That gives me my change. -- I get is just stick figures so you won't have a round head -- human being has around him but once I have that stick figure. I can manipulate it further and yet and turn it into what it's supposed to look like and while it's a pretty simple example. A little more complicated examples. -- here this is actually the output of one of these designs and it's the base for beetle. So here's the -- the abdomen of The Beatles the thorax they had. I've designed to to have antenna -- antenna. And black people six legs short front legs medium middle legs. Long -- And this technique -- ideas of using circle pattern in this type of design. Revolutionized. Origami. When they started being used in the -- at -- time."

" Insects because of their long legs and lots of them. We're fond of hasn't hasn't. Impossible certainly the hardest things in their old books from the seventies that say it's not possible to do. A grasshopper from single square because you can't get all legs programs and square. But this now this probably bothered you could -- it -- because I wanted to do grasshoppers. But now you can not only do. -- that you can specify the actual species. That you want. That's pretty means. During the nineties there was. There was little competition in formal competition. Called about wars. And -- and it was this. People trying to want to be each other insects so someone would say I've done needle. Next -- but I'm gonna top that I have done -- With intent. The first guy came next time I see him -- and deal with antenna enjoy laws. Well then an antenna would be -- Jones and wings. Well you know outstretched -- mobile -- jaws and tennis and wings horns and and colored wings and and then strike since off on the winds and you know it. And if they wanna -- strips -- spots freedom patterns on the paper average amount -- and actually create that holds that create that as an example."

" This is this is the tiger. Design and you see he's got strikes on. And those stripes are not painted on that comes. From the other side of the paper paper sold around one side and white on the other in fact this is before the strikes are created. You've got all these little extra flaps. And if you pull those flaps down and spread the layers. You end up getting stripes running on the tail. Does this is not the sort of thing you're creating -- maker. Actually. This is exactly tree maker does really. But I had to read this ask myself. -- gonna get those stripes I'm gonna get those strikes. By creating a whole bunch of little lapse so the stick figure. For this tiger had a definitive had a bunch of little extra flops."

" Which would be used to create distractions how big sheet of paper does that start out -- This is not too bad this guy started from a sheet of paper that's probably about this. Men eighteen inches through -- yet he can it's how big issue paper and the cream from from. Being crane. Which has about 48 inch wingspan came about six foot sheet of paper. And that too. Was a it started as a tree maker design and then refined a little bit me I added some additional changes that. Can't be described by -- computer has the advantage of forty years of folding. After that the the idea is run far ahead of what's possible in program so. There concepts and techniques. That are always going to be advanced beyond what I can put into computer. As that it has retired about subtleties are we talking about art. It's really it's because it's a complete. Who we are talking about art com and their artistic ideas that can't be. Described how rhythmically. But even among the concepts that could potentially described -- rhythmically the progression. Is -- first you have to understand the concept. In your mind. Then you have to be able to describe it mathematically. And only then continue. Such remind figuring out how to describe it computational. There's always a timeline in progression. So I will use a technique in my designing that I understand in my mind but I don't yet know the mathematical words that describe. So what are the next big challenges was what are what are -- talked about the bug hours. You know what what what are the challenges right now where we're -- origami really pushing forward. It's pushing in many directions at once so it's it's not a Linear progression it's a radial expansion. Following. Various Independent threads so let me just pick a couple of those radio -- out one. Topic the ones that are most interest in me. One is human figures. Human figure is. One of the hardest. To create. In any artistic medium because our ally is so attuned. To imperfections and subtleties most Oregon human figures come now. Cartoonish. And and look -- so it's there's a huge challenge in developing techniques that allow -- to express the subtlety beauty. Of human form. Another very different path is. Is creating purely geometric an abstract or -- Most origami historically was representational. It -- likes. Me convert. A fish. Person. But there is a vast world of origami that doesn't look like anything that is simply -- people pattern just as there is abstract art. And people are only. Now beginning to explorer. The richness of structure than is possible in this abstract type of work."

" Started out for template spot they're really pick of the week this week. Frankenstein there have been dozens of versions of the story but we're talking about the 1936 classic story the legendary Boris Karloff. Let me tell you this story this man's side of the monsters angry -- this thirty classic is a must see movies to edit your Netflix queue for right now and while you're there don't forget to check out give it 99999. Titles Netflix has to offer including all the way to think -- releases. You are bound to find any -- your TV show you're looking for and with forty shootings that are almost all the everything happening in a single business day you don't the thing for the shipping plans start at four dollars and 99 cents for your system you're so we've got to hook up for you get a free trial today by signing up at www. Netflix got complex."

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" So we want to get involved is obviously sort of the classic you know -- remembered from fourth grade paper folding books they're everywhere. Nobody wants to sort of take the next step or or or start the the idea in transit them of creating their own designs when you recommend people start. I would recommend that they start first. By folding existing designs that that are published in books because that. That builds just an intuitive understanding of how paper response to manipulation it's possible. It's did it pretty difficult to dive straight into design having never touched sheet of paper but almost everyone. They -- everything from books they're ready for the next thing and at that point. There are there are avenues to progress to it to go down two to design what is. I wrote a book. With the 586 pages called origami design secrets. Which brings together in one place. A very large number of techniques for help -- things like. The circle -- Ways of breaking down. The subject hereafter in the building blocks that you can individually. Addressed as building blocks and then put all those ideas together into this square. There are also. Origami conventions there's a big win every year in New York it's the largest origami convention in the world. Where the newest design ideas are displayed where there are classes. Going where people can learn. The newest concepts. And concepts that they can then take away and trying to build on in their own creation. Soon. We talked about the Livermore telescope you mentioned airbags are there any engineering schools that are actively teaching origami -- part of good product design packaging would it fit under. It could -- a couple areas that definitely could fit under product is and packaging and you'll see in a lot of industrial engineering classes that they will touch wrongful. Trees particularly in the area packages packages. Holding the president decide luxury box building machines -- you know is when that was incorporated holding. But there is not specific. Curriculum. Of Oregon and in fact I've I have I've been requested. To put together curriculum. Four -- it from my home monitor. Cal tech but it probably going to be a couple of years before. Get around that the closest thing is it's now been talked for couple years is a computational geometry class. And MIT professor Erik and I mean. McArthur genius fellowship winner. And one of the real. Leaders in the computational geometry mathematics -- me. -- a book. About how rhythms for -- and and all of the related fields and he's taught class now I think for a couple of years on specifically. Algorithms for folding. So that's probably the closest thing to curriculum. Oregon and now that you're obsessive Oregon and had for mathematics and MIT."

" something this is actually."

" This is it pretty quick it's area case like I'm doing. -- commission. So just came up it was going fairly simple design because. I happen pulled a lot of them Finland's. So this kinda like doesn't. Famous. Birthdays. And those pointed divert from the that's that's a fairly new stuff. Called spread -- So here it is and it's fine."

" It's trick is it expensive I think of mathematical I think of giant expensive program. Mac medic is an expensive program period there's not some giant and it's definitely not expensive it's free you can download it from our website. Www. -- origami dot com that runs on Mac Linux and windows just click on the link and download it. Read documentation. Please and you -- If you haven't checked it out go there immediately -- oriented economy is an ink. Credible collection of -- created by Robert Howard thank you so much for taking time for us today the very welcome. So just yeah."

" But the moment but what of our sponsors in -- exact -- This is the number one site for Independent music we're going to have to billion songs and you can do little -- three cents per track. Does -- partner with the music creating handpicked -- of my favorite songs available what you music dot com. Once a month I give you play list you can check that -- easy time making music that complex systems. Actually with the individual tracks from the sample each one now to sweeten the pot he needed to offer you 53 songs to your system viewers this could he be back complex system and sign up for a free trial. The tracks are yours for ever you don't -- and no weird format they're MP3 pretty good resolution and the play and just about any -- players -- that could create -- music check out the music that complex system. Support us by supporting our sponsors. -- really want to take a moment thanks Robert -- again for taking time out to talk to us and sharing the secrets of his work it's incredible stuff if you haven't checked out his website -- dot com -- believe what he people. I was single sheet of paper and has always. Do not forget to check out our archive for victory dot com slash system. Thank you -- Ellis that would love to hear from its system at least dot com and don't forget to catch this week's popSiren. It is behind you get below them all the cool stuff happening let people know culture. A little pop a little music school kids redefining culture every Thursday at 3 PM eastern Pacific and be sure to check out popSiren advice. Smaller -- of -- popSiren content every Monday Tuesday Wednesday and Friday to be entertained all week long at tip of the steps that system. Still next time I'm Patrick Norton."

" War. Today's episode system is sponsored by go to daddy. Netflix. And it turns out. Quite a bit from the way digital camera lenses collapse to putting communications and telescopes satellites in this space. This is origami in the 21 century coming up on today's system. There's a laser described reverse side of what we're not gonna be making any project cases here are not going to be cutting in a plastic we're gonna be talking about. Folding paper. Why you care well because it's actually the cutting edge of engineering right now whether we're talking about space where the air bags in your car let's think most talked to proper line. But origami an -- marching quite happily the 21 century. To. Did you find you've you've you've."

" You translating or on the problems in the map did you find any applicable fields. To the dead -- do -- well and or that they still alive which yes we're still alive because some of them half. That applies to origami is actually very recent -- touches on a lot of different fields in math. Graph theory group theory lots of countering some intrigue that even. Things you learn in high school are applicable to origami but one of the fields that has had the biggest impact. On origami is a relatively young field called computational geometry. As fields only about thirty years old so and it's the studying. Specifically. Algorithms and data structures. How you do things with the computer. And it's. How a lot of effect on what's possible in Oregon. When I wrote my program that design or program called Treo maker one of the key steps. Was figuring out. Optimal arrangement. Of hacking. Circles into a square box the packaging problem. And that problem turned out to be of the type whose mathematical name is nonlinear constrained optimization. And not only how that already been solved and I could use the solution that was out there in the literature. But it is a problem that is the subject of continuous study and so as the computational geometry there is find. Better ways of solving that constrained optimization I can make use of their results and improve. My origami is musings that it's so with tree maker mean do you manner in other -- there's a -- walking on here. Show over there you actually. You know do you design -- that phone tree maker will be primarily -- I primarily use it for insects not so for things that are kind of stick like. On so you know insects or. Use it for birds if you imagine a bird is a stick figure sticks for wings. Legs -- Anything that you can be represented moralists a stick figure. I can -- tree maker to design. And in fact -- the mathematical name for the stick figure that contains no loops is tree. And that's where an -- maker Cisco -- does this is -- a decision tree here but if you the you know it's a graph theory tree. So if you can draw a stick figure of the subject. Then tree maker takes that's it you're you're actually draw on the computer screens -- it takes that's it in here. Figures out. What are -- circles that represent and stick figure fine is the solution packing and then finds the creases. That will fold the square. Into that exact stick figure. So -- in this giant sort of mathematical formula which represents the series of falls on a sheet of paper to create something like this does -- you two the seeking new directions when you end up with Libya is. I never see and anyone who uses cream maker never sees the giant mathematical formula there is a mathematical formula buried. Inside the program and it's it's enormously complex any. Given model involves the solution maybe a hundred or 200 equations but the beauty as we don't seem -- All we need to see is the actual pattern holds. And and there are you can look at here's all the clues there this is a valley -- that way as a mountain forty here goes this way. And so you can take that holding pattern. And just work from the holding pattern. And almost magically. It works out to give you all the parts that you need. To me the subject whether it's something representational. Line beetle. Or something more abstract. Like the pattern for flattening an -- So when your time about it is is that -- pattern that comes and that's that would. -- origami some mean things always been when you when you're researching ways that decrease pattern in the order increase patterns. Always seem to come up is these decrease pattern itself the order of the folds -- the primary part of the problem. -- pattern isn't the order in fact it's almost an Independent part the -- pattern is a map of all the folds. And then a distinct question is what quarter do you make. Those holds it how would you number those produces 16. And one of the big huge surprises that came about when people started designing models by creating -- patterns. Was the realization. That sometimes. You can't break it down into a distinct order that the only way. To make this origami model was to bring all the creases together wants really -- the situation first arrived people thought. You're gonna designers are just ladies -- fairly easily -- come up with a folding sequence. But then when we started looking at the problem mathematically we realized. That. When you go directly to decrease pattern it often turns out that all increases their inner related in such a way. That you can't separate. This is a legitimate use -- term you're reducing complexity. A well I can you relate if if the -- is -- the other thing I can think of place where that might be an advantage if you trying to. Constrained to the you talked about it let us like a giant for no plans for the war. And -- it would seem like constraining it or having to have it all work at the same time would prevent maybe one part for hanging off on the wrong direction or that's absolutely right. In scientific applications that property of having all the creases in a related that the whole thing moves as one. Is a plus because if you making an antenna you want it to move it very controlled way. If if it has multiple degrees of freedom it could happen that as one part unfolds it -- means another part. And it actually happened about twenty years ago with Galileo spacecraft. Loops and that that the main antenna got snagged him and couldn't open. And cripple the mission. So you want everything to open together in close up to him. And that's the property. That that is often the case in the -- patterns as -- it's. But in representational -- people would like to do it one that the time is or -- it is very sort of it's Japanese in the process step by step it's -- everything's kind of the key ceremony and it's easy. I don't look at so much ceremonial it's just easier if you can go one fold than the next and the other. He's gonna try to -- seven things at once and you know. When one of the popping coming folders in America brilliant MIT grad student and Bryan Chan. Has coined the term three step model. For these complex -- this model takes only three steps step one pre craters. That takes about ten dollars to step to collapse. That's the one step that brings all these hundreds and old together -- And then step three shape which does the kind of final refined. And turns it so he says it's only three steps but in fact that second step is where hundreds of increases come together once that's really hard takes hours."

" I mean basically soon. We forget there's a laser cutter behind me you use that for. Marking paper for scoring paper for cutting paper. And indeed on having a vision as. Zepa on the shelf there you know when you say pre -- talking about. All the radius is that remark on that in the very very very specific person those races and then. What happens next to me because if -- to nearly a division of sort of holding all of these creases get a close friends or somebody does nobody has in the hands. Danielle is now kind of thing to have you people want steps because it's located -- the -- than a full the other the other way than a full though on the -- but it's -- some of the objects are creating. It all kind of comes together war."

" It does and you very rapidly run out of fingers so when -- one of these these pots for example. I will after I get this chord pattern out of lasers -- first go through and and pinch each pulled individually Pinchot in the place and then unfold one at a time. Plugged in that every. Folds of the adage fool has a little bit of a memory. Of the direction that it's supposed ago. But then I try to bring them all together. And it's quite a challenge because there are many more creases and I -- fingers and so while sort of gathering wrapped my arms around it. Trying to pinch hit and try to get each pulled. Become a little bit further together. Com and be kind of struggling with this thing that's trying to unfold. And so forth. For you know maybe for half an hour. And I were good news clip paper clips -- strips of drafting table all sorts of things just just to constrain the Holden places that I can't reach. Until I get all the folds in place I -- it is great mental image of."

" 42 astronauts bringing around in giant for now lenses are folding and out but you can't really -- with extra astronauts for -- put these hinges or how they actually. You know you're gonna -- of his has the football fields and it may be a ten foot cylinder when he puts on there."

" Yet and it's gonna go -- unmanned. Spacecraft so you won't even have any astronauts to something like that -- to actual weight entirely on its own. And rely on a very small number of physical mechanisms and the little more telescope. Was able to make use spin stabilization -- would be spun at a fairly slow rate and do we get the centrifugal force would provide forced it open and out. But it's still needed the -- relations between decreases so that if one part of it was opening now all the other parts would know."

" And the same rates that would open up -- he -- very specific shape that will actually open up everything. You you could have like you know open up flap one than flap to a few minutes. -- centrifugal force is going to drive. Opening and it would essentially here that's exactly right. And in fact if you did have something that says open platform but two. 34 on up to a hundred you would need a separate actuators. For each of those openings and so that's a whole little mechanical assembly. It has the potential to fail and if anyone of them failed. It wouldn't work so for or you really want something itself working. So for origami engineering the brute force approach is -- have an -- everything in the elegant approach is to have everything itself actually myself. Single outside force exactly. I want to see me design something that's."

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" As -- earlier you make it's on the -- stick for your life you're gonna break it down into a bunch of different supplies reach. Arm leg head on whether. So the challenge is how to get a bunch of flaps. From a single sheet of paper. And I want to show what it takes -- starting simple let's start with if I want to make just a single flap -- of paper seismic how to do that square. What way is I just make this -- over -- for the half. Folded in half again. If that's narrower. Pulled it again and say okay that's too. That's my lap and I want it as long as my finger -- that's the boundaries. Of so now I've made one like this is this paper is flap and all this is leftover. No question is how much paper went into the plot what part of the square -- The final folders. You can see. Here this is the boundary of the plot so everything inside the boundary McCain -- and a quarter circle. Everything outside left over. It's -- instead of starting from the corner. If I did the same thing from the edge. Went through the same procedures. -- the single flap. There's my flat same size and links and -- here's my boundary. And unfolded. Now how much paper. When I think that's significantly -- of sound but it's a half circle Brett and -- really it's the circle is pulling from the and you can do probably take my word for that the question of from the middle of the -- you know I can trust him so. Flaps no matter where plot comes from and it uses part of a circle. In fact you can even say it it always takes a whole circle but that's circle can overlap the paper so here's the full circle. There's a full circle in the middle circle so I can make any -- from a circular region paper. How I make multiple spots. He has multiple circles so. That's how I can design we're gonna shake if this is my square and let's say I wanted to make. A human being. Five flaps two legs two arms and head. I don't need five circles. And -- there's a body so that needs to be a gap between the arms and head. And legs so he needed gap between the -- circles -- circles so I can solve that. By finding an arrangement of circles. --"

" me."

" It's I'm just drawing it sloppily here. But let's say he's in my circles. Well I've got -- circles for legs. To circles for arms head and I body in between. Now. And then life wherever circles touch it turns out. There are out there creases in between. So now if if I. Instead of drawing these roughly if I drew them very precisely how accomplice and so forth I could draw this pattern and that would give me the arrangement not just of circles. But this skeleton of the overall Kris because I know the typical head comes from here. Tip of the arms come from there the typically it's come from there so like either very carefully get out my circle template and draw this or. I can use computer program to do much faster. And that's the -- right now."

" So I wrote this computer program called Treo maker that that solves this problem. And here's the windows this is a square of paper and let's say I want to make that human being launched from -- holds that here."

" So the years ahead there's two arms. There's. The body. And others. Lex. And so here so here's head arms body legs and it's already thrown circles -- to represent each plot but there's a little tiny circles. Full length of a flop as only the size of the circle so. Only a tiny amount of paper is going into each leg arm head it's not being used very efficiently. I should be able to make those circles much larger which could make the -- much larger. And tree maker lets me do that automatically -- of the steps. Is what's called scale everything. Basically it says make it as large as possible. And so that's what it's done so now this arrangements pretty close to what I injured his head arms. Here's a gap here for the body and for the Olympics. And once you have that circle arrangement. All the -- union are already mathematically determined we just need to. To plop them in according to some rules that we worked out and tree maker has those rules built. Again it's -- can help to build decreased pattern. And that's what it does near the red lines of blue lines are. Our our before the lines on which we fold. And now there's -- this is very cluttered because I've got here original stick figure behind its all stretched out I've got these circles. My got some lines that. Really don't mean anything with -- just break it up and appalling violence but if we say take away everything and just leave the fold lines. We can do that. And different view witches. Creases Q and those are the actual full lines -- print this out. I could fold on these lines. The salt mines around folds the dashed lines are valid holds and that will give me. Client side to change I've seen it five flat shape. This to stick figure than I originally started. And if I want to. Not actually print this out but I want to figure out where these lines go on some -- machine taken ownership of origami paper. And -- I can also. Get the coordinates of all these points. And take a chain and then go measure okay I come over one unit and point 83 units that's where this and point is. And find increases."

" Put those traces on the paper."

" That gives me my change. -- I get is just stick figures so you won't have a round head -- human being has around him but once I have that stick figure. I can manipulate it further and yet and turn it into what it's supposed to look like and while it's a pretty simple example. A little more complicated examples. -- here this is actually the output of one of these designs and it's the base for beetle. So here's the -- the abdomen of The Beatles the thorax they had. I've designed to to have antenna -- antenna. And black people six legs short front legs medium middle legs. Long -- And this technique -- ideas of using circle pattern in this type of design. Revolutionized. Origami. When they started being used in the -- at -- time."

" Insects because of their long legs and lots of them. We're fond of hasn't hasn't. Impossible certainly the hardest things in their old books from the seventies that say it's not possible to do. A grasshopper from single square because you can't get all legs programs and square. But this now this probably bothered you could -- it -- because I wanted to do grasshoppers. But now you can not only do. -- that you can specify the actual species. That you want. That's pretty means. During the nineties there was. There was little competition in formal competition. Called about wars. And -- and it was this. People trying to want to be each other insects so someone would say I've done needle. Next -- but I'm gonna top that I have done -- With intent. The first guy came next time I see him -- and deal with antenna enjoy laws. Well then an antenna would be -- Jones and wings. Well you know outstretched -- mobile -- jaws and tennis and wings horns and and colored wings and and then strike since off on the winds and you know it. And if they wanna -- strips -- spots freedom patterns on the paper average amount -- and actually create that holds that create that as an example."

" This is this is the tiger. Design and you see he's got strikes on. And those stripes are not painted on that comes. From the other side of the paper paper sold around one side and white on the other in fact this is before the strikes are created. You've got all these little extra flaps. And if you pull those flaps down and spread the layers. You end up getting stripes running on the tail. Does this is not the sort of thing you're creating -- maker. Actually. This is exactly tree maker does really. But I had to read this ask myself. -- gonna get those stripes I'm gonna get those strikes. By creating a whole bunch of little lapse so the stick figure. For this tiger had a definitive had a bunch of little extra flops."

" Which would be used to create distractions how big sheet of paper does that start out -- This is not too bad this guy started from a sheet of paper that's probably about this. Men eighteen inches through -- yet he can it's how big issue paper and the cream from from. Being crane. Which has about 48 inch wingspan came about six foot sheet of paper. And that too. Was a it started as a tree maker design and then refined a little bit me I added some additional changes that. Can't be described by -- computer has the advantage of forty years of folding. After that the the idea is run far ahead of what's possible in program so. There concepts and techniques. That are always going to be advanced beyond what I can put into computer. As that it has retired about subtleties are we talking about art. It's really it's because it's a complete. Who we are talking about art com and their artistic ideas that can't be. Described how rhythmically. But even among the concepts that could potentially described -- rhythmically the progression. Is -- first you have to understand the concept. In your mind. Then you have to be able to describe it mathematically. And only then continue. Such remind figuring out how to describe it computational. There's always a timeline in progression. So I will use a technique in my designing that I understand in my mind but I don't yet know the mathematical words that describe. So what are the next big challenges was what are what are -- talked about the bug hours. You know what what what are the challenges right now where we're -- origami really pushing forward. It's pushing in many directions at once so it's it's not a Linear progression it's a radial expansion. Following. Various Independent threads so let me just pick a couple of those radio -- out one. Topic the ones that are most interest in me. One is human figures. Human figure is. One of the hardest. To create. In any artistic medium because our ally is so attuned. To imperfections and subtleties most Oregon human figures come now. Cartoonish. And and look -- so it's there's a huge challenge in developing techniques that allow -- to express the subtlety beauty. Of human form. Another very different path is. Is creating purely geometric an abstract or -- Most origami historically was representational. It -- likes. Me convert. A fish. Person. But there is a vast world of origami that doesn't look like anything that is simply -- people pattern just as there is abstract art. And people are only. Now beginning to explorer. The richness of structure than is possible in this abstract type of work."

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" So we want to get involved is obviously sort of the classic you know -- remembered from fourth grade paper folding books they're everywhere. Nobody wants to sort of take the next step or or or start the the idea in transit them of creating their own designs when you recommend people start. I would recommend that they start first. By folding existing designs that that are published in books because that. That builds just an intuitive understanding of how paper response to manipulation it's possible. It's did it pretty difficult to dive straight into design having never touched sheet of paper but almost everyone. They -- everything from books they're ready for the next thing and at that point. There are there are avenues to progress to it to go down two to design what is. I wrote a book. With the 586 pages called origami design secrets. Which brings together in one place. A very large number of techniques for help -- things like. The circle -- Ways of breaking down. The subject hereafter in the building blocks that you can individually. Addressed as building blocks and then put all those ideas together into this square. There are also. Origami conventions there's a big win every year in New York it's the largest origami convention in the world. Where the newest design ideas are displayed where there are classes. Going where people can learn. The newest concepts. And concepts that they can then take away and trying to build on in their own creation. Soon. We talked about the Livermore telescope you mentioned airbags are there any engineering schools that are actively teaching origami -- part of good product design packaging would it fit under. It could -- a couple areas that definitely could fit under product is and packaging and you'll see in a lot of industrial engineering classes that they will touch wrongful. Trees particularly in the area packages packages. Holding the president decide luxury box building machines -- you know is when that was incorporated holding. But there is not specific. Curriculum. Of Oregon and in fact I've I have I've been requested. To put together curriculum. Four -- it from my home monitor. Cal tech but it probably going to be a couple of years before. Get around that the closest thing is it's now been talked for couple years is a computational geometry class. And MIT professor Erik and I mean. McArthur genius fellowship winner. And one of the real. Leaders in the computational geometry mathematics -- me. -- a book. About how rhythms for -- and and all of the related fields and he's taught class now I think for a couple of years on specifically. Algorithms for folding. So that's probably the closest thing to curriculum. Oregon and now that you're obsessive Oregon and had for mathematics and MIT."

" something this is actually."

" This is it pretty quick it's area case like I'm doing. -- commission. So just came up it was going fairly simple design because. I happen pulled a lot of them Finland's. So this kinda like doesn't. Famous. Birthdays. And those pointed divert from the that's that's a fairly new stuff. Called spread -- So here it is and it's fine."

" It's trick is it expensive I think of mathematical I think of giant expensive program. Mac medic is an expensive program period there's not some giant and it's definitely not expensive it's free you can download it from our website. Www. -- origami dot com that runs on Mac Linux and windows just click on the link and download it. Read documentation. Please and you -- If you haven't checked it out go there immediately -- oriented economy is an ink. Credible collection of -- created by Robert Howard thank you so much for taking time for us today the very welcome. So just yeah."

" But the moment but what of our sponsors in -- exact -- This is the number one site for Independent music we're going to have to billion songs and you can do little -- three cents per track. Does -- partner with the music creating handpicked -- of my favorite songs available what you music dot com. Once a month I give you play list you can check that -- easy time making music that complex systems. Actually with the individual tracks from the sample each one now to sweeten the pot he needed to offer you 53 songs to your system viewers this could he be back complex system and sign up for a free trial. The tracks are yours for ever you don't -- and no weird format they're MP3 pretty good resolution and the play and just about any -- players -- that could create -- music check out the music that complex system. Support us by supporting our sponsors. -- really want to take a moment thanks Robert -- again for taking time out to talk to us and sharing the secrets of his work it's incredible stuff if you haven't checked out his website -- dot com -- believe what he people. I was single sheet of paper and has always. Do not forget to check out our archive for victory dot com slash system. Thank you -- Ellis that would love to hear from its system at least dot com and don't forget to catch this week's popSiren. It is behind you get below them all the cool stuff happening let people know culture. A little pop a little music school kids redefining culture every Thursday at 3 PM eastern Pacific and be sure to check out popSiren advice. Smaller -- of -- popSiren content every Monday Tuesday Wednesday and Friday to be entertained all week long at tip of the steps that system. Still next time I'm Patrick Norton."